Homage to the Blessed One, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Enlightened One

In the Minor Collection

The Questions of Milinda

1.

2. This is as it has been heard – There is a city of the Greeks named Sāgala, a trading centre of various goods, adorned by rivers and mountains, with a delightful region of land, endowed with parks, pleasure groves, forests, lakes and lotus ponds, charming with rivers, mountains and forests, built by the learned, with enemies destroyed, unopressed by adversaries, with various variegated strong watchtowers and porches, with excellent and noble gateways and arched entrances, with an inner palace surrounded by deep moats and white walls. With well-arranged streets, courtyards, crossroads and junctions, with well-displayed shops filled with various kinds of excellent goods, adorned with hundreds of various alms-halls, decorated with hundreds of thousands of excellent mansions resembling the peaks of snow-capped mountains, crowded with elephants, horses, chariots and infantry, frequented by groups of handsome men and women, teeming with people and humans, with many warriors, brahmins, merchants and workers, joined together with various assemblies of ascetics and brahmins, long frequented by men of many kinds of knowledge, endowed with shops of various kinds of cloth such as Kāsi cloth and Koṭumbara cloth and so on, with well-displayed shops of beautiful flowers and perfumes of many kinds, fragrant with scents, filled with many desirable jewels, with shops well-displayed facing all directions, frequented by groups of traders in ornaments, full of coins, silver, gold, bronze and stone slabs, a dwelling place of shining treasures, with abundant wealth, grain, riches and provisions, with full treasuries and storehouses, with abundant food and drink, with many kinds of hard food, soft food, food to be licked, food to be drunk and food to be tasted, resembling Uttarakuru, with successful crops, like Āḷakamandā, the city of the gods.

Standing here, their former action should be told, and in telling it should be told having divided it sixfold. As follows – The Former Connection, the Questions of Milinda, the Questions on Characteristics, the Dilemma Questions, the Questions on Inference, and the Questions on Simile Discussions.

Therein, the Questions of Milinda are twofold: the Questions on Characteristics and the Questions on Cutting off Doubt. The Dilemma Questions are also twofold: the Great Chapter and the Questions on Yogic Discussions.

"Former Connection" means their former action.

1.

The Secular Narrative

The Former Connection and so on

3. In the past, it is said, when the Dispensation of the Blessed One Kassapa was existing, a great community of monks was dwelling in a single residence near the Ganges. There, monks accomplished in duty and morality, having risen right early, having taken stick-brooms, reflecting on the virtues of the Buddha, having swept the courtyard, would make a rubbish cul-de-sac. Then one monk said to a novice: "Come, novice, throw away this rubbish." He went as if not hearing. For the second time also, etc. For the third time also, being addressed, he went just as if not hearing. Then that monk, angry, thinking "This novice is indeed difficult to admonish," gave a blow with the broom-stick. Then he, weeping, out of fear, while throwing away the rubbish, made the first aspiration: "By this meritorious action of throwing away rubbish, until I attain Nibbāna, in whatever place I am reborn, may I be influential and of great radiance like the midday sun." Having thrown away the rubbish, having gone to the Ganges landing place for the purpose of bathing, having seen the force of the waves of the Ganges roaring, he made the second aspiration: "Until I attain Nibbāna, in whatever place I am reborn, may I have spontaneous discernment like this force of waves, inexhaustible discernment."

That monk too, having placed the broom in the broom-shed, while going to the Ganges landing place for the purpose of bathing, having heard the novice's aspiration, having thought: "Even this one who was urged by me aspires thus; why would it not succeed for me?" made the aspiration: "Until I attain Nibbāna, in whatever place I am reborn, may I have inexhaustible discernment like this force of the Ganges waves; by this may I be able to unravel and explain all discernment in answering whatever questions are asked."

Both of them, wandering in the round of rebirths among gods and human beings, spent one interval between Buddhas. Then by our Blessed One also, just as the Elder Moggaliputtatissa is seen, so these too are seen: "After five hundred years have passed from my final Nibbāna, these will arise. The Teaching and discipline that was taught by me in a subtle way, these will analyse, having made it disentangled and cleared of thickets, by means of questioning, similes, and logical reasoning" - thus they were pointed out.

4. Among them, the novice was a king named Milinda in the city of Sāgala in the Indian subcontinent, wise, experienced, intelligent, competent in the functions of the arrangements of spells and meditation regarding the past, future, and present, acting considerately at the time of action, and many treatises had been learnt by him. As follows: the Vedas, convention, arithmetic, meditation, law, the Vaiśeṣika, courtesans, the gandhabbas, medical treatment, archery, the ancient texts, history, astrology, magic, banners, consultation, warfare, prosody - with the word of the Buddha, nineteen; a sophist, difficult to approach, difficult to overcome, he is declared the foremost among the various founders of sects; in the whole Indian subcontinent there was no one equal to King Milinda, that is to say, in strength, in speed, in valour, in wisdom; wealthy, of great riches, of great possessions, with infinite forces and vehicles.

5. Then one day King Milinda, wishing to see the massing of the army with infinite forces and vehicles, the fourfold army with troops in array, having gone out from the city, having inspected the army factors outside the city and having reminded them, that king - a debater in useless talk, skilled in worldly knowledge and sophistry, floating in conversation with people, with curiosity of mind, confident, stretching himself - having looked at the sun, addressed his ministers: "My good men, there is still much of the day remaining, what shall we do? Having entered the city just now, is there any wise person, whether ascetic or brahmin, one who has a following, one who has a group, a teacher of a group, even one claiming to be a Worthy One, a perfectly Self-awakened One, who is able to converse with me, to remove uncertainty? Having approached him, we shall ask questions, we shall remove uncertainty."

When this was said, five hundred Greeks said this to King Milinda: "There are, great king, six teachers: Pūraṇa Kassapa, Makkhali Gosāla, Nigaṇṭha Nāṭaputta, Sañjaya Belaṭṭhaputta, Ajita Kesakambala, Pakudha Kaccāyana. They have followings, they have groups, they are teachers of groups, well-known, famous, founders of sects, highly honoured by many people. Go, great king, ask them questions, remove uncertainty."

6. Then King Milinda, surrounded by five hundred Greeks, having mounted an auspicious vehicle, an excellent chariot, approached Pūraṇa Kassapa; having approached, he exchanged friendly greetings with Pūraṇa Kassapa, and having concluded the pleasant and memorable talk, he sat down to one side. Seated to one side, King Milinda said this to Pūraṇa Kassapa: "Who, Venerable Kassapa, protects the world?" "The earth, great king, protects the world." "If, Venerable Kassapa, the earth protects the world, then why do beings going to the Avīci hell go having passed beyond the earth?" When this was said, Pūraṇa Kassapa was indeed not able to swallow it down, nor was he able to spit it out; he sat with face cast down, with drooping shoulders, silent, brooding.

7. Then King Milinda said this to Makkhali Gosāla: "Are there, Venerable Gosāla, wholesome and unwholesome actions, is there result and consequence of well-done and wrongly-done actions?" "There is not, great king, wholesome and unwholesome actions, there is not result and consequence of well-done and wrongly-done actions. Those, great king, who are warriors in this world, having gone to the world beyond, they will again become just warriors; those who are brahmins, merchants, workers, outcasts, refuse-removers, having gone to the world beyond, they will again become just brahmins, merchants, workers, outcasts, refuse-removers. What is the use of wholesome and unwholesome actions?" "If, Venerable Gosāla, warriors, brahmins, merchants, workers, outcasts, refuse-removers in this world, having gone to the world beyond, will again become just warriors, brahmins, merchants, workers, outcasts, refuse-removers, there is nothing to be done by wholesome and unwholesome actions. If so, Venerable Gosāla, those who have had their hands cut off in this world, having gone to the world beyond, will again become just ones with cut off hands. Those who have had their feet cut off will become just ones with cut off feet. Those who have had their hands and feet cut off will become just ones with cut off hands and feet. Those who have had their ears cut off will become just ones with cut off ears. Those who have had their noses cut off will become just ones with cut off noses. Those who have had their ears and noses cut off will become just ones with cut off ears and noses." When this was said, Gosāla remained silent.

Then this occurred to King Milinda: "Hollow indeed, friends, is the Indian subcontinent, chaff indeed, friends, is the Indian subcontinent, there is not any ascetic or brahmin who is able to converse with me, to remove uncertainty."

Then King Milinda addressed his ministers: "How delightful indeed, friends, is this moonlit night, what ascetic or brahmin might we approach today to ask questions, who is able to converse with me, to remove uncertainty?" When this was said, the ministers, remaining silent, stood looking at the king's face.

Now at that time the city of Sāgala had been empty of ascetics, brahmins, householders and wise persons for twelve years; wherever he heard that ascetics, brahmins, householders and wise persons were dwelling, having gone there, the king asked them questions; all of them, being unable to please the king by answering questions, departed to one place or another. Those who did not depart to another direction, all of them remained silent. But the monks mostly went to the Himalayas.

8. Now at that time a hundred million Worthy Ones were dwelling on a protected plateau on the Himalaya mountain. Then the Venerable Assagutta, having heard the word of King Milinda with the divine ear element, having convoked the community of monks at the summit of Yugandhara, asked the monks: "Is there, friends, any monk competent to converse with King Milinda, to remove uncertainty?"

When this was said, the hundred million Worthy Ones remained silent. Asked a second time and a third time, they remained silent. Then the Venerable Assagutta said this to the community of monks: "There is, friends, in the realm of the Thirty-three, to the east of Vejayanta, a mansion named Ketumatī; there dwells a young god named Mahāsena; he is competent to converse with that King Milinda, to remove uncertainty."

Then the hundred million Worthy Ones, having vanished from the Yugandhara mountain, appeared in the realm of the Thirty-three. Sakka, the lord of the gods, saw those monks coming from afar; having seen them, he approached the Venerable Assagutta; having approached, having paid respect to the Venerable Assagutta, he stood to one side. Standing to one side, Sakka, the lord of the gods, said this to the Venerable Assagutta: "A great community of monks, venerable sir, has arrived. I am a monastery attendant for the Community; what is needed, what should be done by me?"

Then the Venerable Assagutta said this to Sakka, the lord of the gods: "There is, great king, in the Indian subcontinent, in the city of Sāgala, a king named Milinda, a sophist, difficult to approach, difficult to overcome, declared the foremost among the various founders of sects; he, having approached the community of monks, having asked questions by way of views and doctrines, harasses the community of monks."

Then Sakka, the lord of the gods, said this to the Venerable Assagutta: "This King Milinda, venerable sir, having passed away from here, was reborn among human beings. There is, venerable sir, in the Ketumatī mansion, a young god named Mahāsena dwelling; he is competent to converse with that King Milinda, to remove uncertainty. We shall request that young god for rebirth in the human world."

Then Sakka, the lord of the gods, having put the community of monks in front, having entered the Ketumatī mansion, having embraced the young god Mahāsena, said this: "The community of monks requests you, dear sir, for rebirth in the human world." "I have no need, venerable sir, for the human world with its abundance of action; the human world is harsh. Right here, venerable sir, in the heavenly world, having become one who is reborn in successively higher realms, I shall attain final Nibbāna." For the second time, etc. For the third time also, requested by Sakka, the lord of the gods, the young god Mahāsena said thus: "I have no need, venerable sir, for the human world with its abundance of action; the human world is harsh. Right here, venerable sir, in the heavenly world, having become one who is reborn in successively higher realms, I shall attain final Nibbāna."

Then the Venerable Assagutta said this to the young god Mahāsena: "Here, dear sir, surveying the world with its gods, apart from you, we do not see anyone else competent to break the argument of King Milinda and to uphold the Dispensation. The community of monks requests you, dear sir; good person, having arisen in the human world, please uphold the Dispensation of the Ten-Powered One." When this was said, the young god Mahāsena, thinking "I indeed shall be competent to break the argument of King Milinda and to uphold the Buddha's Dispensation," having become joyful and delighted, elated and exultant, gave the acknowledgment: "Very well, venerable sir, I shall arise in the human world."

9. Then those monks, having finished that duty in the heavenly world among the gods of the Thirty-three, vanished and appeared on the protected plateau on the Himalaya mountain.

Then the Venerable Assagutta said this to the community of monks: "Is there, friends, any monk in this community of monks who has not come to the assembly?" When this was said, a certain monk said this to the Venerable Assagutta: "There is, venerable sir, the Venerable Rohaṇa who, seven days ago, having entered the Himalaya mountain, has attained cessation; send a messenger to his presence." The Venerable Rohaṇa also, at that very moment, having emerged from cessation, thinking "The Community is waiting for me," vanished from the Himalaya mountain and appeared on the protected plateau before the hundred million Worthy Ones.

Then the Venerable Assagutta said this to the Venerable Rohaṇa: "Why indeed, friend Rohaṇa, when the Buddha's Dispensation is being split, do you not see the duties of the Community?" "There was inattention on my part, venerable sir."

"If so, friend Rohaṇa, perform a punishment." "What, venerable sir, should I do?" "There is, friend Rohaṇa, on the slope of the Himalaya mountain, a brahmin village named Gajaṅgala; there dwells a brahmin named Soṇuttara; a son will be born to him, a boy named Nāgasena. Therefore you, friend Rohaṇa, for seven years and ten months, having entered that family for almsfood, having brought out the boy Nāgasena, give him the going forth; when he has gone forth, you will be released from that punishment." The Venerable Rohaṇa also received it saying "Good!"

10. The young god Mahāsena also, having fallen away from the heavenly world, took conception in the womb of the wife of the brahmin Soṇuttara; together with the taking of conception, three wonderful and marvellous phenomena appeared: weapons blazed forth, the finest crops were produced, a great shower rained down. The Venerable Rohaṇa also, from the time of that taking of conception, for seven years and ten months, entering that family for almsfood, did not obtain even for one day a ladleful of food or a measure of rice gruel or paying respect or salutation with joined palms or doing the proper duties; rather he received only reviling and abuse; there was not even anyone to say "Please pass by, venerable sir"; but after the elapse of seven years and ten months, one day he obtained just the words "Please pass by, venerable sir." On that very day, the brahmin also, coming from his work outside, having seen the elder on the opposite path, said: "What, my dear one gone forth, did you go to our house?" "Yes, brahmin, we went." "Did you obtain anything?" "Yes, brahmin, we obtained." He, displeased, having gone home, asked: "Did you give anything to that one gone forth?" "We gave nothing." The brahmin, on the second day, sat right at the house door, thinking: "Today I shall refute the one gone forth by means of lying." The elder, on the second day, arrived at the brahmin's house door.

The brahmin, having seen the elder, said thus: "You, yesterday, not having obtained anything at our house, said 'we obtained'; is lying proper for you?" The elder said: "We, brahmin, at your house, for seven years and ten months, not having obtained even the mere words 'please pass by', yesterday we obtained the mere words 'please pass by'; therefore, with reference to this verbal acknowledgement, we spoke thus."

The brahmin thought: "These, having obtained even just a verbal acknowledgement, praise saying 'we obtained' in the midst of people; having obtained some other solid food or soft food, why would they not praise?" Having become confident, he had a ladleful of almsfood given from the food prepared for his own use, and curry suitable for it, and said: "You will obtain this almsfood at all times."

He, from the next day onwards, having seen the peace of the elder who was approaching, having become even more confident, requested the elder to take meals at his own house constantly. The elder, having consented by silence, day after day, having done the meal duty, while going, having spoken a little of the Buddha's teaching, goes. That brahmin woman also, after the elapse of ten months, gave birth to a son; they named him "Nāgasena"; he, growing up gradually, became seven years old.

11. Then the father of the boy Nāgasena said this to the boy Nāgasena: "In this brahmin family, dear Nāgasena, you should train in the trainings." "Which, dear father, are the trainings in this brahmin family?" "The three Vedas, dear Nāgasena, are called the trainings; the remaining crafts are called craft." "If so, dear father, I shall train."

Then the brahmin Soṇuttara, having given a thousand as the teacher's share to the teacher brahmin, having prepared a small bed together in one inner room inside the mansion, said this to the teacher brahmin: "Teach this boy the sacred hymns, brahmin. If so, 'dear boy', learn the sacred hymns." The teacher brahmin recited; for the boy Nāgasena, by just one recitation, the three Vedas were taken to heart, learnt by heart, well considered, well established, well attended to; at once vision arose in the three Vedas together with their vocabularies and rituals, with phonology and etymology, with the histories as a fifth; he was learned in verse, a grammarian, fully versed in worldly knowledge and the marks of a great man.

Then the boy Nāgasena said this to his father: "Is there, dear father, in this brahmin family anything further to be trained in beyond this, or is it just this much?" "There is not, dear Nāgasena, in this brahmin family anything further to be trained in beyond this; just this much is to be trained in."

Then the boy Nāgasena, having given a reply to the teacher, having descended from the mansion, with his heart stirred by former impressions, gone to a private place, in seclusion, examining the beginning, middle, and end of his own craft, not seeing even a little substance in the beginning or in the middle or in the end, became remorseful and displeased: "Hollow indeed, friends, are these Vedas, chaff indeed, friends, are these Vedas, without substance, unsubstantial."

12. Now at that time the Venerable Rohaṇa, seated in a lodging on the road, having known with his mind the reflection in the mind of the boy Nāgasena, having dressed, taking his bowl and robe, vanished from the lodging on the road and appeared before the brahmin village of Gajaṅgala. The boy Nāgasena, standing at his own gateway, saw the Venerable Rohaṇa coming from afar; having seen him, delighted, elated, greatly pleased, filled with joy and happiness, thinking "Perhaps this one who has gone forth might know something of substance," he approached the Venerable Rohaṇa; having approached, he said this to the Venerable Rohaṇa: "Who indeed are you, sir, such a shaven-headed one clothed in ochre robes?" "I am called one who has gone forth, child." "By what, sir, are you called one who has gone forth?" "One drives away evil stains, therefore I am called one who has gone forth, child." "Why, sir, is your hair not like that of others?" "Having seen these sixteen impediments, child, having shaved off hair and beard, I have gone forth. "Which sixteen?" "The impediment of ornamentation, the impediment of adornment, the impediment of anointing with oil, the impediment of washing, the impediment of garlands, the impediment of scents, the impediment of perfuming, the impediment of yellow myrobalan, the impediment of emblic myrobalan, the impediment of dyeing, the impediment of binding, the impediment of combing, the impediment of the barber, the impediment of disentangling, the impediment of lice; when hair is cut off, they grieve, they are wearied, they lament, they beat their breasts and cry out, they fall into confusion. Entangled in these sixteen impediments, child, people destroy all the most subtle crafts." "Why, sir, are your clothes also not like those of others?" "Clothes are dependent on sensuality, child; the goods and marks of a householder are dependent on sensuality. Whatever fears arise from clothes, those do not exist for one clothed in ochre robes; therefore my clothes also are not like those of others." "Do you know crafts, sir?" "Yes, child, I know crafts; that which is the highest sacred hymn in the world, that too I know." "Is it possible to give that to me also, sir?" "Yes, child, it is possible." "Then give it to me." "It is not the right time, child; we have entered an inhabited area for almsfood."

Then the boy Nāgasena, having taken the bowl from the hand of the Venerable Rohaṇa, having brought him into the house, having satisfied and served the Venerable Rohaṇa with his own hand with superior solid and soft food, said this to the Venerable Rohaṇa when he had finished eating and had removed his hand from the bowl: "Give me now, sir, the sacred hymn." "When you, child, having become free from impediments, having obtained permission from your mother and father, will take the appearance of one gone forth that was taken by me, then I will give it," he said.

Then the boy Nāgasena, having approached his mother and father, said: "Mother and father, this one who has gone forth says 'I know that which is the highest sacred hymn in the world,' but he does not give it to one who has not gone forth in his presence. I, having gone forth in his presence, will learn that highest sacred hymn." Then his mother and father, thinking "Let our son, even having gone forth, learn the sacred hymn; having learnt it, he will come back again," gave permission saying "Take it, son."

13. Then the Venerable Rohaṇa, taking the boy Nāgasena, approached the lodging on the road, approached the Vijambha site; having approached, having stayed one night at the lodging at the Vijambha site, he approached the protected plateau; having approached, he gave the going forth to the boy Nāgasena in the midst of a hundred million Worthy Ones. And when the Venerable Nāgasena had gone forth, he said this to the Venerable Rohaṇa: "Your appearance has been taken by me, venerable sir; now give me the sacred hymn." Then the Venerable Rohaṇa, having thought: "In what should I first train Nāgasena - in the monastic discipline or in the discourses or in the higher teaching?" thinking: "This Nāgasena is wise; he is able to learn the higher teaching easily," first trained him in the higher teaching.

And the Venerable Nāgasena, having made familiar by just one recitation all that Canon of the Higher Teaching - the Compendium of Mental States adorned with triads and dyads: "wholesome mental states, unwholesome mental states, indeterminate mental states"; the Book of Analysis adorned with eighteen analyses beginning with the analysis of aggregates; the Treatise on Elements divided in fourteen ways beginning with "inclusion, non-inclusion"; the Designation of Human Types divided in six ways beginning with "description of aggregates, description of sense bases"; the Points of Controversy divided by combining a thousand discourses - five hundred discourses in one's own doctrine and five hundred discourses in others' doctrines; the Book of Pairs divided in ten ways beginning with "the Root Pairs, the Aggregate Pairs"; the Book of Conditional Relations divided in twenty-four ways beginning with "root condition, object condition" - said: "Stop, venerable sir, do not reinstate further; with just this much I shall recite."

14. Then the Venerable Nāgasena approached the hundred million Worthy Ones; having approached, he said this to the hundred million Worthy Ones: "I, venerable sir, having put into these three terms - 'wholesome mental states, unwholesome mental states, indeterminate mental states' - will reinstate all that Canon of the Higher Teaching in detail." "Good, Nāgasena, reinstate it."

Then the Venerable Nāgasena reinstated the seven treatises in detail for seven months; the earth resounded, the deities gave applause, the Brahmā gods clapped their hands, divine sandalwood powder and divine mandārava flowers rained down.

15. Then a hundred million Worthy Ones gave full ordination to the Venerable Nāgasena, who had completed twenty years, on the protected plateau. And when the Venerable Nāgasena had been fully ordained, after that night had passed, having dressed in the earlier period of the day, taking his bowl and robe, while entering the village for almsfood together with his preceptor, he produced this reflection: "Hollow indeed is my preceptor, foolish indeed is my preceptor, setting aside the remaining word of the Buddha, he first trained me in the higher teaching."

Then the Venerable Rohaṇa, having known with his mind the reflection in the mind of the Venerable Nāgasena, said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "You have reflected an unsuitable reflection, Nāgasena; this indeed, Nāgasena, is not suitable for you."

Then this occurred to the Venerable Nāgasena: "Wonderful indeed, friend, marvellous indeed, friend, inasmuch as my preceptor will know the reflection in my mind with his mind; wise indeed is my preceptor; what if I were to ask forgiveness of my preceptor." Then the Venerable Nāgasena said this to the Venerable Rohaṇa: "Forgive me, venerable sir, I shall not reflect thus again."

Then the Venerable Rohaṇa said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "I do not forgive you, Nāgasena, to that extent. There is, Nāgasena, a city named Sāgala; there a king named Milinda exercises kingship; he, having asked questions by way of views and doctrines, harasses the community of monks. If you, having gone there, having tamed that king, will inspire confidence in the Buddha's Dispensation, thus I shall forgive you."

"Let alone, venerable sir, the one King Milinda; if, venerable sir, all the kings in the whole Indian subcontinent, having come, were to ask me questions, having answered all that, I shall make them understand." Having said "Forgive me, venerable sir," when it was said "I do not forgive," he said "If so, venerable sir, in whose presence shall I reside for these three months?" "This, Nāgasena, the Venerable Assagutta dwells in a lodging on the road. Go, Nāgasena, approach the Venerable Assagutta; having approached, in my name pay respect with your head at the feet of the Venerable Assagutta, and say thus to him: 'My preceptor, venerable sir, pays respect with his head at your feet, and asks about your health, whether you are free from illness, free from affliction, light in rising, strong, and dwelling in comfort; my preceptor, venerable sir, has sent me to reside in your presence for these three months.' When it is said 'What is your preceptor's name?' you should say 'The Elder Rohaṇa by name, venerable sir.' When it is said 'What is my name?' you should say thus: 'My preceptor, venerable sir, knows your name.'" "Yes, venerable sir," the Venerable Nāgasena, having paid respect to the Venerable Rohaṇa, having circumambulated him keeping him on his right, taking his bowl and robe, wandering on a journey gradually, approached the lodging on the road, approached the Venerable Assagutta; having approached, having paid respect to the Venerable Assagutta, he stood to one side. Standing to one side, the Venerable Nāgasena said this to the Venerable Assagutta: "My preceptor, venerable sir, pays respect with his head at your feet, and says thus: he asks about your health, whether you are free from illness, free from affliction, light in rising, strong, and dwelling in comfort; my preceptor, venerable sir, has sent me to reside in your presence for these three months."

Then the Venerable Assagutta said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "What is your name?" "I, venerable sir, am named Nāgasena." "What is your preceptor's name?" "My preceptor, venerable sir, is named Rohaṇa." "What is my name?" "My preceptor, venerable sir, knows your name."

"Good, Nāgasena, put away your bowl and robe." "Good, venerable sir," having put away his bowl and robe, on the following day, having swept the residential cell, he set out water for washing the face and a tooth-bangle. The elder swept again the place that had been swept, having thrown away that water he brought other water, and having removed that wooden toothbrush he took another wooden toothbrush; he did not engage in conversation. Having done thus for seven days, on the seventh day, having asked again, when he said the same thing again, he allowed the rains residence.

16. Now at that time a certain great female lay follower had attended upon the Venerable Assagutta for about thirty years. Then that great female lay follower, after the elapse of three months, approached the Venerable Assagutta; having approached, she said this to the Venerable Assagutta: "Is there indeed, dear father, another monk in your presence?" "There is, great female lay follower, a monk named Nāgasena in our presence." "If so, dear father Assagutta, consent to a meal for tomorrow together with Nāgasena." The Venerable Assagutta consented by silence.

Then the Venerable Assagutta, after that night had passed, having dressed in the earlier period of the day, taking his bowl and robe, together with the Venerable Nāgasena as his attendant monk, approached the dwelling of the great female lay follower; having approached, he sat down on the prepared seat. Then that great female lay follower with her own hand satisfied and served the Venerable Assagutta and the Venerable Nāgasena with superior solid and soft food. Then the Venerable Assagutta said this to the Venerable Nāgasena when he had finished eating and had removed his hand from the bowl: "You, Nāgasena, give thanksgiving to the great female lay follower." Having said this, he rose from his seat and departed.

Then that great female lay follower said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "I am old, dear son Nāgasena; give me thanksgiving with a profound talk on the Teaching." Then the Venerable Nāgasena gave thanksgiving to that great female lay follower with a profound talk on the Teaching, supramundane, connected with emptiness. Then in that great female lay follower, in that very seat, the stainless, spotless eye of the Teaching arose: "Whatever has the nature of arising, all that has the nature of cessation." And the Venerable Nāgasena too, having given thanksgiving to that great female lay follower, reviewing the Teaching taught by himself, having established insight, seated in that very seat, became established in the fruition of stream-entry.

Then the Venerable Assagutta, seated in the circular pavilion, having known the attainment of the eye of the Teaching by both, uttered applause: "Good, good, Nāgasena! By one arrow-strike two great bodies have been destroyed." And many thousands of deities uttered applause.

17. Then the Venerable Nāgasena, having risen from his seat, approached the Venerable Assagutta; having approached, having paid respect to the Venerable Assagutta, he sat down to one side. To the Venerable Nāgasena seated to one side, the Venerable Assagutta said this: "Go, Nāgasena, to Pāṭaliputta; in the city of Pāṭaliputta, in the Asoka park, the Venerable Dhammarakkhita dwells; learn thoroughly the Buddha's teaching in his presence." "How far, venerable sir, is the city of Pāṭaliputta from here?" "A hundred yojanas, Nāgasena." "The road is far, venerable sir. Almsfood is difficult to obtain on the way; how shall I go?" "Go, Nāgasena; on the way you will obtain almsfood - rice of fine grain with the dark grains removed, with various curries and various vegetables." "Yes, venerable sir," the Venerable Nāgasena, having paid respect to the Venerable Assagutta, having circumambulated him keeping him on his right, taking his bowl and robe, set out on a journey towards Pāṭaliputta.

18. Now at that time the millionaire of Pāṭaliputta was travelling on the road leading to Pāṭaliputta with five hundred carts. The millionaire of Pāṭaliputta saw the Venerable Nāgasena coming from afar; having seen him, he approached the Venerable Nāgasena; having approached, having paid respect to the Venerable Nāgasena, he said: "Where are you going, dear son?" "To Pāṭaliputta, householder." "Good, dear son, we too are going to Pāṭaliputta. Travel comfortably together with us."

Then the millionaire of Pāṭaliputta, having become confident in the Venerable Nāgasena's deportment, having satisfied and served the Venerable Nāgasena with his own hand with superior solid and soft food, when the Venerable Nāgasena had finished eating and had removed his hand from the bowl, having taken a certain low seat, sat down to one side. Seated to one side, the millionaire of Pāṭaliputta said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "What is your name, dear son?" "I, householder, am named Nāgasena." "Do you know the Buddha's teaching, dear son?" "I know, householder, the terms of the higher teaching." "It is a gain for us, dear son, it is well gained for us, dear son. I too, dear son, am one versed in the higher teaching, and you too are one versed in the higher teaching. Speak, dear son, the terms of the higher teaching." Then the Venerable Nāgasena taught the higher teaching to the millionaire of Pāṭaliputta; while he was teaching, in the millionaire of Pāṭaliputta the stainless, spotless eye of the Teaching arose: "Whatever has the nature of arising, all that has the nature of cessation."

Then the millionaire of Pāṭaliputta, having sent ahead about five hundred carts, himself going behind, standing at a crossroads not far from Pāṭaliputta, said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "This, dear Nāgasena, is the road to the Asoka park. This, dear son, is our woollen blanket jewel, sixteen cubits in length, eight cubits in breadth. Please accept, dear son, this woollen blanket jewel out of compassion." The Venerable Nāgasena accepted that woollen blanket jewel out of compassion. Then the millionaire of Pāṭaliputta, delighted, elated, greatly pleased, filled with joy and happiness, having paid respect to the Venerable Nāgasena, having circumambulated him keeping him on his right, departed.

19. Then the Venerable Nāgasena approached the Asoka park where the Venerable Dhammarakkhita was; having approached, having paid respect to the Venerable Dhammarakkhita, having told the reason for his coming, in the presence of the Venerable Dhammarakkhita, having learnt thoroughly the three Canons of the Buddha's teaching by phrasing in just one recitation in three months, again in three months he attended to it by meaning.

Then the Venerable Dhammarakkhita said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "Just as, Nāgasena, a cowherd guards the cattle, others consume the dairy products. Just so indeed, you, Nāgasena, even while bearing the three Canons of the Buddha's teaching, are not a partaker of asceticism." "Let it be, venerable sir, enough with this much." In that very daytime, in that night-time, together with the analytical knowledges he attained arahantship; together with the penetration of truth, all the gods gave applause to the Venerable Nāgasena, the earth resounded, the Brahmā gods clapped their hands, divine sandalwood powder and divine mandārava flowers rained down.

20. Now at that time a hundred million Worthy Ones, having assembled on a protected plateau on the Himalaya mountain, sent a messenger to the presence of the Venerable Nāgasena: "Let Nāgasena come, we wish to see Nāgasena." Then the Venerable Nāgasena, having heard the word of the messenger, vanished from the Asoka park and appeared on the protected plateau on the Himalaya mountain before the hundred million Worthy Ones.

Then the hundred million Worthy Ones said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "This King Milinda, Nāgasena, harasses the community of monks by argument and counter-argument, by asking questions. Good, Nāgasena, go and tame King Milinda." "Let alone, venerable sir, the one King Milinda; if, venerable sir, all the kings in the whole Indian subcontinent, having come, were to ask me questions, having answered all that, I shall make them understand. Go, venerable sirs, without fear to the city of Sāgala." Then the elder monks made the city of Sāgala radiant with orange robes, with the coming and going of sages.

21. Now at that time the Venerable Āyupāla was dwelling in the Saṅkhyeyya residential cell. Then King Milinda said this to his ministers: "How delightful indeed, friends, is this moonlit night, what ascetic or brahmin might we approach today for discussion and questioning, who is able to converse with me, to remove uncertainty?" When this was said, five hundred Greeks said this to King Milinda: "There is, great king, an elder named Āyupāla, a master of the three Canons, very learned, one who has learnt the collections; he is now dwelling in the Saṅkhyeyya residential cell; go, great king, ask the Venerable Āyupāla questions." "If so, my good men, inform the venerable sir."

Then the fortune-teller sent a messenger to the presence of the Venerable Āyupāla: "The king, venerable sir, Milinda, wishes to see the Venerable Āyupāla." The Venerable Āyupāla also said thus: "Then let him come." Then King Milinda, surrounded by about five hundred Greeks, having mounted an excellent chariot, approached the Saṅkhyeyya residential cell, approached the Venerable Āyupāla; having approached, he exchanged friendly greetings with the Venerable Āyupāla, and having concluded the pleasant and memorable talk, he sat down to one side. Seated to one side, King Milinda said this to the Venerable Āyupāla: "For what purpose, Venerable Āyupāla, is your going forth, and what is your ultimate goal?" The elder said: "For the purpose of practising righteousness and practising evenness, great king, is the going forth; the fruit of asceticism is our ultimate goal." "But, venerable sir, is there any householder also who practises righteousness and practises evenness?" "Yes, great king, there is a householder also who practises righteousness and practises evenness. When the Blessed One, great king, was setting in motion the wheel of the Teaching at Isipatana in the Deer Park at Bārāṇasī, there was the full realization of the teaching for eighteen koṭis of Brahmās; but the full realization of the teaching by the deities passed beyond the path of counting; all of them were householders, not gone forth.

"Furthermore, great king, when the Great Assembly Discourse was being taught by the Blessed One, when the Great Blessing Discourse was being taught, when the Discourse on the Exposition of Even-mindedness was being taught, when the Discourse on the Exhortation to Rāhula was being taught, when the Discourse on Downfall was being taught, there was the full realization of the teaching by deities who had passed beyond the path of counting; all of them were householders, not gone forth." "If so, Venerable Āyupāla, your going forth is purposeless; as an outcome of evil action done before, ascetics who are disciples of the Sakyan go forth and undertake the ascetic practices. Those monks, Venerable Āyupāla, who are one-session eaters, surely they were formerly thieves who took away others' possessions; having taken by force others' possessions, as an outcome of that action, they now become one-session eaters, they do not obtain to consume from time to time; there is no morality for them, there is no austere asceticism, there is no holy life. But those monks, Venerable Āyupāla, who are dwellers in the open air, surely they were formerly thieves who sacked villages; having destroyed others' houses, as an outcome of that action, they now become dwellers in the open air, they do not obtain to use lodgings; there is no morality for them, there is no austere asceticism, there is no holy life. But those monks, Venerable Āyupāla, who remain in a sitting position, surely they were formerly thieves who corrupted the roads; having seized, bound, and made to sit down others' travellers, as an outcome of that action, they now remain in a sitting position, they do not obtain to prepare a sleeping place; there is no morality for them, there is no austere asceticism, there is no holy life," he said.

When this was said, the Venerable Āyupāla remained silent, he did not reply anything. Then five hundred Greeks said this to King Milinda: "The elder is wise, great king, but he is unconfident and does not reply anything."

Then King Milinda, having seen the Venerable Āyupāla silent, having clapped his hands and made an acclamation, said this to the Greeks: "Hollow indeed, friends, is the Indian subcontinent, chaff indeed, friends, is the Indian subcontinent; there is not any ascetic or brahmin who is able to converse with me, to remove uncertainty."

22. Then King Milinda, surveying all that assembly, having seen the Greeks fearless and unabashed, this occurred to him: "Without doubt, methinks, there is some other wise monk who is able to converse with me, by which these Greeks are not abashed." Then King Milinda said this to the Greeks: "Is there, my good men, any other wise monk who is able to converse with me, to remove uncertainty?"

Now at that time the Venerable Nāgasena, surrounded by a group of ascetics, one who has a Community, one who has a following, a teacher of a group, well-known, famous, highly honoured by many people, wise, experienced, intelligent, subtle, discerning, intelligent, disciplined, confident, very learned, a master of the three Canons, one who has attained the highest knowledge, of penetrating higher intelligence, one who has learnt the collections, of penetrating analytical knowledge, a bearer of the Scriptures in the ninefold teaching of the Teacher, having attained perfection in the word of the Conqueror, skilled in the penetration of the Teaching of meaning and teaching, of inexhaustible and varied discernment, a varied speaker, of good conversation, difficult to approach, difficult to overcome, difficult to cross, difficult to obstruct, difficult to restrain, imperturbable like the ocean, motionless like the king of mountains, one who abandons conflict, a dispeller of darkness, a light-bringer, a great speaker, a crusher of the groups of other followers, a crusher of other sectarians, honoured, respected, revered, venerated, and esteemed by monks, nuns, male lay followers, female lay followers, kings, and royal ministers, an obtainer of the requisites of robes, almsfood, lodging, and medicine for the sick, having attained the highest gain and the highest fame, illuminating the ninefold jewel of the Conqueror's Dispensation to elders, wise persons, and those endowed with giving ear, pointing out the path of the Teaching, holding the lamp of the Teaching, raising the post of the Teaching, sacrificing the sacrifice of the Teaching, upholding the banner of the Teaching, raising the flag of the Teaching, blowing the conch of the Teaching, beating the drum of the Teaching, roaring the lion's roar, thundering the thunder of Indra, satisfying the whole world with the great cloud of the nectar of the Teaching, filled with the water of compassion, enveloped by the net of lightning of excellent knowledge, with the sweet thunder of speech, wandering on a journey through villages, market towns, and royal cities, gradually arrived at the city of Sāgala. There the Venerable Nāgasena, together with eighty thousand monks, was dwelling in the Saṅkhyeyya residential cell. Therefore the ancients said:

23. Then Devamantiya said this to King Milinda: "Wait, great king; there is, great king, an elder named Nāgasena, wise, experienced, intelligent, disciplined, confident, very learned, a varied speaker, of good discernment, having attained perfection in the analytical knowledges of meaning, Teaching, language, and discernment; he is now dwelling in the Saṅkhyeyya residential cell. Go, great king, ask the Venerable Nāgasena questions; he is able to converse with you, to remove uncertainty." Then for King Milinda, suddenly upon hearing the sound "Nāgasena," there arose fear, there arose trepidation, there arose terror. Then King Milinda said this to Devamantiya: "Is the monk Nāgasena, friend, able to converse with me?" "He is able, great king, even to converse with Indra, Yama, Varuṇa, Kuvera, Pajāpati, the Suyāma gods, the Santusita gods, the world-guardians, and even with the Great Brahmā, the father and grandfather; how much more then with one who has become a human being."

Then King Milinda said this to Devamantiya: "If so, you, Devamantiya, send a messenger to the presence of the venerable sir." "Yes, Sire," Devamantiya sent a messenger to the presence of the Venerable Nāgasena: "The king, venerable sir, Milinda, wishes to see the venerable one." And the Venerable Nāgasena said thus: "Then let him come."

Then King Milinda, surrounded by about five hundred Greeks, having mounted an excellent chariot, together with a great army, approached the Saṅkhyeyya residential cell, approached the Venerable Nāgasena. Now at that time the Venerable Nāgasena was seated in the circular pavilion together with eighty thousand monks. King Milinda saw the assembly of the Venerable Nāgasena from afar; having seen it, he said this to Devamantiya: "Whose is this great assembly, Devamantiya?" "It is the assembly of the Venerable Nāgasena, great king."

Then for King Milinda, having seen the assembly of the Venerable Nāgasena from afar, there arose fear, there arose trepidation, there arose terror. Then King Milinda, like an elephant surrounded by swords, like a serpent surrounded by garuḷas, like a jackal surrounded by pythons, like a bear surrounded by buffaloes, like a frog pursued by a serpent, like a deer pursued by a leopard, like a snake that has encountered a snake-catcher, like a rat that has encountered a cat, like a goblin that has encountered an exorcist, like the moon gone into the mouth of Rāhu, like a snake gone into a basket, like a bird gone into a cage, like a fish gone into a net, like a man who has entered a forest of wild beasts, like a demon who has offended Vessavaṇa, like a young god whose life span is exhausted - frightened, agitated, fearful, alarmed, with hair standing on end, displeased, unhappy, with confused mind, with changed disposition - having established mindfulness thinking "May this retinue not despise me," said this to Devamantiya: "Do not, Devamantiya, point out the Venerable Nāgasena to me; I shall know Nāgasena without being told." "Good, great king, you yourself know."

Now at that time the Venerable Nāgasena was junior to forty thousand monks in front of that assembly of monks, and senior to forty thousand monks behind.

Then King Milinda, surveying all that community of monks in front and behind and in the middle, saw the Venerable Nāgasena from afar, seated in the middle of the community of monks, like a maned lion, free from fear and dread, free from terror, free from fear and timidity; having seen him, he knew by his appearance alone: "This one here is Nāgasena."

Then King Milinda said this to Devamantiya: "This, Devamantiya, is the Venerable Nāgasena." "Yes, great king, this is Nāgasena; well indeed, great king, you have recognised Nāgasena." Then the king was pleased: "Nāgasena has been recognised by me without being told." Then for King Milinda, upon seeing the Venerable Nāgasena, there arose fear, there arose trepidation, there arose terror.

Therefore they said:

The External Discussion is concluded.

2-3.

The Questions of Milinda

1.

The Great Chapter

1.

The Question on Description

1. Then King Milinda approached the Venerable Nāgasena; having approached, he exchanged friendly greetings with the Venerable Nāgasena, and having concluded the pleasant and memorable talk, he sat down to one side. The Venerable Nāgasena also, by his friendly response, pleased the mind of King Milinda. Then King Milinda said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "How are you known, venerable sir? What is your name, venerable sir?" "I am known as 'Nāgasena,' great king; my fellow monks in the holy life address me as 'Nāgasena,' great king. But although mother and father give a name such as 'Nāgasena' or 'Sūrasena' or 'Vīrasena' or 'Sīhasena,' yet, great king, this is only a term, a designation, a description, a conventional expression, a mere name, that is to say, 'Nāgasena'; no person is found here."

Then King Milinda said thus: "Let the venerable five hundred Greeks and eighty thousand monks hear me: this Nāgasena says thus: 'No person is found here.' Is it proper to approve of that?" Then King Milinda said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "If, venerable Nāgasena, no person is found, then who gives you the requisites of robes, almsfood, lodging and medicine for the sick? Who consumes them? Who guards morality? Who devotes himself to meditation? Who realizes the path, the fruition, and Nibbāna? Who kills a living being? Who takes what is not given? Who engages in sexual misconduct? Who speaks falsely? Who drinks intoxicants? Who commits the five heinous actions? Therefore there is no wholesome, there is no unwholesome, there is no doer or causer of wholesome and unwholesome actions, there is no result and consequence of well-done and wrongly-done actions. If, venerable Nāgasena, whoever kills you, there is no killing of a living being for him either. For you too, venerable Nāgasena, there is no teacher, there is no preceptor, there is no full ordination. You say: 'My fellow monks in the holy life address me as Nāgasena, great king.' Which Nāgasena is here? Is the head hair Nāgasena, venerable sir?" "No indeed, great king." "Is the body hair Nāgasena?" "No indeed, great king." "Nails, etc. teeth, etc. skin, etc. having asked for meat, etc. sinews, etc. bones, etc. bone marrow, etc. kidneys, etc. heart, etc. liver, etc. pleura, etc. spleen, etc. lungs, etc. intestines, etc. mesentery, etc. undigested food, etc. excrement, etc. bile, etc. phlegm, etc. pus, etc. blood, etc. sweat, etc. fat, etc. tears, etc. grease, etc. spittle, etc. snot, etc. synovic fluid, etc. urine, etc. Is the brain in the head Nāgasena?" "No indeed, great king." "Is then, venerable sir, matter Nāgasena?" "No indeed, great king." "Is feeling Nāgasena?" "No indeed, great king." "Is perception Nāgasena?" "No indeed, great king." "Are activities Nāgasena?" "No indeed, great king." "Is consciousness Nāgasena?" "No indeed, great king." "Is then, venerable sir, matter, feeling, perception, activities, and consciousness together Nāgasena?" "No indeed, great king." "Is then, venerable sir, something apart from matter, feeling, perception, activities, and consciousness Nāgasena?" "No indeed, great king." "Though I question and question, venerable sir, I do not see Nāgasena. Is then just the sound 'Nāgasena' Nāgasena, venerable sir?" "No indeed, great king." "Then who is Nāgasena here? You speak falsely, venerable sir, you speak a lie; there is no Nāgasena."

Then the Venerable Nāgasena said this to King Milinda: "You, great king, are delicate like a warrior, extremely delicate. For you, great king, at the noon period of the day, having trodden on hot ground, hot sand, rough gravel and pebbles, coming on foot, your feet are hurt, your body becomes weary, your mind is injured, body-consciousness accompanied by pain arises. Did you come on foot or by vehicle?" "I did not come on foot, venerable sir; I came by chariot." "If you, great king, came by chariot, tell me about the chariot. Is the pole the chariot, great king?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Is the axle the chariot?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Are the wheels the chariot?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Is the body of the chariot the chariot?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Is the chariot-rod the chariot?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Is the yoke the chariot?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Are the reins the chariot?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Is the goad-stick the chariot?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Is the pole, axle, wheels, body of the chariot, chariot-rod, yoke, reins and goad the chariot, great king?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But then, great king, is there a chariot apart from the pole, axle, wheels, body of the chariot, chariot-rod, yoke, reins and goad?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Though I am asking and asking, great king, I do not see a chariot. Is the mere sound 'chariot' the chariot, great king?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Then what is the chariot here? You speak falsehood, great king, you speak a lie; there is no chariot. You, great king, are the foremost king in the whole of Jambudīpa; being afraid of whom do you speak a lie? Let the venerable five hundred Greeks and eighty thousand monks hear me: this King Milinda says thus 'I came by chariot'; if you, great king, came by chariot, tell me about the chariot - being told thus, he does not produce a chariot. Is it proper to approve of that?" When this was said, the five hundred Greeks, having given applause to the Venerable Nāgasena, said this to King Milinda: "Now, great king, speak if you are able."

Then King Milinda said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "I do not speak falsely, Venerable Nāgasena; dependent on the pole, dependent on the axle, dependent on the wheels, dependent on the body of the chariot, dependent on the chariot-rod, the term, designation, description, conventional expression, mere name 'chariot' occurs."

"Good indeed, great king, you understand the chariot. Just so indeed, great king, for me too, dependent on the hair of the head, dependent on the body hair, etc. dependent on the brain in the head, dependent on materiality, dependent on feeling, dependent on perception, dependent on activities, dependent on consciousness, the term, designation, description, conventional expression, mere name 'Nāgasena' occurs; but in the ultimate sense, a person is not found here. This too was spoken, great king, by the nun Vajirā in the presence of the Blessed One -

"Wonderful, Venerable Nāgasena, marvellous, Venerable Nāgasena, most variegated discernments of questions have been answered. If the Buddha were standing, he would give applause. Good, good, Nāgasena, most variegated discernments of questions have been answered."

The Question on Description is first.

2.

The Question on Counting the Rains Retreats

2. "How many rains retreats have you, Venerable Nāgasena?" "I have seven rains retreats, great king." "What are these seven, venerable sir - are you seven, or is the counting seven?"

Now at that time, the shadow of King Milinda, adorned with all ornaments, decorated and prepared, was seen on the ground, and the shadow was seen in a water jar. Then the Venerable Nāgasena said this to King Milinda: "This shadow of yours, great king, is seen on the ground and in the water jar. But then, great king, are you the king, or is the shadow the king?" "I, Venerable Nāgasena, am the king; this shadow is not the king, but in dependence on me the shadow occurs." "Just so indeed, great king, the counting of rains retreats is seven, but I am not seven; in dependence on me, seven occurs, like the simile of the shadow, great king." "Wonderful, Venerable Nāgasena, marvellous, Venerable Nāgasena, most variegated discernments of questions have been answered."

The Question on Counting the Rains Retreats is second.

3.

The Question on Investigation

3. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, will you converse with me?" "If you, great king, will converse in the manner of the wise, I will converse; but if you will converse in the manner of kings, I will not converse." "How, venerable Nāgasena, do the wise converse?" "In the conversation of the wise, great king, there is winding up and there is unwinding, there is refutation and there is redress, there is agreement and there is counter-agreement, yet the wise do not become angry on account of that; thus, great king, do the wise converse." "But how, venerable sir, do kings converse?" "Kings, great king, in conversation assert one matter; whoever contradicts that matter, they command punishment for him: 'Decree punishment for this one'; thus, great king, do kings converse." "I will converse in the manner of the wise, venerable sir, not in the manner of kings. Let the venerable one converse freely, just as he converses with a monk or a novice or a lay follower or a monastery attendant; thus freely let the venerable one converse, do not be afraid." "Very well, great king," the elder gave thanks.

The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, I will ask." "Ask, great king." "You have been asked by me, venerable sir." "It has been answered, great king." "But what, venerable sir, has been answered by you?" "But what, great king, has been asked by you?"

The Question on Investigation is third.

4.

The Question on the Infinite Body

4. Then this occurred to King Milinda: "This monk is wise, competent to converse with me, and there will be many points to be asked by me; while those points remain unasked, the sun will set; what if I were to converse tomorrow in the inner palace." Then the king said this to Devamantiya: "If so, you, Devamantiya, should inform the venerable sir: 'Tomorrow there will be a conversation with the king in the inner palace.'" Having said this, King Milinda, having risen from his seat, having asked permission of the elder Nāgasena, having mounted his chariot, departed rehearsing "Nāgasena, Nāgasena."

Then Devamantiya said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "The king, venerable sir, Milinda, says thus: 'Tomorrow there will be a conversation with the king in the inner palace.'" "Very well," the elder gave thanks. Then after that night had passed, Devamantiya and Anantakāya and Maṅkura and Sabbadinna approached King Milinda; having approached, they said this to King Milinda: "Should the venerable Nāgasena come, great king?" "Yes, let him come." "With how many monks should he come?" "With however many monks he wishes, let him come with that many monks."

Then Sabbadinna said: "Let him come, great king, with ten monks." For the second time also the king said: "With however many monks he wishes, let him come with that many monks." For the second time also Sabbadinna said: "Let him come, great king, with ten monks." For the third time also the king said: "With however many monks he wishes, let him come with that many monks." For the third time also Sabbadinna said: "Let him come, great king, with ten monks." "But all this honour has been prepared; I say: 'With however many monks he wishes, let him come with that many monks.' This one, my good Sabbadinna, speaks otherwise; are we not competent to give food to the monks?" When this was said, Sabbadinna became ashamed.

Then Devamantiya and Anantakāya and Maṅkura approached the Venerable Nāgasena; having approached, they said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "The king, venerable sir, Milinda, says thus: 'With however many monks he wishes, let him come with that many monks.'" Then the Venerable Nāgasena, having dressed in the earlier period of the day, taking his bowl and robe, entered Sāgala together with eighty thousand monks.

Then Anantakāya, going in dependence on the Venerable Nāgasena, said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'Nāgasena', which one here is Nāgasena?" The elder said: "But who do you think here is 'Nāgasena'?" "That which, venerable sir, is the wind inside, the soul, that enters and exits, that I think is 'Nāgasena'." "But if that wind, having exited, should not enter, or having entered, should not exit, would that man live?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But those who are conch-blowers, who blow conches, does the wind enter them again?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But those who are flute-blowers, who blow flutes, does the wind enter them again?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But those who are horn-blowers, who blow horns, does the wind enter them again?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Then why do they not die from that?" "I am not competent to converse with you, a debater; please, venerable sir, explain the meaning." "This is not the soul; these are called in-breath and out-breath, bodily activities," the elder spoke a talk on the higher teaching. Then Anantakāya declared his state as a lay follower.

The Question on the Infinite Body is fourth.

5.

The Question on Going Forth

5. Then the Venerable Nāgasena approached the dwelling of King Milinda; having approached, he sat down on the prepared seat. Then King Milinda, with his own hand, satisfied and served the Venerable Nāgasena together with his following with superior solid and soft food, and clothed each and every monk with a suit of garments, and clothed the Venerable Nāgasena with the three robes, and said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "Venerable Nāgasena, please remain here with ten monks; let the rest go."

Then King Milinda, knowing that the Venerable Nāgasena had finished eating and had removed his hand from the bowl, having taken a certain low seat, sat down to one side. Seated to one side, King Milinda said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "Venerable Nāgasena, on what subject shall there be friendly conversation?" "We, great king, are desirous of meaning; let there be friendly conversation on meaning."

The king said: "For what purpose, Venerable Nāgasena, is your going forth, and what is your ultimate goal?" The elder said: "So that, great king, this suffering might cease, and other suffering might not arise. For this purpose, great king, is our going forth; final Nibbāna without clinging is our ultimate goal."

"But, Venerable Nāgasena, do all go forth for this purpose?" "No indeed, great king, some go forth for this purpose, some go forth driven by kings, some go forth driven by thieves, some go forth oppressed by debt, some go forth for the purpose of livelihood; but those who go forth rightly, they go forth for this purpose."

"But you, venerable sir, did you go forth for this purpose?" "I, great king, went forth when young; I did not know 'I am going forth for this particular purpose'; but this occurred to me: 'These ascetics, disciples of the Sakyan, are wise; they will train me.' Having been trained by them, I know and I see: 'For this particular purpose is the going forth.'"

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on Going Forth is fifth.

6.

The Question on Conception

6. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is there anyone who, having died, does not reunite?" The elder said: "Someone reunites, someone does not reunite." "Who reunites, who does not reunite?" "One with mental defilement, great king, reunites; one free from mental defilement does not reunite." "But you, Venerable Nāgasena, will you reunite?" "If, great king, I will be one with clinging, I will reunite; if I will be one without clinging, I will not reunite."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on Conception is sixth.

7.

The Question on Wise Attention

7. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, one who does not reunite, does he not reunite by wise attention?" "By wise attention, great king, and by wisdom and by other wholesome mental states." "Is not, venerable sir, wise attention just wisdom?" "No indeed, great king, attention is one thing, wisdom is another; for these goats, sheep, oxen, buffaloes, camels and donkeys also have attention, but they do not have wisdom."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on Wise Attention is seventh.

8.

The Question on the Characteristic of Attention

8. The king said: "What is the characteristic of attention, Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of wisdom?" "Consideration is the characteristic of attention, great king, cutting is the characteristic of wisdom."

"How is consideration the characteristic of attention, how is cutting the characteristic of wisdom? Give a simile." "Do you know, great king, barley reapers?" "Yes, venerable sir, I know." "How, great king, do barley reapers reap barley?" "Having grasped a sheaf of barley with the left hand, venerable sir, having grasped a sickle with the right hand, they cut with the sickle."

"Just as, great king, a barley reaper, having grasped a sheaf of barley with the left hand, having grasped a sickle with the right hand, cuts the barley, even so, great king, one who practises meditation, having grasped the mind with attention, cuts the defilements with wisdom. Thus, great king, consideration is the characteristic of attention, thus cutting is the characteristic of wisdom."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on the Characteristic of Attention is eighth.

9.

The Question on the Characteristic of Morality

9. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'and by other wholesome mental states', what are those wholesome mental states?" "Morality, great king, faith, energy, mindfulness, concentration - these are those wholesome mental states." "What is the characteristic of morality, venerable sir?" "The characteristic of morality is support, great king, for all wholesome mental states; morality is the support for the faculties, powers, factors of enlightenment, path factors, establishments of mindfulness, right strivings, bases for spiritual power, meditative absorptions, deliverances, concentrations and attainments. Indeed, great king, one who practises meditation, established in morality, in dependence on morality, established upon morality, develops the five faculties - the faith faculty, the energy faculty, the mindfulness faculty, the concentration faculty, the wisdom faculty - and all wholesome mental states do not decline." "Give a simile." "Just as, great king, whatever seed-plants and growing plants attain growth, increase, and expansion, all of them, in dependence on earth, established upon earth, attain growth, increase, and expansion. Just so, great king, one who practises meditation, in dependence on morality, established upon morality, develops the five faculties - the faith faculty, the energy faculty, the mindfulness faculty, the concentration faculty, the wisdom faculty."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, whatever activities requiring strength are done, all of them are done in dependence on earth, established upon earth. Just so, great king, one who practises meditation, in dependence on morality, established upon morality, develops the five faculties - the faith faculty, the energy faculty, the mindfulness faculty, the concentration faculty, the wisdom faculty."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, a city builder, wishing to build a city, first having had the city site cleared, having had stumps and thorns removed, having had the ground made level, then afterwards, having divided it by the demarcation of streets, crossroads, and intersections and so on, builds the city. Just so, great king, one who practises meditation, in dependence on morality, established upon morality, develops the five faculties - the faith faculty, the energy faculty, the mindfulness faculty, the concentration faculty, the wisdom faculty."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, an acrobat, wishing to display his craft, having had the ground dug, having had gravel and potsherds removed, having had the ground made level, displays his craft on soft ground. Just so, great king, one who practises meditation, in dependence on morality, established upon morality, develops the five faculties - the faith faculty, the energy faculty, the mindfulness faculty, the concentration faculty, the wisdom faculty. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One -

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on the Characteristic of Morality is ninth.

10.

The Question on Faith with the Characteristic of Confidence

10. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of faith?" "Faith has the characteristic of placidity, great king, and faith has the characteristic of leaping forward." "How, venerable sir, does faith have the characteristic of placidity?" "Faith, great king, when arising, suppresses the mental hindrances; the mind free from mental hindrances becomes clear, serene, and undisturbed. Thus, great king, faith has the characteristic of placidity."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a wheel-turning monarch, travelling on the highway together with his fourfold army, might cross a small body of water, and that water would become stirred up by elephants, horses, chariots, and infantry - turbid, agitated, and muddy. And having crossed over, the wheel-turning monarch might command the people: 'Bring drinking water, my good men, I will drink,' and the king might have a water-clearing gem. 'Yes, Sire,' those people, having assented to the wheel-turning monarch, would throw that water-clearing gem into the water; as soon as it was thrown into that water, the shells, moss, and water plants would disappear, the mud would settle, and the water would become clear, serene, and undisturbed. Then they would offer drinking water to the wheel-turning monarch: 'Drink, Sire, the drinking water.'

"Just as, great king, the water, so should the mind be seen; just as those people, so should one who practises meditation be seen; just as the shells, moss, water plants, and mud, so should the mental defilements be seen. Just as the water-clearing gem, so should faith be seen; just as when the water-clearing gem is thrown into the water, the shells, moss, and water plants would disappear, the mud would settle, and the water would become clear, serene, and undisturbed, even so, great king, faith when arising suppresses the mental hindrances; the mind free from mental hindrances becomes clear, serene, and undisturbed. Thus, great king, faith has the characteristic of placidity."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on Faith with the Characteristic of Confidence is tenth.

11.

The Question on Faith with the Characteristic of Leaping Forward

11. "How, venerable sir, does faith have the characteristic of leaping forward?" "Just as, great king, one who practises meditation, having seen the liberated mind of others, leaps forward into the fruition of stream-entry or the fruition of once-returning or the fruition of non-returning or arahantship, and makes exertion for the attainment of the unattained, for the achievement of the unachieved, for the realisation of the unrealised. Thus, great king, faith has the characteristic of leaping forward."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a great rain cloud might pour down on the upper mountain, and that water, flowing according to the slope, having filled the mountain grottoes, clefts, and channels, might fill the river, and it might flow overflowing both banks; then a great multitude of people, having come, not knowing the shallowness or depth of that river, might stand frightened and hesitant on the bank; then a certain man, having come, seeing his own strength and power, having tightly bound his loin-cloth, having leaped forward, might cross over; having seen him crossed over, the great multitude of people too might cross over. Even so, great king, one who practises meditation, having seen the liberated mind of others, leaps forward into the fruition of stream-entry or the fruition of once-returning or the fruition of non-returning or arahantship, and makes exertion for the attainment of the unattained, for the achievement of the unachieved, for the realisation of the unrealised. Thus, great king, faith has the characteristic of leaping forward. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One in the excellent Connected Collection:

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on Faith with the Characteristic of Leaping Forward is eleventh.

12.

The Question on the Characteristic of Energy

12. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of energy?" "The characteristic of energy is support, great king; all wholesome mental states supported by energy do not decline."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a man might support a falling house with another piece of timber, and being supported, that house would not fall. Even so, great king, the characteristic of energy is support; all wholesome mental states supported by energy do not decline."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, a great army might defeat a small army, then the king might remind and send reinforcements to one another, and give power step by step to his own small army, and together with that, the small army might defeat the great army. Even so, great king, the characteristic of energy is support; all wholesome mental states supported by energy do not decline. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One - 'The noble disciple with energy, monks, abandons the unwholesome, develops the wholesome. He abandons the blameworthy, develops the blameless. He maintains himself in purity.'"

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on the Characteristic of Energy is twelfth.

13.

The Question on the Characteristic of Mindfulness

13. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of mindfulness?" "Mindfulness has the characteristic of non-floating, great king, and the characteristic of taking up." "How, venerable sir, does mindfulness have the characteristic of non-floating?" "Mindfulness, great king, when arising, keeps afloat mental states that are wholesome and unwholesome, blameworthy and blameless, inferior and superior, dark and bright, and their counterparts: 'These are the four establishments of mindfulness, these are the four right strivings, these are the four bases for spiritual power, these are the five faculties, these are the five powers, these are the seven factors of enlightenment, this is the noble eightfold path, this is serenity, this is insight, this is true knowledge, this is liberation.' Thereupon one who practises meditation associates with mental states that should be associated with, and does not associate with mental states that should not be associated with. He keeps company with mental states that should be kept company with, and does not keep company with mental states that should not be kept company with. Thus, great king, mindfulness has the characteristic of non-floating."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, the storekeeper of a wheel-turning monarch reminds the wheel-turning monarch of his glory morning and evening: 'So many, Sire, are your elephants, so many horses, so many chariots, so many infantry, so much unwrought gold, so much gold, so much property - may the Sire remember that' - thus he keeps afloat the king's property. Even so, great king, mindfulness when arising keeps afloat mental states that are wholesome and unwholesome, blameworthy and blameless, inferior and superior, dark and bright, and their counterparts: 'These are the four establishments of mindfulness, these are the four right strivings, these are the four bases for spiritual power, these are the five faculties, these are the five powers, these are the seven factors of enlightenment, this is the noble eightfold path, this is serenity, this is insight, this is true knowledge, this is liberation.' Thereupon one who practises meditation associates with mental states that should be associated with, and does not associate with mental states that should not be associated with. He keeps company with mental states that should be kept company with, and does not keep company with mental states that should not be kept company with. Thus, great king, mindfulness has the characteristic of non-floating."

"How, venerable sir, does mindfulness have the characteristic of taking up?" "Mindfulness, great king, when arising, follows the courses of mental states that are beneficial and harmful: 'These mental states are beneficial, these mental states are harmful. These mental states are helpful, these mental states are unhelpful.' Thereupon one who practises meditation dispels harmful mental states, and takes up beneficial mental states. He dispels unhelpful mental states, and takes up helpful mental states. Thus, great king, mindfulness has the characteristic of taking up."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, the adviser treasure of a wheel-turning monarch knows what is beneficial and harmful for the king: 'These are beneficial for the king, these are harmful. These are helpful, these are unhelpful.' Thereupon he dispels what is harmful, and takes up what is beneficial. He dispels what is unhelpful, and takes up what is helpful. Even so, great king, mindfulness when arising follows the courses of mental states that are beneficial and harmful: 'These mental states are beneficial, these mental states are harmful. These mental states are helpful, these mental states are unhelpful.' Thereupon one who practises meditation dispels harmful mental states, and takes up beneficial mental states. He dispels unhelpful mental states, and takes up helpful mental states. Thus, great king, mindfulness has the characteristic of taking up. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One - 'But mindfulness, monks, I say is useful everywhere.'"

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on the Characteristic of Mindfulness is thirteenth.

14.

The Question on Concentration

14. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of concentration?" "Concentration has the characteristic of being chief, great king; whatever wholesome mental states there are, all of them have concentration as chief, slant towards concentration, slope towards concentration, incline towards concentration."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, whatever rafters there are of a pinnacle building, all of them go to the pinnacle, slant towards the pinnacle, converge at the pinnacle, the pinnacle is declared the foremost among them. Just so, great king, whatever wholesome mental states there are, all of them have concentration as chief, slant towards concentration, slope towards concentration, incline towards concentration.

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, some king might enter battle together with his fourfold army, and the entire army - elephants, horses, chariots, and infantry - would have him as chief, slant towards him, slope towards him, incline towards him, and would follow him around. Just so, great king, whatever wholesome mental states there are, all of them have concentration as chief, slant towards concentration, slope towards concentration, incline towards concentration. Thus, great king, concentration has the characteristic of being chief. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One - "Develop concentration, monks; a concentrated monk, monks, understands as it really is."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on Concentration is fourteenth.

15.

The Question on the Characteristic of Wisdom

15. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of wisdom?" "Indeed, great king, it was previously said by me: 'Cutting is the characteristic of wisdom,' but also illuminating is the characteristic of wisdom." "How, venerable sir, is illuminating the characteristic of wisdom?" "Wisdom, great king, when arising, dispels the darkness of ignorance, generates the light of true knowledge, shows the light of knowledge, and makes the noble truths obvious. Thereupon one who practises meditation sees with right wisdom: 'impermanent' or 'suffering' or 'non-self.'"

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a man might bring a lamp into a dark house; the lamp having entered dispels the darkness, generates light, shows illumination, and makes forms obvious. Just so indeed, great king, wisdom when arising dispels the darkness of ignorance, generates the light of true knowledge, shows the light of knowledge, and makes the noble truths obvious. Thereupon one who practises meditation sees with right wisdom: 'impermanent' or 'suffering' or 'non-self.' Thus indeed, great king, illuminating is the characteristic of wisdom."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on the Characteristic of Wisdom is fifteenth.

16.

The Question on the Accomplishment of a Single Function by Various Phenomena

16. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, do these mental states, being different, bring into existence one purpose?" "Yes, great king, these mental states, being different, bring into existence one purpose: they strike down the mental defilements."

"How, venerable sir, do these mental states, being different, bring into existence one purpose, strike down the mental defilements? Give a simile." "Just as, great king, an army, being different - elephants and horses and chariots and infantry - bring into existence one purpose: in battle they conquer the enemy army. Even so, great king, these mental states, being different, bring into existence one purpose: they strike down the mental defilements."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on the Accomplishment of a Single Function by Various Phenomena is sixteenth.

The Great Chapter is first.

In this chapter there are sixteen questions.

2.

The Chapter on the Course

1.

The Question on the Continuity of Phenomena

1. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, one who arises, is he the same, or is he another?" The elder said: "Neither the same nor another."

"Give a simile." "What do you think, great king, when you were young, tender, dull, an infant lying on your back, are you the same as you are now grown up?" "No indeed, venerable sir, that young, tender, dull infant lying on his back was one, I who am now grown up am another." "This being so, great king, there will be no mother, there will be no father, there will be no teacher, there will be no one skilled in crafts, there will be no one virtuous, there will be no one wise. Is it then, great king, that the mother of the embryo is one, the mother of the foetus in the second stage is another, the mother of the foetus in the third stage is another, the mother of the compact mass is another, the mother of the small child is another, the mother of the grown-up is another, one learns a craft, another becomes trained, one commits an evil deed, another's hands and feet are cut off?" "No indeed, venerable sir. But you, venerable sir, when this is said, what would you say?" The elder said: "I indeed, great king, was young, tender, dull, an infant lying on his back, I indeed am now grown up; in dependence on this very body, all those are included as one."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, some man might light a lamp, would it burn the whole night?" "Yes, venerable sir, it would burn the whole night." "Is then, great king, the flame in the first watch the same as the flame in the middle watch?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Is the flame in the middle watch the same as the flame in the last watch?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Is then, great king, the lamp in the first watch one, the lamp in the middle watch another, the lamp in the last watch another?" "No indeed, venerable sir, in dependence on that very same it burned the whole night." "Just so indeed, great king, the continuity of phenomena connects; one arises, another ceases; it connects as if simultaneously; therefore neither the same nor another; the latter consciousness goes into the inclusion of the former consciousness."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, milk when being milked after an interval of time would turn into curds, from curds into butter, from butter into ghee, if anyone, great king, were to say thus: 'Whatever is the milk, that very thing is the curds; whatever is the curds, that very thing is the butter; whatever is the butter, that very thing is the ghee' - would he, speaking thus, speak rightly, great king?" "No indeed, venerable sir, it arose in dependence on that very same." "Just so indeed, great king, the continuity of phenomena connects; one arises, another ceases; it connects as if simultaneously; therefore neither the same nor another; the latter consciousness goes into the inclusion of the former consciousness."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on the Continuity of Phenomena is first.

2.

The Question on Putting Together

2. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, one who does not reunite, does he know 'I will not reunite'?" "Yes, great king, one who does not reunite knows 'I will not reunite'." "How, venerable sir, does he know?" "Whatever cause, whatever condition, great king, there is for reuniting, by the cessation of that cause, of that condition, he knows 'I will not reunite'."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a farmer householder, having ploughed and sown, might fill a granary. If at a later time he would neither plough nor sow, and would consume or give away or do as he wishes with the grain that was stored, would he know, great king, that farmer householder, 'My granary will not be filled'?" "Yes, venerable sir, he would know." "How would he know?" "Whatever cause, whatever condition there is for the filling of the granary, by the cessation of that cause, of that condition, he knows 'My granary will not be filled'." "Just so indeed, great king, whatever cause, whatever condition there is for reuniting, by the cessation of that cause, of that condition, he knows 'I will not reunite'."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on Putting Together is second.

3.

The Question on Knowledge and Wisdom

3. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, for whom knowledge has arisen, has wisdom arisen for him?" "Yes, great king, for whom knowledge has arisen, wisdom has arisen for him." "What, venerable sir, is that very knowledge that very wisdom?" "Yes, great king, that very knowledge is that very wisdom." "But, venerable sir, for whom that very knowledge, that very wisdom has arisen, would he be bewildered, or would he not be bewildered?" "In some cases, great king, he would be bewildered, in some cases he would not be bewildered." "Where, venerable sir, would he be bewildered?" "In branches of knowledge not previously known, great king, or in a direction not previously visited, or regarding a designation not previously heard, he would be bewildered." "Where would he not be bewildered?" "But whatever, great king, has been done by that wisdom as 'impermanent' or 'suffering' or 'non-self', there he would not be bewildered." "But where, venerable sir, does his delusion go?" "Delusion, great king, ceases right there as soon as knowledge has arisen."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, some man might light a lamp in a dark house, then the darkness would cease, and light would appear. Just so indeed, great king, as soon as knowledge has arisen, delusion ceases right there."

"But where, venerable sir, does wisdom go?" "Wisdom too, great king, having done its own function, ceases right there; but what has been done by that wisdom as 'impermanent' or 'suffering' or 'non-self', that does not cease."

"Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say: 'Wisdom, having done its own function, ceases right there; but what has been done by that wisdom as "impermanent" or "suffering" or "non-self", that does not cease' - give a simile for that." "Just as, great king, some man wishing to send a letter at night, having summoned a scribe, having lit a lamp, might have the letter written; but when the letter has been written, he might extinguish the lamp; even when the lamp has been extinguished, the letter would not be destroyed. Just so indeed, great king, wisdom, having done its own function, ceases right there; but what has been done by that wisdom as 'impermanent' or 'suffering' or 'non-self', that does not cease."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, in the eastern districts people place five water pots at each house to extinguish a fire; when the house is ablaze, they throw those five water pots on top of the house, and then the fire is extinguished. Now, great king, does it occur to those people: 'We shall do the pot-function again with those pots'?" "No indeed, venerable sir, those pots are finished with; what use are those pots?" "Just as, great king, the five water pots, so should the five faculties be seen: the faith faculty, the energy faculty, the mindfulness faculty, the concentration faculty, the wisdom faculty. Just as those people, so should one who practises meditation be seen. Just as the fire, so should the mental defilements be seen. Just as the fire is extinguished by the five water pots, so the mental defilements are extinguished by the five faculties; and the mental defilements once extinguished do not arise again. Just so indeed, great king, wisdom, having done its own function, ceases right there; but what has been done by that wisdom as 'impermanent' or 'suffering' or 'non-self', that does not cease."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, a physician, having taken five-root medicines, having approached a sick person, having ground those five-root medicines, might give them to the sick person to drink, and by them the disorders would be expelled. Now, great king, does it occur to that physician: 'I shall do the medicine-function again with those five-root medicines'?" "No indeed, venerable sir, those five-root medicines are finished with; what use are those five-root medicines?" "Just as, great king, the five-root medicines, so should the five faculties be seen: the faith faculty, the energy faculty, the mindfulness faculty, the concentration faculty, the wisdom faculty; just as the physician, so should one who practises meditation be seen. Just as the disease, so should the mental defilements be seen. Just as the diseased man, so should the worldling be seen. Just as the disorders of the sick person are expelled by the five-root medicines, and when the disorders are expelled the sick person becomes healthy, so the mental defilements are expelled by the five faculties; and the mental defilements once expelled do not arise again. Just so indeed, great king, wisdom, having done its own function, ceases right there; but what has been done by that wisdom as 'impermanent' or 'suffering' or 'non-self', that does not cease."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, a warrior experienced in battle, having taken five arrows, might enter the battle to conquer the enemy army, and he, having gone into battle, might shoot those five arrows, and by them the enemy army might be broken, would it occur thus to that warrior experienced in battle, great king: 'I will again perform the function of arrows with those arrows'?" "No indeed, venerable sir, those arrows are sufficient; what use are those arrows?" "Just as, great king, the five arrows, so should the five faculties be seen - the faith faculty, the energy faculty, the mindfulness faculty, the concentration faculty, the wisdom faculty. Just as, great king, the warrior experienced in battle, so should one who practises meditation be seen. Just as the enemy army, so should the mental defilements be seen. Just as by the five arrows the enemy army is broken, so by the five faculties the mental defilements are broken, and the mental defilements once broken do not come to be again. Just so indeed, great king, wisdom, having done its own function, ceases right there; but what has been done by that wisdom as 'impermanent' or 'suffering' or 'non-self', that does not cease."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on Knowledge and Wisdom is third.

4.

The Question on the Person Who Puts Together and Experiences

4. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, one who does not reunite, does he feel any unpleasant feeling?" The elder said: "He feels something, he does not feel something." "What does he feel, what does he not feel?" "He feels bodily feeling, great king, he does not feel mental feeling." "How, venerable sir, does he feel bodily feeling, how does he not feel mental feeling?" "Whatever cause, whatever condition there is for the arising of bodily unpleasant feeling, by the non-cessation of that cause, of that condition, he feels bodily unpleasant feeling; whatever cause, whatever condition there is for the arising of mental unpleasant feeling, by the cessation of that cause, of that condition, he does not feel mental unpleasant feeling. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One - 'He feels one feeling, bodily, not mental.'"

"Venerable Nāgasena, one who feels unpleasant feeling, why does he not attain final nibbāna?" "There is not, great king, attraction or aversion for a Worthy One, and Worthy Ones, being wise, do not cause the unripe to fall, they wait for the ripening. This too was spoken, great king, by the elder Sāriputta, the General of the Teaching -

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on the Person Who Puts Together and Experiences is fourth.

5.

The Question on Feeling

5. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is pleasant feeling wholesome or unwholesome or indeterminate?" "It may be, great king, wholesome, it may be unwholesome, it may be indeterminate." "If, venerable sir, the wholesome is not suffering, if suffering is not wholesome, 'the wholesome is suffering' does not arise." "What do you think, great king, suppose one were to place a red-hot iron ball in a man's hand, and place a cold lump of ice in his other hand, would both of them burn, great king?" "Yes, venerable sir, both of them would burn." "Are both of them hot, great king?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Are both of them cold, great king?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Understand the refutation: if the hot burns, yet both of them are not hot, therefore it does not arise. If the cold burns, yet both of them are not cold, therefore it does not arise. Why then, great king, do both of them burn, yet both of them are not hot, and both of them are not cold? One is hot, one is cold, both of them burn, therefore it does not arise." "I am not competent to converse with you, a debater; please, explain the meaning." Then the elder convinced King Milinda with a talk connected with the higher teaching:

"There are, great king, these six pleasures connected with the household life, six pleasures connected with renunciation, six displeasures connected with the household life, six displeasures connected with renunciation, six equanimities connected with the household life, six equanimities connected with renunciation - these are six sets of six. In the past too there are thirty-six kinds of feeling, in the future too there are thirty-six kinds of feeling, in the present too there are thirty-six kinds of feeling; having collected them together, having combined them, there are one hundred and eight feelings."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on Feeling is fifth.

6.

The Question on the Unity and Diversity of Mentality-Materiality

6. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, who reunites?" The elder said: "Mentality-materiality, great king, reunites." "Does this very same mentality-materiality reunite?" "Indeed not, great king, this very same mentality-materiality does not reunite; but with this mentality-materiality one performs action, whether beautiful or evil, and by that action another mentality-materiality reunites." "If, venerable sir, this very same mentality-materiality does not reunite, surely he will be freed from evil actions?" The elder said: "If it did not reunite, one would be freed from evil actions. But because, great king, it reunites, therefore one is not freed from evil actions."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, some man might steal mangoes from another man, and the owner of the mangoes, having seized him, might show him to the king: 'This man, Sire, has stolen my mangoes.' He might speak thus: 'I, Sire, did not steal this man's mangoes; those mangoes that were planted by him are different, those mangoes that were stolen by me are different; I am not liable to punishment.' Would that man, great king, be liable to punishment?" "Yes, venerable sir, he would be liable to punishment." "For what reason?" "Although he might speak thus, venerable sir, without rejecting the former mango, by the later mango that man would be liable to punishment." "Just so indeed, great king, with this mentality-materiality one performs action, whether beautiful or evil, and by that action another mentality-materiality reunites; therefore one is not freed from evil actions."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, some man might steal rice from another man, etc. might steal sugar-cane, etc. Just as, great king, some man in the winter season, having kindled a fire, having warmed himself, without extinguishing it, might depart; then that fire might burn another man's field; the owner of the field, having seized him, might show him to the king: 'This man, Sire, has burnt my field.' He might speak thus: 'I, Sire, did not burn this man's field; that fire which was not extinguished by me is different, that fire by which this man's field was burnt is different; I am not liable to punishment.' Would that man, great king, be liable to punishment?" "Yes, venerable sir, he would be liable to punishment." "For what reason?" "Although he might speak thus, venerable sir, without rejecting the former fire, by the later fire that man would be liable to punishment." "Just so indeed, great king, with this mentality-materiality one performs action, whether beautiful or evil, and by that action another mentality-materiality reunites; therefore one is not freed from evil actions."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, some man, having taken a lamp, having ascended a mansion, might eat; the lamp burning might set fire to the grass; the grass burning might set fire to the house; the house burning might set fire to the village; the villagers, having seized that man, might speak thus: 'Why did you, friend, burn the village?' He might speak thus: 'I, friend, did not burn the village; that lamp-fire by whose light I ate is different, that fire by which the village was burnt is different.' They, disputing, might come to your presence. Whose case would you uphold, great king?" "The villagers', venerable sir." "Why?" "Although he might speak thus, but that fire arose from that very source." "Just so indeed, great king, although the mentality-materiality at the time of death is different, and the mentality-materiality at conception is different, but that arose from that very source; therefore one is not freed from evil actions."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, some man might ask for a young girl in marriage, pay the bride-price, and depart. She at a later time would be grown up and come of age; then another man, having paid the bride-price, might marry her. The first one, having come, might say thus: 'Why, my good man, do you take away my wife?' He might say thus: 'I am not taking away your wife; that girl who was young and tender, who was asked for by you and for whom the bride-price was paid, is different; this girl who is grown up and come of age, who was asked for by me and for whom the bride-price was paid, is different.' They, disputing, might come to your presence. Whose case would you uphold, great king?" "The first one's, venerable sir." "Why?" "Although he might speak thus, yet she who is grown up arose from that very one." "Just so indeed, great king, although the mentality-materiality at the time of death is different, and the mentality-materiality at conception is different, yet it arose from that very one; therefore one is not released from evil actions."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, some man might buy a pot of milk from a cowherd's hand, and having left it in his very hand, might depart, saying 'I will take it and go tomorrow'; that on the following day might turn into curds. He, having come, might say thus: 'Give me the pot of milk.' He might offer curds. The other might say thus: 'I did not buy curds from your hand; give me the pot of milk.' He might say thus: 'Without your knowing, the milk has become curds.' They, disputing, might come to your presence. Whose case would you uphold, great king?" "The cowherd's, venerable sir." "Why?" "Although he might speak thus, yet it arose from that very one." "Just so indeed, great king, although the mentality-materiality at the time of death is different, and the mentality-materiality at conception is different, yet it arose from that very one; therefore one is not released from evil actions."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on the Unity and Diversity of Mentality-Materiality is sixth.

7.

The Question on the Elder's Putting Together and Not Putting Together

7. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, but will you reunite?" "Enough, great king, what is there for you in asking that? Was it not declared by me beforehand: 'If, great king, I will be one with clinging, I will reunite; if I will be one without clinging, I will not reunite'?"

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, some man might perform a service for a king. The king, being pleased, might grant him an office; he, endowed and furnished with the five types of sensual pleasure by that office, might indulge himself; if he were to tell people: 'The king does nothing for me.' Would that man, great king, be acting properly?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, what is there for you in asking that? Was it not declared by me beforehand: 'If I will be one with clinging, I will reunite; if I will be one without clinging, I will not reunite'?"

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on the Elder's Putting Together and Not Putting Together is seventh.

8.

The Question on the Putting Together of Mentality-Materiality

8. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'mentality-materiality', therein what is mentality, what is materiality?" "Whatever therein, great king, is gross, that is materiality; whatever therein are subtle mental states of consciousness and mental factors, that is mentality." "Venerable Nāgasena, for what reason does mentality alone not reunite, or materiality alone?" "Mutually dependent, great king, these phenomena arise together."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, if there were no embryo of a hen, there would be no egg either; whatever therein is the embryo, whatever is the egg, both of these are mutually dependent, their arising is together. Even so, great king, if therein there were no mentality, there would be no materiality either; whatever therein is mentality, whatever is materiality, both of these are mutually dependent, their arising is together. Thus this has transmigrated for a long course of time."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on the Putting Together of Mentality-Materiality is eighth.

9.

The Question on the Course of Time

9. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'a long course', what is this called a course?" "The past, great king, is a period; the future is a period; the present is a period." "But, venerable sir, do all periods exist?" "Some period, great king, exists; some does not exist." "But which, venerable sir, exists; which does not exist?" "Those activities, great king, that are past, departed, ceased, changed - that period does not exist; those mental states that are resultant, those that are states that have resultant quality, and those that give conception elsewhere - that period exists. Those beings who have deceased and have arisen elsewhere - that period also exists. Those beings who have deceased and have not arisen elsewhere - that period does not exist. And those beings who have attained final Nibbāna - that period also does not exist because of having attained final Nibbāna."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The Question on the Course of Time is ninth.

The Chapter on the Course of Time is second.

In this chapter there are nine questions.

3.

The Chapter on Examination

1.

The Question on the Root of Duration

1. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the root of the past course of time, what is the root of the future course of time, what is the root of the present course of time?" "Of the past course of time, great king, and of the future course of time, and of the present course of time, ignorance is the root. With ignorance as condition, activities; with activities as condition, consciousness; with consciousness as condition, mentality-materiality; with mentality-materiality as condition, the six sense bases; with the six sense bases as condition, contact; with contact as condition, feeling; with feeling as condition, craving; with craving as condition, clinging; with clinging as condition, existence; with existence as condition, birth; with birth as condition, ageing and death, sorrow, lamentation, pain, displeasure, and anguish come to be. Thus the former end of this whole mass of suffering, of this course of time, is not discerned."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the root of duration is the first.

2.

The Question on the Former End

2. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'the former end is not discerned', give a simile for that." "Just as, great king, a man might place a small seed in the earth, and from that a sprout having arisen, gradually attaining growth, increase, and expansion, would give fruit. From that, having taken the seed, he might plant it again, and from that too a sprout having arisen, gradually attaining growth, increase, and expansion, would give fruit. Is there an end to this continuity?" "There is not, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, the former end of the course of time is not discerned."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, there would be an egg from a hen, from the egg a hen, from the hen an egg. Is there an end to this continuity?" "There is not, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, the former end of the course of time is not discerned."

"Give a further simile." The elder, having drawn a wheel on the ground, said this to King Milinda: "Is there, great king, an end to this wheel?" "There is not, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, these wheels were spoken of by the Blessed One: 'Dependent on the eye and forms, eye-consciousness arises; the meeting of the three is contact; with contact as condition, feeling; with feeling as condition, craving; with craving as condition, clinging; with clinging as condition, action; from action, the eye is born again.' Is there an end to this continuity?" "There is not, venerable sir."

"'Dependent on the ear and sounds, etc. dependent on the mind and mental phenomena, mind-consciousness arises; the meeting of the three is contact; with contact as condition, feeling; with feeling as condition, craving; with craving as condition, clinging; with clinging as condition, action; from action, the mind is born again.' Is there an end to this continuity?" "There is not, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, the former end of the course of time is not discerned."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the former end is the second.

3.

The Question on Discerning the End

3. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'the former end is not discerned', what is that former end?" "Whatever, great king, is the past period, that is the former end." "Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'the former end is not discerned', but, venerable sir, is the entire former end not discerned?" "Some, great king, is discerned, some is not discerned." "Which, venerable sir, is discerned, which is not discerned?" "Before this, great king, entirely in every way, in every manner, ignorance did not exist - this former end is not discerned; that which, not having been, comes into being, having been, disappears - this former end is discerned."

"Venerable Nāgasena, that which, not having been, comes into being, having been, disappears - does that not, being cut off at both ends, go to its end?" "If, great king, being cut off at both ends, it goes to its end, is it possible to make what is cut off at both ends grow?" "Yes, that too is possible to make grow." "I am not, venerable sir, asking this - is it possible to make grow from the end?" "Yes, it is possible to make grow."

"Give a simile." The elder gave him the simile of a tree, and the aggregates are the seeds of the whole mass of suffering.

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on discerning the end is the third.

4.

The Question on Activities Arising

4. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, are there any activities which are born?" "Yes, great king, there are activities which are born." "Which are those, venerable sir?" "When the eye exists, great king, and forms exist, eye-consciousness exists; when eye-consciousness exists, eye-contact exists; when eye-contact exists, feeling exists; when feeling exists, craving exists; when craving exists, clinging exists; when clinging exists, existence exists; when existence exists, birth exists; when birth exists, ageing and death, sorrow, lamentation, pain, displeasure, and anguish come to be; thus is the origin of this whole mass of suffering. When the eye is absent, great king, and forms are absent, eye-consciousness does not exist; when eye-consciousness is absent, eye-contact does not exist; when eye-contact is absent, feeling does not exist; when feeling is absent, craving does not exist; when craving is absent, clinging does not exist; when clinging is absent, existence does not exist; when existence is absent, birth does not exist; when birth is absent, ageing and death, sorrow, lamentation, pain, displeasure, and anguish do not exist; thus is the cessation of this whole mass of suffering."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on activities arising is the fourth.

5.

The Question on Existing Activities Arising

5. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, are there any activities which, not existing, are born?" "There are not, great king, any activities which, not existing, are born; only existing activities are born, great king."

"Give a simile." "What do you think, great king, was this house in which you are sitting born not existing?" "There is nothing, venerable sir, here born not existing; it was born only existing. These timbers, venerable sir, were in the forest, and this clay was in the earth, and through the appropriate effort of women and men, thus this house came into being." "Just so, great king, there are no activities which, not existing, are born; only existing activities are born."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, whatever seed-plants and growing plants placed in the earth, gradually attaining growth, increase, and expansion, would give flowers and fruits, those trees were not born not existing; only existing were those trees born. Just so, great king, there are no activities which, not existing, are born; only existing are those activities born."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, a potter, having extracted clay from the earth, makes various vessels, those vessels were not born not existing; they were born only existing. Just so, great king, there are no activities which, not existing, are born; only existing activities are born."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, if there were no sound-board of a lute, no hide, no trough, no neck, no head, no strings, no plectrum, and no appropriate effort of a man, would sound be produced?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But when, great king, there is a sound-board of a lute, there is hide, there is a trough, there is a neck, there is a head, there are strings, there is a plectrum, and there is appropriate effort of a man, would sound be produced?" "Yes, venerable sir, it would be produced." "Just so, great king, there are no activities which, not existing, are born; only existing activities are born."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, if there were no fire-stick, no fire-stick spindle, no fire-stick cord, no upper fire-stick, no rag, and no appropriate effort of a man, would that fire be produced?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But when, great king, there is a fire-stick, there is a fire-stick spindle, there is a fire-stick cord, there is an upper fire-stick, there is a rag, and there is appropriate effort of a man, would that fire be produced?" "Yes, venerable sir, it would be produced." "Just so, great king, there are no activities which, not existing, are born; only existing activities are born."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, if there were no gem, no sunshine, no cow-dung, would that fire be produced?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But when, great king, there is a gem, there is sunshine, there is cow-dung, would that fire be produced?" "Yes, venerable sir, it would be produced." "Just so, great king, there are no activities which, not existing, are born; only existing activities are born."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, if there were no mirror, no light, no face, would a reflection arise?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But when, great king, there is a mirror, there is light, there is a face, would a reflection arise?" "Yes, venerable sir, it would be produced." "Just so, great king, there are no activities which, not existing, are born; only existing activities are born."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on existing activities arising is the fifth.

6.

The Question on One Who Has Attained the Highest Knowledge

6. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is one who has attained the highest knowledge found?" "But who, great king, is this one called 'one who has attained the highest knowledge'?" "That which, venerable sir, is the soul inside that sees form with the eye, hears sound with the ear, smells odour with the nose, tastes flavour with the tongue, touches tangible object with the body, cognizes mental phenomena with the mind, just as we, seated here in the mansion, through whichever window we might wish to see, through that window we would see, through the eastern window too we would see, through the western window too we would see, through the northern window too we would see, through the southern window too we would see. Just so indeed, venerable sir, this soul inside, through whichever door it wishes to see, through that door it sees."

The elder said: "I will speak about the five doors, great king; listen to that, pay close attention. If the soul inside sees form with the eye, just as we, seated here in the mansion, through whichever window we might wish to see, through that window we would see just form, through the eastern window too we would see just form, through the western window too we would see just form, through the northern window too we would see just form, through the southern window too we would see just form, just so by this soul inside, with the ear too just form should be seen, with the nose too just form should be seen, with the tongue too just form should be seen, with the body too just form should be seen, with the mind too just form should be seen; with the eye too just sound should be heard, with the nose too just sound should be heard, with the tongue too just sound should be heard, with the body too just sound should be heard, with the mind too just sound should be heard; with the eye too just odour should be smelled, with the ear too just odour should be smelled, with the tongue too just odour should be smelled, with the body too just odour should be smelled, with the mind too just odour should be smelled; with the eye too just flavour should be tasted, with the ear too just flavour should be tasted, with the nose too just flavour should be tasted, with the body too just flavour should be tasted, with the mind too just flavour should be tasted; with the eye too just tangible object should be touched, with the ear too just tangible object should be touched, with the nose too just tangible object should be touched, with the tongue too just tangible object should be touched, with the mind too just tangible object should be touched; with the eye too just mental phenomena should be cognized, with the ear too just mental phenomena should be cognized, with the nose too just mental phenomena should be cognized, with the tongue too just mental phenomena should be cognized, with the body too just mental phenomena should be cognized?" "No indeed, venerable sir."

"Your latter statement does not connect with your former, great king, nor your former with your latter. Or else, great king, just as we, seated here in the mansion, when these latticed windows are opened, with the great space facing outward, we see form more clearly, just so by this soul inside too, when the eye-doors are opened, with the great space, form should be seen more clearly; when the ears are opened, etc. when the nose is opened, etc. when the tongue is opened, etc. when the body is opened, with the great space, sound should be heard more clearly, odour should be smelled, flavour should be tasted, tangible object should be touched?" "No indeed, venerable sir."

"Your latter statement does not connect with your former, great king, nor your former with your latter. Or else, great king, if this Dinna, having gone out, were to stand in the outer door-porch, would you know, great king, 'This Dinna, having gone out, is standing in the outer door-porch'?" "Yes, venerable sir, I know." "Or else, great king, if this Dinna, having entered inside, were to stand before you, would you know, great king, 'This Dinna, having entered inside, is standing before me'?" "Yes, venerable sir, I know." "Just so indeed, great king, would that soul inside, when flavour is placed on the tongue, know sourness or saltiness or bitterness or pungency or astringency or sweetness?" "Yes, venerable sir, he would know." "Would it know those flavours when they have entered inside - sourness or saltiness or bitterness or pungency or astringency or sweetness?" "No indeed, venerable sir."

"Your latter statement does not connect with your former, great king, nor your former with your latter. Just as, great king, some man, having had a hundred pots of honey brought, having had a honey trough filled, having closed a man's mouth, were to throw him into the honey trough, would that man know, great king, whether the honey is good or not good?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "For what reason?" "Because, venerable sir, the honey has not entered his mouth."

"Your latter statement does not connect with your former, great king, nor your former with your latter." "I am not competent to converse with you, a debater; please, venerable sir, explain the meaning."

The elder convinced King Milinda with a talk connected with the higher teaching: "Here, great king, dependent on the eye and forms, eye-consciousness arises; conascent with it are contact, feeling, perception, volition, unified focus, life faculty, and attention - thus these mental states arise from conditions; no one who has attained the highest knowledge is found here. Dependent on the ear and sounds, etc. Dependent on the mind and mental phenomena, mind-consciousness arises; conascent with it are contact, feeling, perception, volition, unified focus, life faculty, and attention - thus these mental states arise from conditions; no one who has attained the highest knowledge is found here."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on one who has attained the highest knowledge is the sixth.

7.

The Question on Eye-Consciousness and So On

7. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, where eye-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there?" "Yes, great king, where eye-consciousness arises, mind-consciousness also arises there."

"Which indeed, venerable Nāgasena, arises first - eye-consciousness and afterwards mind-consciousness, or does mind-consciousness arise first and afterwards eye-consciousness?" "First, great king, eye-consciousness arises, afterwards mind-consciousness."

"Does indeed, venerable Nāgasena, eye-consciousness command mind-consciousness 'Where I arise, you too arise there,' or does mind-consciousness command eye-consciousness 'Where you will arise, I too will arise there'?" "No indeed, great king, there is no conversation between them with each other."

"How, venerable Nāgasena, where eye-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there?" "Because of inclination, great king, and because of the door, and because of practice, and because of habituation."

"How, venerable Nāgasena, because of inclination, where eye-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there? Give a simile." "What do you think, great king, when the sky rains, by which way would the water go?" "By whichever way there is a slope, venerable sir, by that way it would go." "Then at another time the sky would rain, by which way would that water go?" "By whichever way, venerable sir, the former water went, that too would go by that way."

"Does indeed, great king, the former water command the latter water 'By which way I go, you too go by that way,' or does the latter water command the former water 'By which way you will go, I too will go by that way'?" "No indeed, venerable sir, there is no conversation between them with each other; they go because of inclination." "Just so indeed, great king, because of inclination, where eye-consciousness arises, mind-consciousness also arises there; eye-consciousness does not command mind-consciousness 'Where I arise, you too arise there,' nor does mind-consciousness command eye-consciousness 'Where you will arise, I too will arise there'; there is no conversation between them with each other; they arise because of inclination."

"How, venerable Nāgasena, because of the door, where eye-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there? Give a simile." "What do you think, great king, suppose there were a king's border city with strong walls and gateways, with a single door, and from there a man wished to depart, by which way would he depart?" "By the door, venerable sir, he would depart." "Then another man wished to depart, by which way would he depart?" "By whichever way, venerable sir, the former man departed, he too would depart by that way."

"Does indeed, great king, the former man command the latter man 'By which way I go, you too go by that way,' or does the latter man command the former man 'By which way you will go, I too will go by that way'? "No indeed, venerable sir, there is no conversation between them with each other; they go because of the door." "Just so indeed, great king, because of the door, where eye-consciousness arises, mind-consciousness also arises there; eye-consciousness does not command mind-consciousness 'Where I arise, you too arise there,' nor does mind-consciousness command eye-consciousness 'Where you will arise, I too will arise there'; there is no conversation between them with each other; they arise because of the door."

"How, venerable Nāgasena, because of practice, where eye-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there? Give a simile." "What do you think, great king, suppose first one cart were to go, then by which way would a second cart go?" "By whichever way, venerable sir, the former cart went, that too would go by that way."

"Does indeed, great king, the former cart command the latter cart: 'By which way I go, you too go by that way,' or does the latter cart command the former cart: 'By which way you will go, I too will go by that way'?" "No indeed, venerable sir, there is no conversation between them with each other; they go because of habit." "Just so indeed, great king, because of habit, where eye-consciousness arises, there mind-consciousness also arises; eye-consciousness does not command mind-consciousness: 'Where I arise, you too arise there,' nor does mind-consciousness command eye-consciousness: 'Where you will arise, I too will arise there'; there is no conversation between them with each other; they arise because of habit."

"How, venerable Nāgasena, because of repeated practice, where eye-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there? Give a simile." "Just as, great king, for a beginner in the branches of knowledge of seal-making, calculation, enumeration, and writing, there is slowness, but at a later time, because of repeated practice through careful action, there is no slowness. Just so indeed, great king, because of repeated practice, where eye-consciousness arises, there mind-consciousness also arises; eye-consciousness does not command mind-consciousness: 'Where I arise, you too arise there,' nor does mind-consciousness command eye-consciousness: 'Where you will arise, I too will arise there'; there is no conversation between them with each other; they arise because of repeated practice."

"Venerable Nāgasena, where ear-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there?" Etc. Where nose-consciousness arises, etc. Where tongue-consciousness arises, etc. Where body-consciousness arises, does mind-consciousness also arise there?" "Yes, great king, where body-consciousness arises, there mind-consciousness also arises."

"Does indeed, venerable Nāgasena, body-consciousness arise first and mind-consciousness afterwards, or does mind-consciousness arise first and body-consciousness afterwards?" "Body-consciousness, great king, arises first, mind-consciousness afterwards."

"Does indeed, venerable Nāgasena, etc. there is no conversation between them with each other; they arise because of repeated practice."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on eye-consciousness and so on is the seventh.

8.

The Question on the Characteristic of Contact

8. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, where mind-consciousness arises, do contact and feeling also arise there?" "Yes, great king, where mind-consciousness arises, contact also arises there, feeling also arises there, perception also arises there, volition also arises there, applied thought also arises there, sustained thought also arises there, all phenomena with contact as chief also arise there."

"Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of contact?" "Touching is the characteristic of contact, great king."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, two rams might fight; among them, just as one ram, so should the eye be seen; just as the second ram, so should matter be seen. Just as their collision, so should contact be seen."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, two hands might strike together; among them, just as one hand, so should the eye be seen. Just as the second hand, so should matter be seen. Just as their collision, so should contact be seen."

"Give a further simile." "Just as, great king, two cymbals might strike together; among them, just as one cymbal, so should the eye be seen. Just as the second cymbal, so should matter be seen. Just as their collision, so should contact be seen."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the characteristic of contact is the eighth.

9.

The Question on the Characteristic of Feeling

9. "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of feeling?" "Feeling has the characteristic of being felt, great king, and the characteristic of being experienced."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, some man might perform a service for a king, and the king, being pleased, might grant him an office; he, endowed and furnished with the five types of sensual pleasure by that office, might indulge himself; it might occur to him: 'Formerly I performed a service for the king, and the king, being pleased, granted me an office; on that account I feel this kind of feeling.'

"Or else, great king, some man, having done wholesome action, upon the body's collapse at death, might be reborn in a fortunate realm, in a heavenly world; and there, endowed and furnished with the five divine types of sensual pleasure, he might indulge himself; it might occur to him: 'Formerly I did wholesome action; on that account I feel this kind of feeling.' Thus indeed, great king, feeling has the characteristic of being felt and the characteristic of being experienced."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the characteristic of feeling is the ninth.

10.

The Question on the Characteristic of Perception

10. "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of perception?" "Perceiving is the characteristic of perception, great king. What does it perceive? It perceives blue, it perceives yellow, it perceives red, it perceives white, it perceives crimson. Thus, great king, perceiving is the characteristic of perception."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a king's storekeeper, having entered the storehouse, having seen the royal treasures of blue, yellow, red, white, and crimson forms, perceives them. Thus, great king, perceiving is the characteristic of perception."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the characteristic of perception is the tenth.

11.

The Question on the Characteristic of Volition

11. "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of volition?" "Volition has the characteristic of willing, great king, and the characteristic of constructing."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, some man, having prepared poison, might drink it himself and give it to others to drink, he himself would be afflicted, and others too would be afflicted. Just so indeed, great king, here a certain person, having willed unwholesome action through volition, upon the body's collapse at death, would be reborn in a realm of misery, an unfortunate realm, a nether world, in hell. And those who follow his example, they too, upon the body's collapse at death, are reborn in a realm of misery, an unfortunate realm, a nether world, in hell.

"Or else, great king, some man, having prepared together ghee, butter, oil, honey and molasses, might drink it himself and give it to others to drink, he himself would be happy, and others too would be happy. Just so indeed, great king, here a certain person, having willed wholesome action through volition, upon the body's collapse at death, is reborn in a fortunate realm, in a heavenly world. And those who follow his example, they too, upon the body's collapse at death, are reborn in a fortunate realm, in a heavenly world. Thus indeed, great king, volition has the characteristic of willing and the characteristic of constructing."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the characteristic of volition is the eleventh.

12.

The Question on the Characteristic of Consciousness

12. "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of consciousness?" "Cognition is the characteristic of consciousness, great king."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a city guardian seated in the middle of a city crossroads would see a man coming from the eastern direction, would see a man coming from the southern direction, would see a man coming from the western direction, would see a man coming from the northern direction. Even so, great king, whatever form a man sees with the eye, that he cognizes with consciousness. Whatever sound he hears with the ear, that he cognizes with consciousness. Whatever odour he smells with the nose, that he cognizes with consciousness. Whatever flavour he tastes with the tongue, that he cognizes with consciousness. Whatever tangible object he touches with the body, that he cognizes with consciousness; whatever mental phenomenon he cognizes with the mind, that he cognizes with consciousness. Thus, great king, cognition is the characteristic of consciousness."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the characteristic of consciousness is the twelfth.

13.

The Question on the Characteristic of Applied Thought

13. "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of applied thought?" "Absorption is the characteristic of applied thought, great king."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a carpenter fixes well-prepared wood into a joint, even so, great king, absorption is the characteristic of applied thought."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the characteristic of applied thought is the thirteenth.

14.

The Question on the Characteristic of Sustained Thought

14. "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the characteristic of sustained thought?" "Stroking is the characteristic of sustained thought, great king."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a bronze plate when struck afterwards resounds and reverberates, just as, great king, the striking, so should applied thought be seen. Just as the resounding, so should sustained thought be seen."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the characteristic of sustained thought is the fourteenth.

The Sustained Thought Chapter is the third.

In this chapter there are fourteen questions.

4.

The Chapter on Nibbāna

1.

The Question on Distinguishing Contact and So On

1. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is it possible, having separated these mental states that have come to a unified condition again and again, to declare their difference: 'This is contact, this is feeling, this is perception, this is volition, this is consciousness, this is applied thought, this is sustained thought'?" "It is not possible, great king, having separated these mental states that have come to a unified condition again and again, to declare their difference: 'This is contact, this is feeling, this is perception, this is volition, this is consciousness, this is applied thought, this is sustained thought.'"

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a king's cook might make a sauce or a curry, and therein he might put curds, and he might put salt, and he might put ginger, and he might put cumin, and he might put pepper, and he might put other ingredients, and the king might say to him thus: 'Bring me the flavour of the curds, bring me the flavour of the salt, bring me the flavour of the ginger, bring me the flavour of the cumin, bring me the flavour of the pepper, bring me the flavour of all the ingredients that were put in.' Is it possible, great king, having separated those flavours that have come to a unified condition again and again, to bring the flavour - sourness or saltiness or bitterness or pungency or astringency or sweetness?" "No indeed, venerable sir, it is not possible, having separated those flavours that have come to a unified condition again and again, to bring the flavour - sourness or saltiness or bitterness or pungency or astringency or sweetness; but they are present each with its own characteristic." "Just so indeed, great king, it is not possible, having separated these mental states that have come to a unified condition again and again, to declare their difference: 'This is contact, this is feeling, this is perception, this is volition, this is consciousness, this is applied thought, this is sustained thought'; but they are present each with its own characteristic."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on distinguishing contact and so on is the first.

2.

The Question on Nāgasena

2. The elder said: "Salt, great king, is cognizable by eye." "Yes, venerable sir, cognizable by eye." "Well indeed, great king, you know." "But is it, venerable sir, cognizable by tongue?" "Yes, great king, cognizable by tongue." "But, venerable sir, is all salt cognized by the tongue?" "Yes, great king, all salt is cognized by the tongue."

"If, venerable sir, all salt is cognized by the tongue, then why do oxen bring it by carts? Should not just the salt be brought?" "It is not possible, great king, to bring just the salt; these phenomena have come to a unified condition, having gone to diversity of range - salt and heaviness. But is it possible, great king, to weigh salt on a scale?" "Yes, venerable sir, it is possible." "It is not possible, great king, to weigh salt on a scale; heaviness is weighed on a scale."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on Nāgasena is the second.

3.

The Question on Action-Produced Five Sense Bases

3. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, these five sense bases, are they produced by different actions, or by one action?" "By different actions, great king, they are produced, not by one action."

"Give a simile." "What do you think, great king, if in one field different seeds were sown, would different fruits of those different seeds be produced?" "Yes, venerable sir, they would be produced." "Just so indeed, great king, whatever five sense bases there are, all those are produced by different actions, not by one action."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on action-produced five sense bases is the third.

4.

The Question on the Difference of Action

4. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, for what reason are human beings not all equal - some are short-lived, some are long-lived, some have many illnesses, some have few illnesses, some are ugly, some are beautiful, some are of little influence, some are influential, some are of little wealth, some are of great wealth, some are of low birth, some are of high birth, some are lacking wisdom, some are wise?"

The elder said: "But why, great king, are trees not all equal - some are sour, some are salty, some are bitter, some are pungent, some are astringent, some are sweet?" "I think, venerable sir, because of the difference in seeds." "Just so indeed, great king, because of the difference in actions, human beings are not all equal - some are short-lived, some are long-lived, some have many illnesses, some have few illnesses, some are ugly, some are beautiful, some are of little influence, some are influential, some are of little wealth, some are of great wealth, some are of low birth, some are of high birth, some are lacking wisdom, some are wise. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One - 'Beings are owners of their actions, young man, heirs to their actions, they originate from their actions, are bound to their actions, have their actions as their refuge; it is action that divides beings, that is to say, into the inferior and the superior.'"

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the difference of action is the fourth.

5.

The Question on Making Effort

5. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'so that this suffering might cease, and other suffering might not arise.' For this purpose, great king, is our going forth." "What is the use of striving beforehand? Should one not strive when the time has arrived?" The elder said: "When the time has arrived, great king, effort does not accomplish its function; only effort made beforehand accomplishes its function."

"Give a simile." "What do you think, great king, when you were thirsty, would you then have a well dug, have a lake dug, thinking 'I will drink water'? "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so, great king, when the time has arrived, effort does not accomplish its function; only effort made beforehand accomplishes its function."

"Give a further simile." "What do you think, great king, when you were hungry, would you then have a field ploughed, have rice planted, have grain brought in, thinking 'I will eat a meal'? "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so, great king, when the time has arrived, effort does not accomplish its function; only effort made beforehand accomplishes its function."

"Give a further simile." "What do you think, great king, when a battle was at hand for you, would you then have a moat dug, have a wall built, have a gateway built, have a watchtower built, have grain brought in; would you then train in elephants, train in horses, train in chariots, train in bows, train in swords?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so, great king, when the time has arrived, effort does not accomplish its function; only effort made beforehand accomplishes its function. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One -

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on making effort is the fifth.

6.

The Question on the Heat of Hell Fire for Hell Beings

6. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'the fire of hell is more intensely hot than ordinary fire; even a small stone thrown into ordinary fire, though being cooked for a day, does not go to dissolution; but even a stone the size of a pinnacle building thrown into the fire of hell goes to dissolution in a moment' - I do not believe this statement; and yet you say 'those beings who have arisen there, they, though being cooked in hell for many thousands of years, do not go to dissolution' - I do not believe that statement either."

The elder said: "What do you think, great king, those female sea-monsters, female crocodiles, female turtles, female peahens, and female pigeons that exist - do they eat hard stones and gravel?" "Yes, venerable sir, they eat them." "But do those things, having gone into the interior of their bellies, go to dissolution?" "Yes, venerable sir, they go to dissolution." "But does the embryo in their womb also go to dissolution?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "For what reason?" "I think, venerable sir, because of being caused by action, it does not go to dissolution." "Just so indeed, great king, because of being caused by action, beings doomed to hell, though being cooked in hell for many thousands of years, do not go to dissolution. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One - 'He does not die until that evil deed is exhausted.'"

"Give a further simile." "What do you think, great king, those female lions, female tigers, female leopards, and female dogs that exist - do they eat hard bones and meat?" "Yes, venerable sir, they eat them." "But do those things, having gone into the interior of their bellies, go to dissolution?" "Yes, venerable sir, they go to dissolution." "But does the embryo in their womb also go to dissolution?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "For what reason?" "I think, venerable sir, because of being caused by action, it does not go to dissolution." "Just so indeed, great king, because of being caused by action, beings doomed to hell, though being cooked in hell for many thousands of years, do not go to dissolution."

"Give a further simile." "What do you think, great king, those delicate Greek women, delicate warrior-caste women, delicate brahmin women, and delicate householder women that exist - do they eat hard sweetmeats and meat?" "Yes, venerable sir, they eat them." "But do those things, having gone into the interior of their bellies, go to dissolution?" "Yes, venerable sir, they go to dissolution." "But does the embryo in their womb also go to dissolution?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "For what reason?" "I think, venerable sir, because of being caused by action, it does not go to dissolution." "Just so indeed, great king, because of being caused by action, beings doomed to hell, though being cooked in hell for many thousands of years, do not go to dissolution. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One - 'He does not die until that evil deed is exhausted.'"

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the heat of hell fire for hell beings is the sixth.

7.

The Question on the Earth-Supporter

7. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'this great earth is established upon water, the water is established upon wind, the wind is established upon space' - I do not believe this statement either." The elder, having taken water with a water-strainer, convinced King Milinda: "Just as, great king, this water is supported by wind, so too that water is supported by wind."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the earth-supporter is the seventh.

8.

The Question on Cessation and Nibbāna

8. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is cessation Nibbāna?" "Yes, great king, cessation is Nibbāna." "How, venerable Nāgasena, is cessation Nibbāna?" "All ignorant worldlings, great king, delight in the internal and external sense bases, assert them, and remain grasping them; they are carried away by that stream; they are not released from birth, from ageing, from death, from sorrow, from lamentation, from sufferings, from displeasures, from anguishes; they are not released from suffering, I say. But a learned noble disciple, great king, does not delight in the internal and external sense bases, does not assert them, and does not remain grasping them; for him not delighting in that, not asserting it, not remaining grasping it, craving ceases; from the cessation of craving comes the cessation of clinging; from the cessation of clinging comes the cessation of existence; from the cessation of existence comes the cessation of birth; from the cessation of birth, ageing and death, sorrow, lamentation, pain, displeasure, and anguish cease; thus is the cessation of this whole mass of suffering; thus, great king, cessation is Nibbāna."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on cessation and Nibbāna is the eighth.

9.

The Question on Attaining Nibbāna

9. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, does everyone obtain Nibbāna?" "Indeed not, great king, not everyone obtains Nibbāna; but, great king, whoever is rightly practising directly knows the phenomena to be directly known, fully understands the phenomena to be fully understood, abandons the phenomena to be abandoned, develops the phenomena to be developed, realizes the phenomena to be realized - he obtains Nibbāna."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on attaining Nibbāna is the ninth.

10.

The Question on Knowing the Happiness of Nibbāna

10. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, one who does not obtain Nibbāna, does he know 'Nibbāna is happiness'?" "Yes, great king, one who does not obtain Nibbāna knows 'Nibbāna is happiness'." "How, venerable Nāgasena, does one not obtaining know 'Nibbāna is happiness'?" "What do you think, great king, those whose hands and feet have not been cut off, would they know, great king, 'the cutting off of hands and feet is painful'?" "Yes, venerable sir, they would know." "How would they know?" "Venerable sir, having heard the sound of lamentation of others whose hands and feet have been cut off, they know 'the cutting off of hands and feet is painful'." "Just so indeed, great king, having heard the sound of those who have seen Nibbāna, one knows 'Nibbāna is happiness'."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on knowing the happiness of Nibbāna is the tenth.

The Nibbāna Chapter is the fourth.

In this chapter there are ten questions.

5.

The Chapter on the Buddhas

1.

The Question on the Presence or Absence of the Buddha

1. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, has the Buddha been seen by you?" "No indeed, great king." "Then has the Buddha been seen by your teachers?" "No indeed, great king." "If so, Venerable Nāgasena, there is no Buddha." "But then, great king, has the Ūhā river in the Himalayas been seen by you?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Then has the Ūhā river been seen by your father?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "If so, great king, there is no Ūhā river." "There is, venerable sir; although the Ūhā river has not been seen by me, and the Ūhā river has not been seen by my father either, yet there is the Ūhā river." "Just so indeed, great king, although the Blessed One has not been seen by me, and the Blessed One has not been seen by my teachers either, yet there is the Blessed One."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the presence or absence of the Buddha is the first.

2.

The Question on the Buddha's Unsurpassed State

2. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is the Buddha unsurpassed?" "Yes, great king, the Blessed One is unsurpassed." "How, venerable Nāgasena, do you know the Buddha is unsurpassed, having never seen him before?" "What do you think, great king, those by whom the great ocean has never been seen before, would they know, great king, 'the great ocean is indeed great, deep, immeasurable, hard to fathom, wherein these five great rivers constantly and continuously flow, as follows: the Ganges, the Yamunā, the Aciravatī, the Sarabhū, the Mahī, yet neither deficiency nor fullness of it is discerned'?" "Yes, venerable sir, they would know." "Just so indeed, great king, having seen the great disciples who have attained final Nibbāna, I know 'the Blessed One is unsurpassed'."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the Buddha's unsurpassed state is the second.

3.

The Question on Knowing the Buddha's Unsurpassed State

3. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is it possible to know 'the Buddha is unsurpassed'?" "Yes, great king, it is possible to know 'the Blessed One is unsurpassed'." "How, venerable Nāgasena, is it possible to know 'the Buddha is unsurpassed'?" "Once in the past, great king, there was an elder named Tissa who was a writing teacher; many years have passed since he died - how is he known?" "By his writing, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, whoever sees the Teaching sees the Blessed One, for the Teaching, great king, was taught by the Blessed One."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on knowing the Buddha's unsurpassed state is the third.

4.

The Question on Seeing the Dhamma

4. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, has the Teaching been seen by you?" "By the Buddha's guidance indeed, great king, by the Buddha's regulation, for life it should be practised by disciples."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on seeing the Dhamma is the fourth.

5.

The Question on Reconnection without Transmigration

5. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, does one not transmigrate and yet reunite?" "Yes, great king, one does not transmigrate and yet reunites." "How, venerable Nāgasena, does one not transmigrate and yet reunite? Give a simile." "Just as, great king, some man might light a lamp from a lamp, has that lamp, great king, passed over from the other lamp?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, one does not transmigrate and yet reunites."

"Give a further simile." "Do you recall, great king, when you were young, having learned some verse near a verse-teacher?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Has that verse, great king, passed over from the teacher?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, one does not transmigrate and yet reunites."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on reconnection without transmigration is the fifth.

6.

The Question on One Who Has Attained the Highest Knowledge

6. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is one who has attained the highest knowledge found?" The elder said: "In the ultimate reality, great king, one who has attained the highest knowledge is not found."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on one who has attained the highest knowledge is the sixth.

7.

The Question on Transmigration to Another Body

7. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is there any being who transmigrates from this body to another body?" "No indeed, great king." "If, Venerable Nāgasena, there is no one transmigrating from this body to another body, surely he will be freed from evil actions?" "Yes, great king, if he did not reunite, he would be freed from evil actions; but because, great king, he reunites, therefore he is not released from evil actions."

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, some man might steal mangoes from another man, would he be liable to punishment?" "Yes, venerable sir, he would be liable to punishment." "But, great king, he did not steal those mangoes that were planted by him; why would he be liable to punishment?" "Those mangoes, venerable sir, arose in dependence on those; therefore he would be liable to punishment." "Just so indeed, great king, with this mentality-materiality one performs action, whether beautiful or non-beautiful, and by that action another mentality-materiality reunites; therefore one is not released from evil actions."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on transmigration to another body is the seventh.

8.

The Question on the Existence of the Fruit of Action

8. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, when action has been done by this mentality-materiality, whether wholesome or unwholesome, where do those actions remain?" "They would follow, great king, those actions, like a shadow that does not depart." "But is it possible, venerable sir, to show those actions: 'Here or there those actions remain'?" "It is not possible, great king, to show those actions: 'Here or there those actions remain.'"

"Give a simile." "What do you think, great king, these trees that have not produced fruit, is it possible to show their fruits: 'Here or there those fruits remain'?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, with uninterrupted continuity it is not possible to show those actions: 'Here or there those actions remain.'"

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the existence of the fruit of action is the eighth.

9.

The Question on Knowing What Arises

9. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, one who arises, does he know 'I will arise'?" "Yes, great king, one who arises knows 'I will arise'." "Give a simile." "Just as, great king, a farmer householder, having placed seeds in the ground, when the sky rains properly, knows 'grain will be produced'?" "Yes, venerable sir, he would know." "Just so indeed, great king, one who arises knows 'I will arise'."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on knowing what arises is the ninth.

10.

The Question on Evidence of the Buddha

10. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, does the Buddha exist?" "Yes, great king, the Blessed One exists." "But is it possible, Venerable Nāgasena, to point out the Buddha: 'Here or there'?" "The Blessed One, great king, has attained final Nibbāna through the Nibbāna element without residue of clinging; it is not possible to point out the Blessed One: 'Here or there'."

"Give a simile." "What do you think, great king, of a great mass of fire that was burning, the flame that has passed away, is it possible to show that flame: 'Here or there'?" "No indeed, venerable sir, that flame has ceased, gone beyond designation." "Just so indeed, great king, the Blessed One has attained final Nibbāna through the Nibbāna element without residue of clinging, has passed away; it is not possible to point out the Blessed One: 'Here or there'; but by the body of the Teaching, great king, it is possible to point out the Blessed One. For the Teaching, great king, was taught by the Blessed One."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on evidence of the Buddha is the tenth.

The Chapter on the Buddha is the fifth.

In this chapter there are ten questions.

6.

The Chapter on Mindfulness

1.

The Question on Cherishing the Body

1. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is the body dear to those gone forth?" "Indeed not, great king, the body is not dear to those gone forth." "Then why, venerable sir, do you cherish it and treat it as your own?" "But have you, great king, ever at some time gone to battle and received an arrow wound?" "Yes, venerable sir, I have." "Is that wound, great king, anointed with ointment and smeared with oil and wrapped with a fine cloth bandage?" "Yes, venerable sir, it is anointed with ointment and smeared with oil and wrapped with a fine cloth bandage." "Is that wound dear to you, great king, that it is anointed with ointment and smeared with oil and wrapped with a fine cloth bandage?" "The wound is not dear to me, venerable sir, but it is anointed with ointment and smeared with oil and wrapped with a fine cloth bandage for the purpose of the flesh healing." "Just so indeed, great king, the body is not dear to those gone forth, yet those gone forth, without clinging, care for the body for the support of the holy life. And yet, great king, the body was said by the Blessed One to be like a wound; therefore those gone forth care for the body like a wound, without clinging. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One -

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on cherishing the body is the first.

2.

The Question on the State of Omniscience

2. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is the Buddha omniscient, all-seeing?" "Yes, great king, the Blessed One is omniscient, all-seeing." "Then why, Venerable Nāgasena, did he lay down the training rules for disciples gradually?" "But is there, great king, any physician who knows all medicines on this earth?" "Yes, venerable sir, there is." "Now, great king, does that physician give medicine to a sick person when the time has arrived, or when the time has not arrived?" "When the time has arrived, venerable sir, he gives medicine to a sick person, not when the time has not arrived." "Just so indeed, great king, the Blessed One, omniscient, all-seeing, does not lay down a training rule for disciples when the time has not arrived; when the time has arrived, he lays down a training rule for disciples, not to be transgressed for life."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the state of omniscience is the second.

3.

The Question on the Marks of a Great Man

3. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is the Buddha endowed with the thirty-two characteristics of a great man and adorned with the eighty minor features, gold-coloured, with skin resembling gold, with a fathom-wide radiance?" "Yes, great king, the Blessed One is endowed with the thirty-two characteristics of a great man and adorned with the eighty minor features, gold-coloured, with skin resembling gold, with a fathom-wide radiance."

"But, venerable sir, were his mother and father also endowed with the thirty-two characteristics of a great man and adorned with the eighty minor features, gold-coloured, with skin resembling gold, with a fathom-wide radiance?" "No, great king, his mother and father were not endowed with the thirty-two characteristics of a great man and adorned with the eighty minor features, gold-coloured, with skin resembling gold, with a fathom-wide radiance."

"This being so, Venerable Nāgasena, a Buddha endowed with the thirty-two characteristics of a great man and adorned with the eighty minor features, gold-coloured, with skin resembling gold, with a fathom-wide radiance does not arise; but a son is either similar to his mother or takes after his mother's side, or a son is similar to his father or takes after his father's side." The elder said: "But is there, great king, any lotus, a hundred-petalled one?" "Yes, venerable sir, there is." "But where is its origin?" "It is born in mud and grows in water." "Is the lotus, great king, similar to the mud in colour or in odour or in flavour?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Then is it similar to the water in odour or in flavour?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, the Blessed One is endowed with the thirty-two characteristics of a great man and adorned with the eighty minor features, gold-coloured, with skin resembling gold, with a fathom-wide radiance, yet his mother and father were not endowed with the thirty-two characteristics of a great man and adorned with the eighty minor features, gold-coloured, with skin resembling gold, with a fathom-wide radiance."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the marks of a great man is the third.

4.

The Question on the Blessed One's Holy Life

4. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is the Buddha a practitioner of the holy life?" "Yes, great king, the Blessed One is a practitioner of the holy life." "If so, Venerable Nāgasena, the Buddha is a pupil of Brahmā?" "But do you, great king, have a chief elephant?" "There is, venerable sir." "Does that elephant, great king, ever at some time trumpet the cry of a heron?" "Yes, venerable sir, it trumpets." "If so, great king, that elephant is a pupil of the heron bird?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But then, great king, is Brahmā with a Buddha or without a Buddha?" "With a Buddha, venerable sir." "If so, great king, Brahmā is a pupil of the Blessed One."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the Blessed One's holy life is the fourth.

5.

The Question on the Blessed One's Full Ordination

5. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is full ordination beautiful?" "Yes, great king, full ordination is beautiful." "But, venerable sir, is there full ordination for the Buddha, or is there not?" "The Blessed One, great king, was fully ordained at the foot of the Bodhi tree together with the knowledge of omniscience; there is no full ordination given to the Blessed One by others. Just as, great king, the Blessed One lays down a training rule for disciples not to be transgressed for life."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the Blessed One's full ordination is the fifth.

6.

The Question on Tears Being Medicine and Non-medicine

6. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, one who weeps when his mother has died, and one who weeps out of love for the teaching - of these two who are weeping, whose tears are medicine, whose are not medicine?" "For one, great king, the tears are impure and hot due to lust, hate and delusion; for one they are pure and cool due to joy and pleasure. That which is cool, great king, that is medicine; that which is hot, that is not medicine."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on tears being medicine and non-medicine is the sixth.

7.

The Question on the Difference between One with Lust and One without Lust

7. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the difference between one with lust and one without lust?" "One, great king, is attached, one is unattached." "What is this, venerable sir, called attached and unattached?" "One, great king, is desirous, one is not desirous." "I see, venerable sir, such a thing: both one with lust and one without lust, all of them wish only for beautiful solid food or soft food; no one wishes for evil." "One not free from lust, great king, eats food experiencing the flavour and experiencing lust for the flavour; but one without lust eats food experiencing the flavour, but not experiencing lust for the flavour."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the difference between one with lust and one without lust is the seventh.

8.

The Question on the Support of Wisdom

8. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, where does wisdom dwell?" "Nowhere, great king." "If so, Venerable Nāgasena, there is no wisdom." "Where does the wind dwell, great king?" "Nowhere, venerable sir." "If so, great king, there is no wind."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the support of wisdom is the eighth.

9.

The Question on the Round of Rebirths

9. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'wandering in the round of rebirths', which is that wandering in the round of rebirths?" "Here, great king, one born here dies right here, having died here arises elsewhere, having been born there dies right there, having died there arises elsewhere; thus, great king, is the wandering in the round of rebirths." "Give a simile." "Just as, great king, some man, having eaten a ripe mango, might plant the seed, from that a great mango tree having arisen would give fruits, then that man, having eaten a ripe mango from that too, might plant the seed, from that too a great mango tree having arisen would give fruits; thus the end of these trees is not discerned. Just so indeed, great king, one born here dies right here, having died here arises elsewhere, having been born there dies right there, having died there arises elsewhere; thus, great king, is the wandering in the round of rebirths."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the round of rebirths is the ninth.

10.

The Question on Refuge Made Long Ago

10. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, by what does one remember what was done long ago in the past?" "By mindfulness, great king." "Is it not so, Venerable Nāgasena, that one remembers by consciousness, not by mindfulness?" "Do you recall, great king, having done some task and then forgotten it?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Were you then, great king, without consciousness at that time?" "No indeed, venerable sir, mindfulness was not present at that time." "Then why, great king, do you say thus: 'One remembers by consciousness, not by mindfulness'?"

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on refuge made long ago is the tenth.

11.

The Question on Mindfulness of One Who Directly Knows

11. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, does all mindfulness arise as directly knowing, or is there also mindfulness that is produced?" "Both directly knowing, great king, and also produced mindfulness." "If indeed, Venerable Nāgasena, all mindfulness is directly knowing, there is no produced mindfulness?" "If there is not, great king, produced mindfulness, there is nothing to be done by craftsmen through work-fields or craft-fields or fields of knowledge, teachers would be useless. But because, great king, there is produced mindfulness, therefore there is something to be done through work-fields or craft-fields or fields of knowledge, and there is use for teachers."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on mindfulness of one who directly knows is the eleventh.

The Chapter on Mindfulness is the sixth.

In this chapter there are eleven questions.

7.

The Chapter on the Process of Formless States

1.

The Question on the Arising of Mindfulness

1. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, in how many ways does mindfulness arise?" "In seventeen ways, great king, mindfulness arises." "In which seventeen ways?" "Through direct knowing, great king, mindfulness arises; through a reminder, mindfulness arises; through gross consciousness, mindfulness arises; through consciousness of welfare, mindfulness arises; through consciousness of harm, mindfulness arises; through a similar sign, mindfulness arises; through a dissimilar sign, mindfulness arises; through recognition by speech, mindfulness arises; through a characteristic, mindfulness arises; through reminding, mindfulness arises; through a seal, mindfulness arises; through counting, mindfulness arises; through retention, mindfulness arises; through meditation, mindfulness arises; through binding to a book, mindfulness arises; through depositing, mindfulness arises; through experience, mindfulness arises.

"How does mindfulness arise through direct knowing? Just as, great king, the Venerable Ānanda and the female lay follower Khujjuttarā, or whoever else remembers former births, remember their births, thus mindfulness arises through direct knowing.

"How does mindfulness arise through a reminder? Whoever is by nature forgetful, and others bind him for the purpose of making him remember, thus mindfulness arises through a reminder.

"How does mindfulness arise through gross consciousness? When one is consecrated in a kingdom, or when one has attained the fruition of stream-entry, thus mindfulness arises through gross consciousness.

"How does mindfulness arise through consciousness of welfare? In whatever situation one was made happy, one remembers 'In such and such a situation I was thus made happy,' thus mindfulness arises through consciousness of welfare.

"How does mindfulness arise through consciousness of harm? In whatever situation one was made to suffer, one remembers 'In such and such a situation I was thus made to suffer,' thus mindfulness arises through consciousness of harm.

"How does mindfulness arise through a similar sign? Having seen a similar person, one remembers one's mother or father or brother or sister; having seen a camel or an ox or a donkey, one remembers another such camel or ox or donkey, thus mindfulness arises through a similar sign.

"How does mindfulness arise through a dissimilar sign? One remembers 'The colour of so-and-so is like this, the sound is like this, the odour is like this, the flavour is like this, the tangible object is like this,' thus also mindfulness arises through a dissimilar sign.

"How does mindfulness arise through recognition by speech? Whoever is by nature forgetful, others remind him, and by that he remembers, thus mindfulness arises through recognition by speech.

"How does mindfulness arise through a characteristic? Whoever by nature knows oxen by their limbs, knows by their characteristics, thus mindfulness arises through a characteristic.

"How does mindfulness arise through reminding? Whoever is by nature forgetful, whoever reminds him again and again 'Remember, friend, remember, friend,' thus mindfulness arises through reminding.

"How does mindfulness arise through a seal? Because of having trained in writing, one knows 'After this letter, this letter should be made,' thus mindfulness arises through a seal.

"How does mindfulness arise through counting? Because of having trained in counting, accountants count even much, thus mindfulness arises through counting.

"How does mindfulness arise through retention? Because of having trained in retention, retainers retain even much, thus mindfulness arises through retention.

"How does mindfulness arise from meditation? Here a monk recollects manifold past lives, that is, one birth, two births, etc. Thus with aspects and terms he recollects past lives; in this way mindfulness arises from meditation.

"How does mindfulness arise from binding to a book? Kings, not remembering an instruction, say 'Bring that book'; by that book they remember; in this way mindfulness arises from binding to a book.

"How does mindfulness arise from depositing? Having seen goods placed in deposit, one remembers; in this way mindfulness arises from depositing.

"How does mindfulness arise from what has been experienced? Because of having been seen, one remembers form; because of having been heard, one remembers sound; because of having been smelled, one remembers odour; because of having been tasted, one remembers flavour; because of having been touched, one remembers tangible object; because of having been cognized, one remembers mental phenomena; in this way mindfulness arises from what has been experienced. By these seventeen ways, great king, mindfulness arises."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the arising of mindfulness is the first.

2.

The Question on Attaining Mindfulness of the Buddha's Virtues

2. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'whoever would do unwholesome deeds for a hundred years, and at the time of death would obtain mindfulness of one virtue of the Buddha, he would arise among the gods' - I do not believe this; and yet you say 'by this killing of living beings one would arise in hell' - I do not believe this either."

"What do you think, great king, would even a small stone float on the water without a boat?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "What then, great king, would even a hundred cartloads of stones placed on a boat float on the water?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Just as, great king, the boat, so wholesome actions should be seen."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on attaining mindfulness of the Buddha's virtues is the second.

3.

The Question on Effort for the Abandoning of Suffering

3. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, do you strive for the abandoning of past suffering?" "No indeed, great king." "But do you, venerable sir, strive for the abandoning of future suffering?" "No indeed, great king." "But do you strive for the abandoning of present suffering?" "No indeed, great king." "If you do not strive for the abandoning of past suffering, do not strive for the abandoning of future suffering, do not strive for the abandoning of present suffering, then for what purpose do you strive?" The elder said: "So that, great king, this suffering might cease, and other suffering might not arise - for this purpose we strive."

"But is there, venerable Nāgasena, future suffering for you?" "There is not, great king." "You, venerable Nāgasena, are too clever, you who strive for the abandoning of non-existing future sufferings?" "But are there, great king, any hostile kings, adversaries, enemies present for you?" "Yes, venerable sir, there is." "Would you then, great king, have a moat dug, have a wall built, have a gateway built, have a watchtower built, have grain brought in?" "No indeed, venerable sir, that has been prepared beforehand." "Would you, great king, then train in elephants, train in horses, train in chariots, train in bows, train in swords?" "No indeed, venerable sir, that has been trained beforehand." "For what purpose?" "For the purpose of warding off future dangers, venerable sir." "Is there, great king, future danger?" "There is not, venerable sir." "You too, great king, are too clever, you who prepare for the purpose of warding off non-existing future dangers."

"Give a further simile." "What do you think, great king, when you were thirsty, would you then have a well dug, have a pond dug, have a lake dug, thinking 'I will drink water'?" "No indeed, venerable sir, that has been prepared beforehand." "For what purpose?" "For the purpose of warding off future thirst, venerable sir, it has been prepared." "But is there, great king, future thirst?" "There is not, venerable sir." "You, great king, are too clever, you who prepare that for the purpose of warding off non-existing future thirst."

"Give a further simile." "What do you think, great king, when you were hungry, would you then have a field ploughed, have rice sown, thinking 'I will eat a meal'?" "No indeed, venerable sir, that has been prepared beforehand." "For what purpose?" "For the purpose of warding off future hunger, venerable sir." "But is there, great king, future hunger?" "There is not, venerable sir." "You, great king, are too clever, you who prepare for the purpose of warding off non-existing future hunger."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on effort for the abandoning of suffering is the third.

4.

The Question on the Brahma World

4. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, how far from here is the Brahma world?" "The Brahma world is far from here, great king. A stone the size of a pinnacle building falling from there, descending forty-eight thousand yojanas in a day and night, would reach the earth in four months."

"Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'just as a strong man might extend his bent arm or bend his extended arm, even so a monk possessing supernormal power, having attained mastery of mind, having vanished from the Indian subcontinent, might appear in the Brahma world' - I do not believe this statement, that he would go so many hundreds of yojanas so extremely quickly."

The elder said: "But where, great king, is your birthplace?" "There is, venerable sir, an island named Alasanda; I was born there." "How far, great king, is Alasanda from here?" "About two hundred yojanas, venerable sir." "Do you recall, great king, having done some task there, remembering it?" "Yes, venerable sir, I remember." "Quickly indeed, great king, you have gone about two hundred yojanas."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the Brahma world is the fourth.

5.

The Question on the Equal State of Two Beings Arisen in the World

5. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, one who has died here and would arise in the Brahma world, and one who has died here and would arise in Kashmir - which takes longer, which is quicker?" "The same, great king."

"Give a simile." "But where, great king, is your birthplace?" "There is, venerable sir, a village named Kalasi; I was born there." "How far, great king, is the village of Kalasi from here?" "About two hundred yojanas, venerable sir." "How far, great king, is Kashmir from here?" "Twelve yojanas, venerable sir." "Come now, great king, think of the village of Kalasi." "It has been thought of, venerable sir." "Come now, great king, think of Kashmir." "It has been thought of, venerable sir." "Which indeed, great king, took longer to think of, which was quicker?" "The same, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, one who has died here and would arise in the Brahma world, and one who has died here and would arise in Kashmir - they arise in the same time."

"Give a further simile." "What do you think, great king, if two birds were to go through the sky, and one of them were to settle on a high tree, and one were to settle on a low tree, when they have settled at the same time, whose shadow would first become established on the ground, whose shadow would become established on the ground after a long time?" "The same, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, one who has died here and would arise in the Brahma world, and one who has died here and would arise in Kashmir - they arise in the same time."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the equal state of two beings arisen in the world is the fifth.

6.

The Question on the Factors of Enlightenment

6. The king said: "How many, venerable Nāgasena, are the factors of enlightenment?" "There are seven factors of enlightenment, great king." "But with how many factors of enlightenment, venerable sir, does one become enlightened?" "With one factor of enlightenment, great king, one becomes enlightened - with the enlightenment factor of investigation of phenomena." "Then why, venerable sir, are they called 'seven factors of enlightenment'?" "What do you think, great king, does a sword thrown into a sheath, not grasped by the hand, have the ability to cut what is to be cut?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so, great king, without the enlightenment factor of investigation of phenomena, with the six factors of enlightenment one does not become enlightened."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the factors of enlightenment is the sixth.

7.

The Question on the Smallness and Greatness of Evil and Merit

7. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, which indeed is more, merit or demerit?" "Merit indeed, great king, is more; demerit is little." "For what reason?" "One doing demerit, great king, becomes remorseful: 'An evil deed was done by me,' therefore evil does not grow. One doing merit, great king, is not remorseful; for one not remorseful, gladness arises; in one who is gladdened, rapture arises; when the mind is filled with rapture, the body becomes calm; one whose body is calm feels happiness; the mind of one who is happy becomes concentrated; one who is concentrated understands as it really is; for that reason merit grows. A man, great king, with hands and feet cut off, having given one bundle of water-lilies to the Blessed One, will not go to the nether world for ninety-one cosmic cycles. By this reason too, great king, I say: 'Merit is more, demerit is little.'"

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the smallness and greatness of evil and merit is the seventh.

8.

The Question on Doing Evil Knowingly and Unknowingly

8. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, one who knowing commits an evil deed, one who not knowing commits an evil deed, for whom is there more demerit?" The elder said: "Whoever indeed, great king, not knowing commits an evil deed, for him there is more demerit." "If so, Venerable Nāgasena, whoever among our princes or chief ministers not knowing commits an evil deed, do we punish him twofold?" "What do you think, great king, a red-hot iron ball, blazing, in flames, aglow - one knowing might grasp it, one not knowing might grasp it - which one would be burnt more severely?" "Whoever indeed, venerable sir, not knowing might grasp it, he would be burnt more severely." "Just so indeed, great king, whoever not knowing commits an evil deed, for him there is more demerit."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on doing evil knowingly and unknowingly is the eighth.

9.

The Question on Going to Uttarakuru and So On

9. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is there anyone who could go to Uttarakuru with this body, or to the Brahma world, or else to another island?" "There is, great king, one who could go to Uttarakuru with this body consisting of the four great elements, or to the Brahma world, or else to another island."

"How, Venerable Nāgasena, could one go to Uttarakuru with this body consisting of the four great elements, or to the Brahma world, or else to another island?" "Do you recall, great king, having jumped a span or a cubit on this earth?" "Yes, venerable sir, I recall 'I, Venerable Nāgasena, jump even eight cubits.'" "How do you, great king, jump even eight cubits?" "I, venerable sir, produce the thought 'I will land here' - together with the arising of the thought my body becomes light." "Just so indeed, great king, a monk possessing supernormal power, having attained mastery of mind, having placed the body upon the mind, goes through the sky by the power of mind."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on going to Uttarakuru and so on is the ninth.

10.

The Question on Long Bones

10. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, you say thus 'bones are long, even a hundred yojanas,' but there is not even a tree a hundred yojanas tall, how then could there be bones a hundred yojanas long?"

"What do you think, great king, have you heard 'in the great ocean there are fish even five hundred yojanas in size'?" "Yes, venerable sir, I have heard." "Is it not, great king, that a fish five hundred yojanas in size would have bones that are long, even a hundred yojanas?"

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on long bones is the tenth.

11.

The Question on the Cessation of In-breath and Out-breath

11. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, do you say thus 'it is possible to stop the in-breath and out-breath'?" "Yes, great king, it is possible to stop the in-breath and out-breath." "How, venerable Nāgasena, is it possible to stop the in-breath and out-breath?" "What do you think, great king, have you ever heard anyone snoring?" "Yes, venerable sir, I have heard." "Would that sound, great king, cease when the body is bent?" "Yes, venerable sir, it would cease." "If indeed, great king, that sound of one with undeveloped body, undeveloped morality, undeveloped mind, undeveloped wisdom will cease when the body is bent, how then will the in-breath and out-breath not cease for one with developed body, developed morality, developed mind, developed wisdom who has attained the fourth meditative absorption?"

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the cessation of in-breath and out-breath is the eleventh.

12.

The Question on the Ocean

12. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, 'the ocean, the ocean' is said; for what reason is water called 'the ocean'?" The elder said: "However much, great king, there is water, that much there is salt. However much there is salt, that much there is water. Therefore it is called 'the ocean'."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the ocean is the twelfth.

13.

The Question on the Ocean Having One Flavour

13. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, for what reason does the ocean have one flavour, the flavour of salt?" "Because of the water having been established for a long time, great king, the ocean has one flavour, the flavour of salt."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the ocean having one flavour is the thirteenth.

14.

The Question on the Subtle

14. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, is it possible to cut all that is subtle?" "Yes, great king, it is possible to cut all that is subtle." "But what, venerable sir, is all subtle?" "Mental phenomena, great king, are all subtle; but not all mental phenomena are subtle, great king. 'Subtle' or 'gross' - this is a designation for mental phenomena. Whatever is to be cut, all that is cut by wisdom; there is no second cutting by wisdom."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the subtle is the fourteenth.

15.

The Question on the Different Meanings of Consciousness

15. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, 'consciousness' or 'wisdom' or 'soul in what has come to be' - are these phenomena different in meaning and different in phrasing, or are they one in meaning and only different in phrasing?" "Cognition is the characteristic of consciousness, great king; understanding is the characteristic of wisdom; a soul in what has come to be is not found." "If a soul is not found, then who now sees form with the eye, hears sound with the ear, smells odour with the nose, tastes flavour with the tongue, touches tangible object with the body, cognizes mental phenomena with the mind?" The elder said: "If a soul sees form with the eye... etc. cognizes mental phenomena with the mind, that soul, when the eye-doors are torn out, facing outward with the great space, would see form more clearly; when the ears are torn out, when the nose is torn out, when the tongue is torn out, when the body is torn out, with the great space, would hear sound more clearly, would smell odour, would taste flavour, would touch tangible object?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "If so, great king, a soul in what has come to be is not found."

"You are clever, Venerable Nāgasena."

The question on the different meanings of consciousness is the fifteenth.

16.

The Question on the Difficulty of Defining Immaterial Phenomena

16. The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, has something difficult been done by the Blessed One?" The elder said: "Something difficult, great king, has been done by the Blessed One." "But what, Venerable Nāgasena, has been done by the Blessed One that is difficult?" "Something difficult, great king, has been done by the Blessed One: the defining of these immaterial mental states of consciousness and mental factors occurring with a single object has been declared: 'This is contact, this is feeling, this is perception, this is volition, this is consciousness.'"

"Give a simile." "Just as, great king, some man, having plunged into the great ocean by boat, having taken water with a cupped hand, having tasted it with his tongue, would he know, great king, that man: 'This is water of the Ganges, this is water of the Yamunā, this is water of the Aciravatī, this is water of the Sarabhū, this is water of the Mahī'?" "It is difficult, venerable sir, to know." "More difficult than this indeed, great king, has been done by the Blessed One: the defining of these immaterial mental states of consciousness and mental factors occurring with a single object has been declared: 'This is contact, this is feeling, this is perception, this is volition, this is consciousness.'" "Well said, venerable sir," the king rejoiced.

The question on the difficulty of defining immaterial phenomena is the sixteenth.

The Chapter on Defining Immaterial Phenomena is the seventh.

In this chapter there are sixteen questions.

Questions and Answers of Milinda

The elder said: "Do you know, great king, what time it is now?" "Yes, venerable sir, I know: 'Now the first watch has passed, the middle watch is proceeding, torches are being lit, four banners have been commanded to go from the treasury as royal gifts.'"

The Greeks said thus: "You are clever, great king, the elder is wise." "Yes, my good men, the elder is wise; if such were the teacher and such as I the pupil, before long a wise person would understand the Teaching." The king, pleased with his answering of questions, having covered the elder Nāgasena with a woollen blanket worth a hundred thousand, said: "Venerable Nāgasena, from this day forth I provide you with eight hundred meals; whatever is allowable in the inner palace, with that I invite you." "Enough, great king, I am living." "I know, Venerable Nāgasena, you are living, but protect yourself and protect me." "How do you protect yourself? Lest the reproach of others should come: 'Nāgasena pleases King Milinda, but did not obtain anything' - thus protect yourself. How do you protect me? Lest the reproach of others should come: 'King Milinda is pleased but does not show a sign of his pleasure' - thus protect me." "Let it be so, great king." "Just as, venerable sir, a lion, the king of beasts, even when placed in a golden cage, faces outward, just so indeed I, venerable sir, although I dwell in a house, I remain facing outward. If I, venerable sir, were to go forth from home into homelessness, I would not live long; I have many enemies."

Then the Venerable Nāgasena, having answered King Milinda's questions, having risen from his seat, went to the monastery. And when the Venerable Nāgasena had recently departed, this occurred to King Milinda: "What was asked by me, what was answered by the venerable Nāgasena?" Then this occurred to King Milinda: "Everything was well asked by me, everything was well answered by the venerable Nāgasena." And to the Venerable Nāgasena too, who had gone to the monastery, this occurred: "What was asked by King Milinda, what was answered by me?" Then this occurred to the Venerable Nāgasena: "Everything was well asked by King Milinda, everything was well answered by me."

Then the Venerable Nāgasena, after that night had passed, having dressed in the earlier period of the day, taking his bowl and robe, approached the dwelling of King Milinda; having approached, he sat down on the prepared seat. Then King Milinda, having paid respect to the Venerable Nāgasena, sat down to one side. Seated to one side, King Milinda said this to the Venerable Nāgasena:

"Let it not be thus for the venerable sir: 'Nāgasena was asked questions by me' - that with that very pleasure you spent the remainder of the night - it should not be seen thus by you. For me, venerable sir, during the remainder of the night, this occurred: 'What was asked by me, what was answered by the venerable sir?' - 'Everything was well asked by me, everything was well answered by the venerable sir.'"

The elder also said thus - "Let not the great king think thus: 'The question was answered by me to King Milinda' - that you spent the remainder of the night with that very pleasure - it should not be seen thus by you. For me, great king, during the remainder of that night, this occurred: 'What was asked by King Milinda, what was answered by me?' - 'All was well asked by King Milinda, all was well answered by me.'" Thus those two great beings gave thanks to each other's well-spoken words.

The Questions and Answers of Milinda's Questions are concluded.

Prologue on the Dilemmas

Eight Places to be Avoided for Incantations

Then King Milinda, when the night became light, when dawn rose, having washed his head, having raised joined palms on his head, having recollected the perfectly Self-awakened Ones of the past, future, and present, took upon himself eight duty-practices: "For the next seven days from now, having taken upon myself eight virtues, austere asceticism will have to be practised by me; I, having practised austere asceticism, having pleased the teacher, will ask the sheep-like questions." Then King Milinda, having removed his ordinary suit of garments and having taken off his ornaments, having put on the ochre robe, having fastened a shaven-head covering on his head, having entered the state of a sage, took upon himself eight virtues: "For this week, royal business should not be instructed by me, a mind connected with lust should not be produced, a mind connected with hate should not be produced, a mind connected with delusion should not be produced, even towards slaves, workmen and servants, there should be humble conduct, bodily and verbal conduct should be guarded, the six sense bases should be guarded without remainder, the mind should be placed in the development of friendliness." Having taken upon himself these eight virtues, having established his mind in those very eight virtues, not going outside, having spent a week, on the eighth day, when the night became light, having taken the morning meal early, with eyes downcast, speaking moderately, with well-composed deportment, with undistracted mind, joyful, elated, clear-minded, having approached the elder Nāgasena, having paid homage with his head at the elder's feet, standing to one side, he said this -

"There is, Venerable Nāgasena, a certain matter to be discussed by me together with you; no other third person should be desired therein, in an empty place, in a secluded forest, endowed with eight factors, suitable for an ascetic. There that question will have to be asked; there nothing should be made secret by me, not confidential; I am worthy to hear what is confidential when a good discussion has been reached; that matter should be examined even by simile. Like what? Just as, Venerable Nāgasena, the great earth is worthy of receiving what is cast upon it when casting has been reached. Just so indeed, Venerable Nāgasena, I am worthy to hear what is confidential when a good discussion has been reached." Having entered a secluded forest grove together with the teacher, he said this - "Venerable Nāgasena, here eight places should be avoided by a man wishing to discuss; a wise man does not discuss a matter in those places; even a discussed matter falls to ruin and does not come to be. Which eight places? An uneven place should be avoided, a fearful place should be avoided, an excessively windy place should be avoided, a concealed place should be avoided, a temple of a deity should be avoided, a road should be avoided, a battle should be avoided, a water landing place should be avoided. These eight places should be avoided."

The elder said: "What is the fault in an uneven place, in a fearful place, in an excessively windy place, in a concealed place, in a temple of a deity, on a road, in a battle, at a water landing place?" "In an uneven place, Venerable Nāgasena, a discussed matter scatters, disperses, oozes away, and does not come to be; in a fearful place the mind becomes extremely parched; extremely parched, one does not rightly perceive the matter; in an excessively windy place the sound becomes obscure; in a concealed place they stand listening; in a temple of a deity a discussed matter turns out to be serious; on a road a discussed matter becomes hollow; in a battle it becomes unsteady; at a water landing place it becomes unconcealed. Here it is said -

Eight places to be avoided for consultation.

Eight Persons who Destroy Incantations

"Venerable Nāgasena, these eight persons, when being consulted, destroy the matter discussed. What are the eight? One of lustful temperament, one of hateful temperament, one of deluded temperament, one of conceited temperament, a greedy one, a lazy one, one who thinks alone, and a fool. These eight persons destroy the matter discussed."

The elder said: "What is the fault in them?" "One of lustful temperament, venerable Nāgasena, destroys the matter discussed through the influence of lust; one of hateful temperament destroys the matter discussed through the influence of hate; one of deluded temperament destroys the matter discussed through the influence of delusion; one of conceited temperament destroys the matter discussed through the influence of conceit; a greedy one destroys the matter discussed through the influence of greed; a lazy one destroys the matter discussed through laziness; one who thinks alone destroys the matter discussed through thinking alone; a fool destroys the matter discussed through foolishness. Here it is said -

Eight persons who destroy counsel.

Nine Destroyers of Secret Incantations

"Venerable Nāgasena, these nine persons reveal a secret discussed and do not keep it. Which nine? One of lustful temperament, one of hateful temperament, one of deluded temperament, a coward, one interested in worldly gain, a woman, a drunkard, a eunuch, and a child."

The elder said: "What is the fault in them?" "One of lustful temperament, venerable Nāgasena, reveals a secret discussed through the influence of lust and does not keep it; one of hateful temperament, venerable sir, reveals a secret discussed through the influence of hate and does not keep it; a deluded one reveals a secret discussed through the influence of delusion and does not keep it; a coward reveals a secret discussed through the influence of fear and does not keep it; one interested in worldly gain reveals a secret discussed because of material gains and does not keep it; a woman reveals a secret discussed because of the weakness of her wisdom and does not keep it; a drunkard reveals a secret discussed because of craving for liquor and does not keep it; a eunuch reveals a secret discussed because of uncertainty and does not keep it; a child reveals a secret discussed because of fickleness and does not keep it. Here it is said -

Nine persons who destroy secret counsel.

Eight Causes for Attaining Wisdom

"Venerable Nāgasena, by eight causes full understanding matures and reaches ripeness. Which eight? By the maturing of age full understanding matures and reaches ripeness; by the maturing of fame full understanding matures and reaches ripeness; by questioning full understanding matures and reaches ripeness; by dwelling at a ford full understanding matures and reaches ripeness; by wise attention full understanding matures and reaches ripeness; by discussion full understanding matures and reaches ripeness; by cultivating affection full understanding matures and reaches ripeness; by dwelling in a suitable place full understanding matures and reaches ripeness. Here it is said -

Eight causes for the attainment of wisdom.

Virtues of a Teacher

"Venerable Nāgasena, this piece of ground is free from the eight faults of consultation, and I am the supreme companion in counsel in the world, and I am a keeper of secrets - as long as I shall live, so long shall I keep the secret; and by eight causes my full understanding has reached maturity. Rare nowadays is a pupil like me. When a pupil is rightly practising, there are twenty-five qualities of a teacher towards teachers; with those qualities a teacher should rightly proceed. What are the twenty-five qualities?

"Here, venerable Nāgasena, a teacher should constantly and continuously establish protection for a pupil, what should not be associated with and what should be associated with should be known, the heedless and the heedful should be known, the sleeping place should be known, sickness should be known, whether food has been obtained or not obtained should be known, distinction should be known, what has come into the bowl should be shared, he should be encouraged 'Do not fear, the benefit is progressing for you,' 'He is dealing with this person' - the dealing should be known, the dealing in the village should be known, the dealing in the monastery should be known, laughter and jest should not be made with him, conversation should be made with him, having seen a fault it should be tolerated, one should be one who acts attentively, one should be one who acts without breaking, one should be one who acts without secrecy, one should be one who acts without remainder, 'I generate this one in the crafts' - the productive thought should be established, 'How may this one not decline' - the thought of growth should be established, 'I make this one powerful by the power of training' - the thought should be established, a friendly thought should be established, in misfortunes he should not be abandoned, in what is to be done there should be no negligence, when there is a stumble he should be supported by the Teaching. These, venerable sir, are the twenty-five qualities of a teacher for a teacher. Proceed rightly towards me with those qualities. A doubt has arisen in me, venerable sir. There are the ram-like questions spoken by the Conqueror; in the future time strife will arise concerning them, and in the future time those of intelligence like you will be rare. Give me vision in those questions for the refutation of the doctrines of others."

Virtues of a Lay Follower

The elder, having received it saying "Good!", illuminated the ten qualities of a lay follower for a lay follower. "These are the ten qualities of a lay follower for a lay follower, great king. What are the ten? Here, great king, a lay follower shares happiness and suffering with the Community, takes the Teaching as authority, delights in sharing according to his strength, having seen the decline of the Conqueror's Dispensation, strives for its growth. He holds right view, is free from superstitious beliefs in auspicious signs, even for the sake of his life does not point to another teacher, his bodily and verbal conduct is guarded, he rejoices in concord, delights in concord, is not envious, and does not practise in the Dispensation by means of scheming, he has gone for refuge to the Buddha, he has gone for refuge to the Teaching, he has gone for refuge to the Community. These, great king, are the ten qualities of a lay follower for a lay follower. All those qualities are found in you. It is fitting for you, proper, befitting, suitable that you, having seen the decline of the Conqueror's Dispensation, wish for its growth. I give you permission; ask me as you please."

The Introductory Discourse to the Sheep-like Questions is concluded.

4.

The Dilemmas

1.

The Chapter on the Supernormal Power

1.

The Question on the Fruitfulness of Aspiration Made

1. Then King Milinda, having been granted an opportunity, having bowed down and placed his joined palms on his head at the feet of the venerable one, said this: "Venerable Nāgasena, these sectarians speak thus: 'If the Buddha consents to veneration, the Buddha has not attained final Nibbāna, is connected with the world, is within existence in the world, is common to the world; therefore the aspiration made towards him is not barren but fruitful. If he has attained final Nibbāna, is unbound from the world, has escaped from all existences, veneration towards him does not arise, one who has attained final Nibbāna does not consent to anything, the aspiration made towards one who does not consent is barren and fruitless' - this is a question with two points, this is not the domain of those whose minds have not attained, this is only the domain of the great; break this net of wrong views, establish it on one side, this question has come to you, give vision to the future sons of the Conqueror for the refutation of the doctrines of others."

The elder said: "The Blessed One, great king, has attained final Nibbāna, and the Blessed One does not consent to veneration; at the very foot of the Bodhi tree the Tathāgata's consenting was abandoned, how much more so for one who has attained final Nibbāna through the Nibbāna element without residue of clinging. This too was spoken, great king, by the elder Sāriputta, the General of the Teaching -

The king said: "Venerable Nāgasena, either a son praises his father, or a father praises his son; this is not a reason for the refutation of the doctrines of others, this is merely a declaration of confidence. Come, explain to me the reason there properly for the establishment of one's own doctrine and for the unravelling of the net of wrong views."

The elder said: "The Blessed One, great king, has attained final Nibbāna, and the Blessed One does not consent to veneration; yet even though the Tathāgata does not consent, gods and humans, having made the relic-jewel a basis, practising right practice with the knowledge-jewel of the Tathāgata as object, obtain the three successes.

"Just as, great king, a great, large mass of fire, having blazed up, might be quenched - does, great king, that great mass of fire consent to grass and wood as fuel?" "Even while burning, venerable sir, that great mass of fire does not consent to grass and wood as fuel; how then would one quenched, at peace, without consciousness consent?" "But when, great king, that mass of fire has ceased and is at peace, is the world empty of fire?" "No indeed, venerable sir, wood is the basis and fuel for fire; whatever people desire fire, they, by their own strength, power and energy, by their own personal effort, having churned wood, having produced fire, with that fire perform tasks requiring fire." "If so, great king, the word of the sectarians is wrong: 'The aspiration made towards one who does not consent is barren and fruitless.'

"Just as, great king, a great, large mass of fire blazed, just so the Blessed One blazed with the Buddha's glory in the ten-thousand-fold world system. Just as, great king, a great, large mass of fire, having blazed, was quenched, just so the Blessed One, having blazed with the Buddha's glory in the ten-thousand-fold world system, attained final Nibbāna through the Nibbāna element without residue of clinging. Just as, great king, a quenched mass of fire does not consent to grass and wood as fuel, just so indeed the consenting of the Benefactor of the World has been abandoned, is at peace. Just as, great king, people, when the mass of fire is quenched, without fuel, by their own strength, power and energy, by their own personal effort, having churned wood, having produced fire, with that fire perform tasks requiring fire, just so indeed gods and humans, having made the relic-jewel of the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, a basis, practising right practice with the knowledge-jewel of the Tathāgata as object, obtain the three successes. By this reason too, great king, the aspiration made towards the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, is not barren but fruitful.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a reason by which reason the aspiration made towards the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, is not barren but fruitful. Just as, great king, a great, large wind, having blown, might cease - does, great king, that ceased wind consent to being reproduced?" "No indeed, venerable sir, for the ceased wind there is no reflective attention or attention for reproduction." "What is the reason?" "That air element is without consciousness." "Does, great king, the designation 'wind' depart from that ceased wind?" "No indeed, venerable sir, palm-leaf fans and fans are conditions for the arising of wind; whatever people are scorched by heat, oppressed by fever, they, with a palm-leaf fan or with a fan, by their own strength, power and energy, by their own personal effort, having produced that, with that wind extinguish the heat and appease the fever." "If so, great king, the word of the sectarians is wrong: 'The aspiration made towards one who does not consent is barren and fruitless.'

"Just as, great king, a great mighty wind blew, just so the Blessed One blew towards the ten-thousand-fold world system with the cool, sweet, peaceful, subtle wind of friendliness. Just as, great king, a great mighty wind, having blown, ceased, just so the Blessed One, having blown towards with the cool, sweet, peaceful, subtle wind of friendliness, attained final Nibbāna through the Nibbāna element without residue of clinging. Just as, great king, the ceased wind does not consent to being reproduced, just so the consenting to the welfare of the world has been abandoned, is at peace. Just as, great king, those people are scorched by heat, oppressed by fever, just so gods and humans are oppressed by the fever of the heat of the threefold fire. Just as palm-leaf fans are conditions for the production of wind, just so the relic and the knowledge-jewel of the Tathāgata are conditions for the attainment of the three successes. Just as people scorched by heat, oppressed by fever, having produced wind with a palm-leaf or a fan, extinguish the heat and appease the fever, just so gods and humans, having venerated the relic and the knowledge-jewel of the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, having produced wholesome, by that wholesome extinguish and appease the fever of the heat of the threefold fire. By this reason too, great king, the aspiration made towards the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, is not barren but fruitful.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a reason for the refutation of the doctrines of others. Just as, great king, a man, having beaten a drum, might produce a sound, and that drum sound produced by the man, that sound might disappear, does that sound, great king, consent to being reproduced?" "No indeed, venerable sir, that sound has disappeared, there is no reflective attention or attention for its arising again; once the drum sound has arisen and disappeared, that drum sound is cut off. But the drum, venerable sir, is a condition for the production of sound; then a man, when the condition exists, having beaten the drum with self-produced effort, produces a sound." "Just so indeed, great king, the Blessed One, having established the relic-jewel and the Teaching and the discipline and the instruction, the Teacher developed in morality, concentration, wisdom, liberation, and knowledge and vision of liberation, himself attained final Nibbāna through the Nibbāna element without residue of clinging; and when the Blessed One has attained final Nibbāna, the attainment of success is not cut off; beings oppressed by the suffering of existence, having made the relic-jewel and the Teaching and the discipline and the instruction a condition, desiring success, obtain successes. By this reason too, great king, the aspiration made towards the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, is not barren but fruitful.

"And this was seen, great king, by the Blessed One regarding the future time. And it was spoken and said and declared: 'Now, Ānanda, you might think thus: "The Scriptures belong to a Teacher who has passed away, we have no Teacher." But this, Ānanda, should not be seen thus. The Teaching and the discipline that have been taught and laid down by me for you, Ānanda, they will be your Teacher after my passing.' That the aspiration made towards the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, is barren and fruitless - that word of those sectarians is wrong, not become, false, untrue, opposed, perverted, giving suffering, with painful results, leading to realms of misery.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a reason by which reason the aspiration made towards the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, is not barren but fruitful. Does this great earth, great king, consent: 'Let all seeds grow in me'?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But why then, great king, do those seeds, having grown in the great earth that does not consent, become established with firm roots and matted roots, spread out with trunk, substance, and branches, bearing flowers and fruit?" "Even though not consenting, venerable sir, the great earth is a site for those seeds, gives a condition for their growth; those seeds, in dependence on that site, by that condition, having grown, become established with firm roots and matted roots, spread out with trunk, substance, and branches, bearing flowers and fruit." "If so, great king, the sectarians are lost in their own doctrine, destroyed, opposed, if they say: 'The aspiration made towards one who does not consent is barren and fruitless.'

"Just as, great king, the great earth, so is the Tathāgata, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One. Just as, great king, the great earth does not consent to anything, so the Tathāgata does not consent to anything. Just as, great king, those seeds, in dependence on the earth, having grown, become established with firm roots and matted roots, spread out with trunk, substance, and branches, bearing flowers and fruit, so gods and humans, in dependence on the relic and the knowledge-jewel of the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, become established with firm wholesome roots, spread out with the aggregate of concentration, the substance of the Teaching, and the branches of morality, bearing the flowers of liberation and the fruit of asceticism. By this reason too, great king, the aspiration made towards the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, is not barren but fruitful.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a reason by which reason the aspiration made towards the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, is not barren but fruitful. Do these camels, cattle, donkeys, goats, livestock, and humans, great king, consent to the origination of families of worms in their bellies?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But why then, great king, do those worms, having originated in the bellies of those who do not consent, reach full expansion through having many offspring?" "Because of the power of evil action, venerable sir, worms, having originated in the bellies of those beings who do not consent, reach full expansion through having many offspring." "Just so indeed, great king, because of the power of the relic and the knowledge-object of the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, the aspiration made towards the Tathāgata is not barren but fruitful.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a reason by which reason the aspiration made towards the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, is not barren but fruitful. Do these humans, great king, consent: 'Let these ninety-eight diseases arise in the body'?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But why then, great king, do those diseases fall upon the bodies of those who do not consent?" "Because of misconduct done before, venerable sir." "If, great king, unwholesome action done before is to be experienced here, then indeed, great king, whether done before or done here, wholesome-unwholesome action is not barren but fruitful. By this reason too, great king, the aspiration made towards the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, is not barren but fruitful.

"But have you heard before, great king, that the demon named Nandaka, having assailed the Elder Sāriputta, entered the earth?" "Yes, venerable sir, it is heard, this is well-known in the world." "Did the Elder Sāriputta, great king, consent to the demon Nandaka's swallowing by the great earth?" "Even if the world with its gods were overturned, venerable sir, even if the moon and sun were falling to the ground, even if Mount Sineru, the king of mountains, were scattered, the Elder Sāriputta would not consent to another's suffering. What is the reason for this? That cause by which the Elder Sāriputta might be angry or hostile, that cause has been removed and cut off for the Elder Sāriputta; because the cause has been uprooted, venerable sir, the Elder Sāriputta would not become irritated even towards one who takes his life." "If, great king, the Elder Sāriputta did not consent to the demon Nandaka's swallowing by the earth, then why did the demon Nandaka enter the earth?" "Because of the power of unwholesome action, venerable sir." "If, great king, the demon Nandaka entered the earth because of the power of unwholesome action, then even for one not consenting, the offence committed is not barren but fruitful. If so, great king, even because of the power of unwholesome action, the service done for one not consenting is not barren but fruitful. By this reason too, great king, the aspiration made towards the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, who does not consent, is not barren but fruitful.

"How many people, great king, are there who have entered the great earth at present? Have you heard about them?" "Yes, venerable sir, it is heard." "Come now, great king, tell me." "Ciñcamāṇavikā, venerable sir, and Suppabuddha the Sakyan, and the Elder Devadatta, and the demon Nandaka, and the young man Nanda. This has been heard, venerable sir, these five people entered the great earth." "Against whom, great king, did they offend?" "Against the Blessed One, venerable sir, and against the disciples." "Did the Blessed One or the disciples, great king, consent to their entering the great earth?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "If so, great king, the service done for the Tathāgata who has attained final Nibbāna, even though he does not consent, is not barren but fruitful." "Well explained, Venerable Nāgasena, the deep question has been made clear, the secret has been revealed, the knot has been cut, the thicket has been made not a thicket, the opposing doctrines are destroyed, the wrong views are broken, the heretics have become without lustre; you have approached the most excellent of the excellent leaders of groups."

The question on the fruitfulness of aspiration made is the first.

2.

The Question on Omniscience

2. "Venerable Nāgasena, is the Buddha omniscient?" "Yes, great king, the Blessed One is omniscient, but knowledge and vision is not constantly and continuously present for the Blessed One; the Blessed One's omniscient knowledge is dependent on adverting; having adverted, he knows whatever he wishes." "If so, Venerable Nāgasena, the Buddha is not omniscient. If his omniscient knowledge requires searching." "A hundred cartloads of paddy, great king, and half a cartload more, seven measures of paddy and two tumbas - in a single finger-snap moment, for one whose mind is occurring, would so many grains of paddy, being placed as a mark, come to utter elimination and exhaustion?

"Here these seven kinds of minds occur. Those, great king, who are with lust, with hate, with delusion, with mental defilements, with undeveloped body, with undeveloped morality, with undeveloped mind, with undeveloped wisdom - for them that mind arises heavily and proceeds slowly. Why? Because of the undeveloped mind. Just as, great king, when a bamboo stalk that is extended, large, spread out, entwined and intertwined, tangled with branches and matted hair, is being dragged, its coming is heavy and slow. Why? Because of the entwined and intertwined branches. Just so, great king, those who are with lust, with hate, with delusion, with mental defilements, with undeveloped body, with undeveloped morality, with undeveloped mind, with undeveloped wisdom - for them that mind arises heavily and proceeds slowly. Why? Because of being entwined and intertwined by mental defilements. This is the first mind.

"Herein this second mind is to be distinguished - Those, great king, who are stream-enterers, with the realms of misery closed, ones attained to right view, who have cognised the Teacher's instruction - for them that mind arises lightly and proceeds lightly in three states. In the higher planes it arises heavily and proceeds slowly. Why? Because of the purity of mind in three states, and because of the mental defilements above not being eliminated. Just as, great king, when a bamboo stalk that is pure at three joints and knots, with branches and matted hair tangled above, is being dragged, as far as the three joints it goes lightly, above that it is stiff. Why? Because of purity below and because of being tangled with branches and matted hair above. Just so, great king, those who are stream-enterers, with the realms of misery closed, ones attained to right view, who have cognised the Teacher's instruction - for them that mind arises lightly and proceeds lightly in three states, in the higher planes it arises heavily and proceeds slowly. Why? Because of the purity of mind in three states, and because of the mental defilements above not being eliminated. This is the second mind.

"Herein this third mind is to be distinguished - Those, great king, who are once-returners, for whom lust, hate, and delusion have become reduced - for them that mind arises lightly and proceeds lightly in five states, in the higher planes it arises heavily and proceeds slowly. Why? Because of the purity of mind in five states, and because of the mental defilements above not being eliminated. Just as, great king, when a bamboo stalk that is pure at five joints and knots, with branches and matted hair tangled above, is being dragged, as far as the five joints it goes lightly, above that it is stiff. Why? Because of purity below and because of being tangled with branches and matted hair above. Just so, great king, those who are once-returners, for whom lust, hate, and delusion have become reduced - for them that mind arises lightly and proceeds lightly in five states, in the higher planes it arises heavily and proceeds slowly. Why? Because of the purity of mind in five states, and because of the mental defilements above not being eliminated. This is the third mind.

"Herein this fourth consciousness is classified - Those, great king, who are non-returners, for whom the five lower mental fetters have been abandoned, their consciousness arises lightly in ten states, proceeds lightly, arises heavily in the upper planes, proceeds slowly. Why? Because of the purity of consciousness in ten states, because of the non-abandonment of mental defilements above. Just as, great king, when a bamboo stalk that is pure in ten joint-knots, tangled with branches above, is being dragged, as far as the ten joints it goes lightly, beyond that above it is obstinate. Why? Because of purity below and because of being tangled with branches and matted hair above. Just so, great king, those who are non-returners, for whom the five lower mental fetters have been abandoned, their consciousness arises lightly in ten states, proceeds lightly, arises heavily in the upper planes, proceeds slowly. Why? Because of the purity of consciousness in ten states, because of the non-abandonment of mental defilements above - this is the fourth consciousness.

"Herein this fifth consciousness is classified - Those, great king, who are Worthy Ones, who have eliminated the mental corruptions, who have washed away stain, who have vomited up mental defilements, who have lived the holy life, who have done what was to be done, who have laid down the burden, who have attained their own welfare, who have completely destroyed the fetter of becoming, who have attained the analytical knowledges, who are pure in the planes of disciples, their consciousness arises lightly in the domain of disciples, proceeds lightly, arises heavily in the planes of Individually Enlightened Ones, proceeds slowly. Why? Because of purity in the domain of disciples, because of impurity in the domain of Individually Enlightened Ones. Just as, great king, when a bamboo stalk that is pure in all joint-knots is being dragged, its coming is light, not slow. Why? Because of purity in all joint-knots, because of the bamboo being without thicket. Just so, great king, those who are Worthy Ones, who have eliminated the mental corruptions, who have washed away stain, who have vomited up mental defilements, who have lived the holy life, who have done what was to be done, who have laid down the burden, who have attained their own welfare, who have completely destroyed the fetter of becoming, who have attained the analytical knowledges, who are pure in the planes of disciples, their consciousness arises lightly in the domain of disciples, proceeds lightly, arises heavily in the planes of Individually Enlightened Ones, proceeds slowly. Why? Because of purity in the domain of disciples, because of impurity in the domain of Individually Enlightened Ones - this is the fifth consciousness.

"Herein this sixth consciousness is classified - Those, great king, who are Individually Enlightened Ones, self-become, without a teacher, wandering alone, like the horn of a rhinoceros, with pure and spotless consciousness in their own domain, their consciousness arises lightly in their own domain, proceeds lightly, arises heavily in the planes of omniscient Buddhas, proceeds slowly. Why? Because of purity in their own domain, because of the greatness of the domain of omniscient Buddhas. Just as, great king, a man might enter a small river in his own domain by night or by day, as he wishes, without fear; then having seen beyond the great ocean, deep, wide, unfathomable, without a further shore, he would be afraid, would hesitate, would not dare to enter. Why? Because of having crossed his own domain, and because of the greatness of the great ocean. Just so, great king, those who are Individually Enlightened Ones, self-become, without a teacher, wandering alone, like the horn of a rhinoceros, with pure and spotless consciousness in their own domain, their consciousness arises lightly in their own domain, proceeds lightly, arises heavily in the planes of omniscient Buddhas, proceeds slowly. Why? Because of purity in their own domain, because of the greatness of the domain of omniscient Buddhas - this is the sixth consciousness.

"Herein this seventh consciousness comes to be classified - Those, great king, who are perfectly Self-awakened Ones, omniscient, bearers of the ten powers, confident with the four grounds of self-confidence, endowed with the eighteen qualities of a Buddha, infinite conquerors, with unobstructed knowledge, their consciousness arises quickly everywhere, proceeds quickly. Why? Because of purity everywhere. Now, great king, would there be any hesitation or sticking for an iron bar that is well-washed, spotless, without knots, with a subtle edge, not crooked, not bent, not curved, mounted on a strong bow, when forcefully shot at fine linen or fine cotton or fine woollen cloth?" "No indeed, venerable sir. Why?" "Because of the subtleness of the cloths, because of the well-washed state of the iron bar, and because of the force of the shot." Just so indeed, great king, those who are perfectly Self-awakened Ones, omniscient, bearers of the ten powers, confident with the four grounds of self-confidence, endowed with the eighteen qualities of a Buddha, infinite conquerors, with unobstructed knowledge, their consciousness arises quickly everywhere, proceeds quickly. Why? Because of purity everywhere. This is the seventh consciousness.

"Therein, great king, that which is the consciousness of omniscient Buddhas, having surpassed the reckoning of even the six consciousnesses, is pure and light by an incalculable factor. And because the Blessed One's consciousness is pure and light, therefore, great king, the Blessed One displays the twin miracle. By the twin miracle, great king, it should be known that the consciousness of the Buddhas, the Blessed Ones, turns around thus quickly; no further reason can be stated therein. Even those miracles, great king, taking the consciousness of omniscient Buddhas, do not amount to a reckoning, a term, a fraction, or a fraction of a fraction. The Blessed One's omniscient knowledge, great king, is dependent on adverting; having adverted, he knows whatever he wishes.

"Just as, great king, a man might place whatever is placed in one hand into the other hand, might utter speech with an open mouth, might swallow food that has gone into the mouth, having opened his eyes might close them, or having closed his eyes might open them, might extend a bent arm, or might bend an extended arm - this takes longer, great king; quicker is the Blessed One's omniscient knowledge, quicker is the adverting; having adverted, he knows whatever he wishes. By the mere deficiency of adverting, the Buddhas, the Blessed Ones, are not thereby called non-omniscient."

"Even adverting, Venerable Nāgasena, must be done through seeking. Come, convince me of this by a reason." "Just as, great king, if a wealthy man, of great riches, of great possessions, with abundant gold and silver, with abundant property and equipment, with abundant wealth and grain, had rice, paddy, barley, rice-grain, sesame, mung beans, beans, early crops, later crops, ghee, oil, butter, milk, curds, honey, molasses, and treacle stored in pots, jars, pitchers, granaries, and vessels, and a guest were to come to that man, worthy of a meal, desiring a meal, and whatever cooked food there was in his house, that would be finished, and having taken out rice-grain from a pot he would cook food - but would that man, great king, by that mere deficiency of food, be called poor, be called destitute?" "No indeed, venerable sir. Even in the house of a wheel-turning monarch, venerable sir, there is a deficiency of food at an improper time; how much more so for a householder?" "Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata's omniscient knowledge has a mere deficiency of adverting; having adverted, he knows whatever he wishes.

"Or else, great king, suppose there were a tree bearing fruit, bent down, bowed, laden with clusters of fruit, and no fruit had fallen there - would that tree, great king, by that mere deficiency of fallen fruit, be called fruitless?" "No indeed, venerable sir. Those tree fruits are dependent on falling; when fallen, one obtains whatever one wishes." "Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata's omniscient knowledge is dependent on adverting; having adverted, he knows whatever he wishes."

"Venerable Nāgasena, does the Buddha know whatever he wishes by adverting again and again?" "Yes, great king, the Blessed One knows whatever he wishes by adverting again and again."

"Just as, great king, when a wheel-turning monarch remembers the wheel treasure, thinking 'May my wheel treasure come,' when remembered, the wheel treasure comes - just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata knows whatever he wishes by adverting again and again." "The reason is firm, Venerable Nāgasena. The Buddha is omniscient. I accept that the Buddha is omniscient."

The question on the Buddha's omniscience is the second.

3.

The Question on Devadatta's Going Forth

3. "Venerable Nāgasena, by whom was Devadatta given the going forth?" "These six, great king, were warrior princes - Bhaddiya and Anuruddha and Ānanda and Bhagu and Kimila and Devadatta, with Upāli the barber as seventh - when the Teacher had fully awakened, the one who brought joy to the Sakyan clan, going forth following the Blessed One, they departed; the Blessed One gave them the going forth." "Is it not so, venerable sir, that by Devadatta, having gone forth, the Community was broken?" "Yes, great king, by Devadatta, having gone forth, the Community was broken. A householder does not break the Community, nor a nun, nor a female trainee, nor a novice, nor a female novice breaks the Community; a monk who is regular, belonging to the same communion, standing within the same boundary, breaks the Community." "What action, venerable sir, does a schismatic person experience?" "An action lasting a cosmic cycle, great king, he experiences."

"But, Venerable Nāgasena, does the Buddha know: 'Devadatta, having gone forth, will break the Community, and having broken the Community, will be cooked in hell for a cosmic cycle'?" "Yes, great king, the Tathāgata knows: 'Devadatta, having gone forth, will break the Community, and having broken the Community, will be cooked in hell for a cosmic cycle.'" "If, Venerable Nāgasena, the Buddha knows: 'Devadatta, having gone forth, will break the Community, and having broken the Community, will be cooked in hell for a cosmic cycle,' then indeed, Venerable Nāgasena, the statement that the Buddha is compassionate, sympathetic, seeking welfare, removing harm and providing welfare for all beings - that statement is wrong. If he gave the going forth not knowing that, then indeed the Buddha is not omniscient. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; unravel this great tangle, break the opposing doctrines. In the future time, monks of intelligence like you will be rare; here show your power."

"The Blessed One, great king, is compassionate and omniscient. Out of compassion, great king, the Blessed One, looking at Devadatta's destination with the knowledge of omniscience, saw Devadatta, having accumulated action bound for the realm of misery, going from hell to hell, from nether world to nether world, for many hundreds of thousands of ten millions of cosmic cycles. The Blessed One, having known this with the knowledge of omniscience, thought: 'This one's unlimited action, having gone forth in my Dispensation, will become limited; with reference to the former, suffering will become limited; even not having gone forth, this foolish man will accumulate action lasting a cosmic cycle.' Out of compassion he gave the going forth to Devadatta."

"If so, Venerable Nāgasena, the Buddha, having struck, anoints with oil; having made one fall into a precipice, gives a hand; having killed, seeks life - in that he first gives suffering and afterwards provides happiness?" "The Tathāgata, great king, strikes for the sake of beings' welfare, makes fall for the sake of beings' welfare, kills for the sake of beings' welfare. Having struck too, great king, the Tathāgata provides only welfare for beings; having made fall too, he provides only welfare for beings; having killed too, he provides only welfare for beings. Just as, great king, mother and father, having struck and having made fall, provide only welfare for their sons, just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata strikes for the sake of beings' welfare, makes fall for the sake of beings' welfare, kills for the sake of beings' welfare. Having struck too, great king, the Tathāgata provides only welfare for beings; having made fall too, he provides only welfare for beings; having killed too, he provides only welfare for beings. By whatever means there is growth of virtues for beings, by those means he provides only welfare for all beings. If, great king, Devadatta had not gone forth, being a householder, having done much evil action conducive to hell, going from hell to hell, from nether world to nether world, for many hundreds of thousands of ten millions of cosmic cycles, he would experience much suffering. The Blessed One, knowing that, out of compassion gave the going forth to Devadatta, thinking: 'For one gone forth in my Dispensation, suffering will become limited.' Out of compassion he made heavy suffering light.

"Or just as, great king, a powerful man, powerful through wealth, fame, glory, relatives and strength, made a heavy punishment light for his own relative or friend who was bearing a heavy punishment from the king, through his own great trustworthiness and ability - just so indeed, great king, the Blessed One, having given the going forth to Devadatta who was experiencing suffering for many hundreds of thousands of ten millions of cosmic cycles, made heavy suffering light through the power and ability of morality, concentration, wisdom and liberation.

"Or just as, great king, a skilled physician, a surgeon, makes a heavy disease light by the power of powerful medicine - just so indeed, great king, the Blessed One, having given the going forth to Devadatta who was experiencing suffering for many hundreds of thousands of ten millions of cosmic cycles, through knowledge of the disease, powerful in compassion, made heavy suffering light by the power of the firm medicine of the Teaching. Would the Blessed One, great king, making Devadatta who was to experience much into one to experience little, commit any demerit?" "Not any demerit, venerable sir, would he commit, not even as much as the time of milking a cow." "Accept this reason too, great king, according to its meaning, by which reason the Blessed One gave the going forth to Devadatta.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a further reason by which reason the Blessed One gave the going forth to Devadatta. Just as, great king, having seized a thief, a criminal, they might show him to the king: 'This, Sire, is a thief, a criminal; impose on him whatever punishment you wish.' The king might say to him thus: 'If so, my good men, having taken this thief outside the city, cut off his head at the place of execution.' 'Yes, Sire,' they, having assented to the king, having taken him outside the city, would lead him to the place of execution. Some man might see him, one who has obtained a boon from the king's presence, who has obtained fame, wealth and possessions, whose words are acceptable, who accomplishes what the powerful desire; he, having shown compassion to him, might say to those men thus: 'Enough, sirs, what is the use of cutting off this man's head? If so, sirs, having cut off his hand or foot, protect his life; I will give an answer to the king on his behalf.' They, by the word of that powerful one, having cut off that thief's hand or foot, would protect his life. Would that man, great king, acting thus, be doing what should be done for that thief?" "That man, venerable sir, is a giver of life to that thief; when life has been given, what is there that has not been done for him?" "But the feeling in the cutting off of hand and foot - would he commit any demerit on account of that feeling?" "By what was done by himself, venerable sir, that thief experiences unpleasant feeling; but the man who gives life would not commit any demerit." "Just so indeed, great king, the Blessed One out of compassion gave the going forth to Devadatta: 'For one gone forth in my Dispensation, suffering will be brought to an end.' And Devadatta's suffering was brought to an end, great king; Devadatta, great king, at the time of death -

"He went for refuge for life. Devadatta, great king, when the cosmic cycle is divided into six portions and has passed, in the first portion he broke the Community, and having been cooked in hell for five portions, having been released from there, he will become an Individually Enlightened One named Aṭṭhissara. Was the Blessed One, great king, acting thus, doing what should be done for Devadatta?" "The Tathāgata, venerable Nāgasena, is a giver of all to Devadatta; since the Tathāgata will bring Devadatta to individual enlightenment, what is there that has not been done by the Tathāgata for Devadatta?" "But, great king, that Devadatta, having broken the Community, experiences unpleasant feeling in hell, would the Blessed One on that account commit any demerit?" "No indeed, venerable sir; by what was done by himself, venerable sir, Devadatta is cooked in hell for a cosmic cycle; the Teacher who makes an end of suffering does not commit any demerit." "Accept this reason too, great king, according to its meaning, by which reason the Blessed One gave the going forth to Devadatta.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a further reason by which reason the Blessed One gave the going forth to Devadatta. Just as, great king, a skilled physician, a surgeon, appeasing a wound that has been attacked by wind, bile, phlegm, their combination, seasonal change, abnormal care, or external injury, covered with rotting corpse-like foul smell, with a dart inside, gone into a cavity, full of pus and blood, anoints the surface of the wound with medicine that is hard, sharp, alkaline and pungent for ripening; having ripened, having reached a soft state, having cut it open with a knife, he cauterizes it with a probe; when cauterized, he applies alkaline salt, he anoints it with medicine for the healing of the wound, for the attainment of well-being for the sick person - does that physician, that surgeon, great king, with a mind for harm, anoint with medicine, cut with a knife, cauterize with a probe, apply alkaline salt?" "No indeed, venerable sir; with a mind for welfare, wishing for well-being, he does those actions." "But whatever unpleasant feeling arose from the doing of the medical action, would that physician, that surgeon, on that account commit any demerit?" "With a mind for welfare, venerable sir, wishing for well-being, the physician, the surgeon does those actions; why would he on that account commit demerit? That physician, that surgeon, venerable sir, is one going to heaven." "Just so indeed, great king, out of compassion the Blessed One gave the going forth to Devadatta for release from suffering.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a further reason by which reason the Blessed One gave the going forth to Devadatta. Just as, great king, a man might be pierced by a thorn, and then another man, wishing for his welfare, wishing for his well-being, having cut all around with a sharp thorn or with the edge of a knife, with blood flowing, might remove that thorn - does that man, great king, wishing for his harm, remove that thorn?" "No indeed, venerable sir; wishing for his welfare, venerable sir, that man, wishing for his well-being, removes that thorn. If, venerable sir, he did not remove that thorn, he might undergo death or suffering like death on account of that." "Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata out of compassion gave the going forth to Devadatta for release from suffering. If, great king, the Blessed One had not given the going forth to Devadatta, Devadatta would have been cooked in hell for a hundred thousand million cosmic cycles in the succession of existences."

"Venerable Nāgasena, the Tathāgata brought Devadatta, who was going with the stream, against the stream; he established Devadatta, who had entered the wrong path, on the path; he gave support to Devadatta who had fallen into a precipice; the Tathāgata raised Devadatta, who had gone to unrighteousness, to righteousness. And these causes, venerable Nāgasena, and these reasons cannot be shown by another except by one wise like you."

The question on Devadatta's going forth is the third.

4.

The Question on the Earth Trembling

4. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One - 'These eight causes, monks, eight conditions are for the manifestation of a great earthquake.' This is a statement without remainder, this is a statement without exception, this is a statement without qualification; there is no other ninth cause for the manifestation of a great earthquake. If, venerable Nāgasena, there were another ninth cause for the manifestation of a great earthquake, the Blessed One would have spoken of that cause too. But because, venerable Nāgasena, there is no other ninth cause for the manifestation of a great earthquake, therefore it was not declared by the Blessed One; yet this ninth cause is seen for the manifestation of a great earthquake, that when King Vessantara was giving the great gift, seven times the great earth trembled. If, venerable Nāgasena, there are only eight causes, eight conditions for the manifestation of a great earthquake, then the statement that when King Vessantara was giving the great gift, seven times the great earth trembled, is wrong. If when King Vessantara was giving the great gift, seven times the great earth trembled, then the statement that there are only eight causes, eight conditions for the manifestation of a great earthquake, that too is wrong. This too is a question with two points, subtle, hard to unravel, blinding and deep; it has come to you; it cannot be answered by another of inferior wisdom, except by one wise like you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One - 'These eight causes, monks, eight conditions are for the manifestation of a great earthquake.' That when King Vessantara was giving the great gift, seven times the great earth trembled, that however was untimely, arising only occasionally, free from the eight causes; therefore it was not counted among the eight causes.

"Just as, great king, in the world only three clouds are counted: the rainy season cloud, the winter cloud, and the monsoon cloud. If, apart from these, another cloud rains, that cloud is not counted among the recognised clouds; it goes by the term 'untimely cloud' only. Just so indeed, great king, that when King Vessantara was giving the great gift, seven times the great earth trembled, that was untimely, arising only occasionally, free from the eight causes; it is not counted among the eight causes.

"Or else, great king, from the Himalaya mountain five hundred rivers flow; of those five hundred rivers, great king, only ten rivers are counted in the counting of rivers. As follows: the Ganges, the Yamunā, the Aciravatī, the Sarabhū, the Mahī, the Sindhu, the Sarassatī, the Vetravatī, the Vītaṃsā, and the Candabhāgā; the remaining rivers are not counted in the counting of rivers. Why? Those rivers do not have permanent water. Just so indeed, great king, that when King Vessantara was giving the great gift, seven times the great earth trembled, that was untimely, arising only occasionally, free from the eight causes; it is not counted among the eight causes.

"Or else, great king, a king may have a hundred or two hundred or three hundred ministers; of them only six persons are counted in the counting of ministers. As follows: the general, the chaplain, the judge, the storekeeper, the umbrella-bearer, and the sword-bearer. Only these are counted in the counting of ministers. Why? Because of being connected with the king's qualities; the rest are not counted, they all go by the term 'ministers' only. Just so indeed, great king, that when King Vessantara was giving the great gift, seven times the great earth trembled, that was untimely, arising only occasionally, free from the eight causes; it is not counted among the eight causes.

"Is it heard, great king, nowadays of those who have made aspirations in the Conqueror's Dispensation, of action to be experienced as pleasant in the present life, and whose fame has risen up among gods and humans?" "Yes, venerable sir, it is heard nowadays of those who have made aspirations in the Conqueror's Dispensation, of action to be experienced as pleasant in the present life, and whose fame has risen up among gods and humans - seven persons." "And who are they, great king?" "Sumana the garland-maker, venerable sir, and the brahmin with one cloth, and Puṇṇa the hired servant, and Queen Mallikā, and Queen Gopālamātā, and the female lay follower Suppiyā, and Puṇṇā the slave-woman - these are the seven beings who experienced pleasant results in the present life, and their fame has risen up among gods and humans."

"Are others also heard of in the past who went to the abode of the devas with that very human bodily form?" "Yes, venerable sir, it is heard." "And who are they, great king?" "Guttila the gandhabba, and King Sādhīna, and King Nimi, and King Mandhātā - these four persons are heard of, who went to the abode of the devas with that very human bodily form." "Even what was done long ago is heard of, whether well done or wrongly done? But have you heard before, great king, in the past time or in the present time, that when a gift was being given by one of such and such a name, once or twice or thrice the great earth trembled?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "I have, great king, tradition, achievement, learning, hearing, strength of training, desire to hear, inquiry, and attendance on teachers; yet I too have not heard before 'when a gift was being given by one of such and such a name, once or twice or thrice the great earth trembled' - except for the excellent gift of King Vessantara, the bull among kings. And, great king, between the Blessed One Kassapa and the Blessed One the Sage of the Sakyans, two Buddhas, ten million years have passed, surpassing the path of counting; even there I have no hearing 'when a gift was being given by one of such and such a name, once or twice or thrice the great earth trembled.' Not, great king, by just so much energy, by just so much effort does the great earth tremble; filled with the burden of virtue, great king, filled with the burden of the virtue of all purity practices, not being able to bear it, the great earth moves, trembles, and quakes.

"Just as, great king, when a cart is overloaded with too heavy a burden, the hubs and the rims split and the axle breaks, just so indeed, great king, the great earth, laden with the burden of the qualities of all purity and functional virtues, not being able to bear it, moves, trembles, and quakes.

"Or else, great king, just as the sky, covered by the force of wind and water, filled with the burden of abundant water, because of being burst by excessive wind, roars, resounds, and rumbles, just so indeed, great king, the great earth, laden with the burden of the abundant, vast power of King Vessantara's giving, not being able to bear it, moves, trembles, and quakes. For indeed, great king, the mind of King Vessantara does not proceed through the influence of lust, does not proceed through the influence of hate, does not proceed through the influence of delusion, does not proceed through the influence of conceit, does not proceed through the influence of wrong view, does not proceed through the influence of defilements, does not proceed through the influence of applied thought, does not proceed through the influence of discontent, but rather it proceeds frequently through the influence of giving: 'How might beggars who have not come, come to my presence, and beggars who have come, having obtained according to their wish, become delighted' - thus constantly, continuously, his mental state is established towards giving. The mental state of King Vessantara, great king, is constantly, continuously established in ten states: in taming, in righteousness, in patience, in restraint, in self-control, in procedure, in non-wrath, in non-violence, in truth, and in purity. For King Vessantara, great king, sensual seeking has been abandoned, seeking existence has been calmed, he has engaged in zeal only for seeking the holy life; for King Vessantara, great king, protection of self has been abandoned, he has engaged in zeal for the protection of all beings: 'How might these beings be united, healthy, wealthy, and long-lived' - thus his mental state frequently proceeds. And while giving, great king, King Vessantara does not give that gift for the sake of success in existence, does not give for the sake of wealth, does not give for the sake of a return gift, does not give for the sake of flattery, does not give for the sake of life span, does not give for the sake of beauty, does not give for the sake of happiness, does not give for the sake of power, does not give for the sake of fame, does not give for the sake of a son, does not give for the sake of a daughter, but rather for the sake of omniscient knowledge, for the sake of the jewel of omniscient knowledge, he gave such incomparable, vast, unsurpassed, excellent gifts, and having attained omniscience, he spoke this verse:

"King Vessantara, great king, conquers wrath by non-wrath, conquers the bad by good, conquers the miser by giving, conquers the speaker of falsehood by truth, conquers all unwholesome by wholesome. For him thus giving, following the Teaching, with the Teaching as his head, through the powerful, vast, extensive outflow of the result of giving and energy, below the great winds begin to stir, gently, gently, again and again, confusedly they blow, they bend down, they rise up, they bend aside, trees with broken leaves fall, cluster by cluster the rain clouds rush across the sky, the winds accumulated with dust become fierce, the winds pressed against the sky blow, suddenly they roar, a great fearful sound emanates, when those winds are agitated the water gently, gently moves, when the water moves the fish and turtles are disturbed, pair by pair the waves arise, the water-dwelling beings tremble, the water-wave proceeds in conjunction, the sound of the waves proceeds, terrible bubbles arise, garlands of foam appear, the great ocean overflows, the water rushes in all directions, the streams of water flow with mouths upstream and downstream, the titans, garuḷas, serpents, and demons tremble, they are alarmed: 'What indeed, how indeed, is the ocean overturning?' - with frightened minds they seek a path of escape, when the water-stream is disturbed and agitated the great earth trembles with its mountains and oceans, Mount Sineru revolves, the peak of the rocky summit bends, snakes, mongooses, cats, jackals, pigs, deer, and birds become displeased, the demons of little influence weep, the demons of great influence laugh as the great earth trembles.

"Just as, great king, in a large, great cooking pot, placed on a fireplace, filled with water, scattered with rice-grain, fire burning from below first heats the cooking pot, the cooking pot heated heats the water, the water heated heats the rice-grain, the rice-grain heated rises and sinks, bubbles are produced, garlands of foam rise up; just so indeed, great king, King Vessantara gave up what is hard to give up in the world; for him giving up what is hard to give up, through the natural outflow of the gift, the great winds below, not being able to bear it, became agitated; when the great winds became agitated, the water trembled; when the water trembled, the great earth trembled; thus then the great winds and the water and the great earth - these three were as if of one mind through the outflow of the great gift, through vast, powerful energy. There is no such, great king, power of giving of another, as the power of the great giving of King Vessantara. Just as, great king, on earth there are gems of many kinds. That is to say, sapphire, great sapphire, luminous essence, lapis lazuli, flax flower, sirīsa flower, captivating, sun-stone, moon-stone, diamond, fire-fly, topaz, ruby, and cat's eye gem - surpassing all these, the wheel-turning monarch's gem is declared the foremost; the wheel-turning monarch's gem, great king, illuminates all around for a yojana. Just so indeed, great king, whatever gift there is on earth, even the supreme incomparable gift, surpassing all that, the great gift of King Vessantara is declared the foremost; when the great gift of King Vessantara, great king, was being given, seven times the great earth trembled."

"Wonderful, Venerable Nāgasena, of the Buddhas! Marvellous, Venerable Nāgasena, of the Buddhas! That the Tathāgata, being a Bodhisatta, matchless in the world, was of such patience, of such mind, of such disposition, of such intention. The endeavour of Bodhisattas, Venerable Nāgasena, has been shown, and the perfections of the Conquerors have been further illuminated; even while practising the practice, the Tathāgata's supreme state in the world with its gods has been demonstrated. Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, the Conqueror's Dispensation has been praised, the Conqueror's perfections have been illuminated, the knot of the sectarians' doctrine has been cut, the pot of the doctrines of others has been broken, the deep question has been made clear, the thicket has been made not a thicket, the explanation for the sons of the Conqueror has been rightly obtained; thus I accept this as true, O most excellent of excellent teachers."

The question on the earth trembling is the fourth.

5.

The Question on King Sivi's Gift of Eyes

5. "Venerable Nāgasena, you say thus: 'Eyes were given by King Sivi to a beggar, and while he was blind, divine eyes arose again' - this statement too is faulty, with refutation, with defect. It is said in the discourse: 'When the cause is uprooted, without cause, without basis, there is no arising of the divine eye.' If, venerable Nāgasena, eyes were given by King Sivi to a beggar, then the statement 'divine eyes arose again' is wrong; if divine eyes arose, then the statement 'eyes were given by King Sivi to a beggar' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points, more knotted than knotted, more entangled than entangled, more impenetrable than impenetrable; it has come to you; therein generate desire for the removal of the doctrines of others, for their refutation."

"Eyes were given, great king, by King Sivi to a beggar; do not generate doubt there. And divine eyes arose again; do not generate doubt there either." "But indeed, venerable Nāgasena, when the cause is uprooted, without cause, without basis, does the divine eye arise?" "No indeed, great king." "But what, venerable sir, is the reason here, by which reason when the cause is uprooted, without cause, without basis, the divine eye arises? Come now, convince me by a reason."

"But then, great king, is there in the world something called truth, by which those who speak truth make a declaration of truth?" "Yes, venerable sir, there is in the world something called truth. By truth, venerable Nāgasena, those who speak truth, having made a declaration of truth, cause the god to rain, extinguish fire, ward off poison, and do various other things that should be done." "If so, great king, it is fitting and proper that divine eyes arose for King Sivi by the power of truth. By the power of truth, great king, without basis, the divine eye arises; truth itself there becomes the basis for the arising of the divine eye.

"Just as, great king, whatever beings chant truth saying 'Let a great cloud rain!' - together with their chanting of truth, a great cloud rains. Is there, great king, in the sky an accumulated cause of rain by which cause a great cloud rains?" "No indeed, venerable sir, truth itself there becomes the cause for the raining of the great cloud." "Just so indeed, great king, there is no natural cause for that; truth itself here becomes the basis for the arising of the divine eye.

"Or else, great king, whatever beings chant truth saying 'Let the blazing, burning great mass of fire turn back!' - together with their chanting of truth, the blazing, burning great mass of fire turns back in a moment. Is there, great king, in that blazing, burning great mass of fire an accumulated cause by which cause the blazing, burning great mass of fire turns back in a moment?" "No indeed, venerable sir, truth itself there becomes the basis for the turning back of that blazing, burning great mass of fire in a moment." "Just so indeed, great king, there is no natural cause for that; truth itself here becomes the basis for the arising of the divine eye.

"Or else, great king, whatever beings chant truth saying 'Let the deadly poison become medicine!' Together with their chanting of truth, the deadly poison becomes medicine in a moment. Is there, great king, in that deadly poison an accumulated cause by which cause the deadly poison becomes medicine in a moment?" "No indeed, venerable sir, truth itself there becomes the cause for the destruction of the deadly poison in a moment." "Just so indeed, great king, without the natural cause, truth itself here becomes the basis for the arising of the divine eye.

"For the penetration of the four noble truths too, great king, there is no other basis; having made truth the basis, they penetrate the four noble truths. There is, great king, in the Chinese territory a Chinese king. He, wishing to play in the great ocean, every four months, having made a declaration of truth, enters one yojana into the great ocean together with his chariot. Before the front of his chariot, the great mass of water recedes again and again; when he has departed, it covers over again. Is it possible, great king, for that great ocean to be made to recede by the world including gods and humans with ordinary bodily strength?" "Even in a very small lake, venerable sir, water cannot be made to recede by the world including gods and humans with ordinary bodily strength; how much less the water in the great ocean?" "By this reason too, great king, the power of truth should be known: 'There is no state that cannot be attained by truth.'

"In the city of Pāṭaliputta, great king, King Asoka, the righteous king, surrounded by townspeople, country folk, ministers, soldiers, troops, and great ministers, having seen the river Ganges flowing, full of fresh water, level with its banks, swollen, five hundred yojanas in length, one yojana in breadth, said thus to his ministers: 'Is there anyone, my good men, capable of making this great Ganges flow upstream?' The ministers said: 'It is difficult, Sire.'

"Standing right there on the bank of the Ganges, a courtesan named Bandhumatī heard that it was said thus by the king: 'Is it possible to make this great Ganges flow upstream?' She said thus: 'I am indeed a courtesan in the city of Pāṭaliputta, one who lives by her beauty, of the lowest livelihood. Let the king now see my declaration of truth.' Then she made a declaration of truth. Together with her declaration of truth, in a moment that great Ganges, roaring, flowed upstream while the great crowd of people watched.

Then the king, having heard the gurgling sound produced by the force of the whirling waves of the Ganges, astonished and filled with wonder and amazement, said thus to his ministers: 'Why, my good men, does this great Ganges flow against the stream?' 'Bandhumatī, great king, the courtesan, having heard your word, made a declaration of truth; by her declaration of truth the great Ganges flows upward.'

Then the king, with an agitated heart, very quickly going himself, asked that courtesan: 'Is it true, woman, that by your declaration of truth this Ganges was made to flow against the stream?' 'Yes, Sire.' The king said: 'What power do you have in that, or who not insane accepts your word, by what power did you make this great Ganges flow against the stream?' She said: 'By the power of truth, great king, I made this great Ganges flow against the stream.' The king said: 'What power of truth do you have, being a thief, a cheat, unmindful, a cutter, a sinful one, one of broken morality, one who has transgressed shame, one who deceives blind people?' 'True, great king, I am such; yet even for one such as me, great king, there is a declaration of truth, by which, if I wished, I could overturn even the world with its gods.' The king said: 'But what is that declaration of truth? Come, tell me.' 'Whoever, great king, gives me wealth, whether a warrior or a brahmin or a merchant or a worker or anyone else, I attend to them equally; there is no distinction "he is a warrior," there is no contempt "he is a worker"; freed from favouritism and aversion, I serve the owner of the wealth. This, Sire, is my declaration of truth, by which I made this great Ganges flow against the stream.'

Thus indeed, great king, those established in truth do not fail to find any benefit. And, great king, the eyes were given by King Sivi to the beggar, and divine eyes arose, and that by a declaration of truth. But what was said in the discourse: 'When the physical eye is destroyed, without cause, without basis, there is no arising of the divine eye.' That was said with reference to the eye produced by meditation; thus, great king, remember this." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, the question has been well unravelled, the refutation well shown, the opposing doctrines well crushed; thus I accept this as true."

The question on King Sivi's gift of eyes is the fifth.

6.

The Question on Conception in the Womb

6. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Now, monks, from the coming together of three, there is conception in a womb. Here mother and father come together, and the mother is in her fertile period, and a gandhabba is present. Of these three, monks, from the coming together, there is conception in a womb.' This is a statement without remainder, a statement without exception, a statement without qualification, a statement worthy of respect, spoken while seated in the midst of gods and humans. Yet conception in a womb from the coming together of two is seen here: by the ascetic Dukūla, the navel of the female ascetic Pārikā was touched with the right thumb during her fertile period; by that touching of the navel, the boy Sāma was born. Also by the sage Mātaṅga, the navel of a brahmin maiden was touched with the right thumb during her fertile period; by that touching of the navel, a young man named Maṇḍabya was born. If, Venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Now, monks, from the coming together of three, there is conception in a womb.' Then the statement that both the boy Sāma and the young man Maṇḍabya were born by the touching of the navel is wrong. If, venerable sir, it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'The boy Sāma and the young man Maṇḍabya were born by the touching of the navel,' then the statement 'Now, monks, from the coming together of three, there is conception in a womb' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points, very profound, very subtle, a domain for the wise; it has come to you. Cut the path of doubt, hold up the lamp of the best knowledge."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'Now, monks, from the coming together of three, there is conception in a womb. Here mother and father come together, and the mother is in her fertile period, and a gandhabba is present. Thus from the coming together of three, there is conception in a womb.' And it was spoken: 'The boy Sāma and the young man Maṇḍabya were born by the touching of the navel.'" "If so, Venerable Nāgasena, convince me by the reason by which the question is well determined."

"But have you heard before, great king, that the boy Saṃkicca and the ascetic Isisinga and the Elder Kumārakassapa were born by this means?" "Yes, venerable sir, it is heard; their birth is well-known. First, two female deer, during their fertile period, having come to the urinal place of two ascetics, drank urine containing semen; by that semen in the urine, the boy Saṃkicca and the ascetic Isisinga were born. When the Elder Udāyī had gone to the nuns' quarters, while gazing upon the genitals of a nun with a lustful mind, semen was released onto his orange robe. Then the Venerable Udāyī said this to that nun: 'Go, sister, bring water, I will wash my inner robe.' 'Bring it, I myself will wash it.' Then that nun, during her fertile period, took a portion of that semen with her mouth, inserted a portion into her genitals; by that the Elder Kumārakassapa was born - thus people say."

"Do you, great king, believe that statement?" "Yes, venerable sir, we find a strong reason there, by which reason we believe: 'By this reason they were born.'" "But what, great king, is the reason here?" "When a seed falls into well-prepared soil, venerable sir, it quickly sprouts." "Yes, great king." "Just so indeed, venerable sir, that nun, being in her fertile period, when the soil was established, when the blood's flow had stopped, when the element was stable, having taken that semen, inserted it into that soil; by that an embryo was established in her. Thus we acknowledge the reason there for their birth." "So it is, great king, I accept it thus: by entry into the womb, an embryo comes into being. But do you, great king, accept the conception in a womb of the Elder Kumārakassapa?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Good, great king, you have come back to my domain. Speaking of conception in a womb even by one method, you will be my support. But those two female deer who, having drunk urine, obtained an embryo - do you believe in their conception in a womb?" "Yes, venerable sir, whatever is eaten, drunk, chewed, or licked, all that flows to the soil, and having reached its place, attains growth. Just as, Venerable Nāgasena, whatever rivers there are, all of them flow into the great ocean, and having reached their place, attain growth. Just so indeed, Venerable Nāgasena, whatever is eaten, drunk, chewed, or licked, all that flows to the soil, and having reached its place, attains growth. By that reason I believe that conception in a womb occurs even through what has gone into the mouth." "Good, great king, you have come more firmly into my domain. Even by drinking through the mouth, there is a coming together of two. Do you accept the conception in a womb of the boy Saṃkicca, the ascetic Isisinga, and the Elder Kumārakassapa?" "Yes, venerable sir, the coming together flows in."

"The boy Sāma also, great king, and the young man Maṇḍabya are included within the three comings together, of one flavour indeed with the former; I will explain the reason there. The ascetic Dukūla, great king, and the female ascetic Pārikā, both of them were forest dwellers, inclined to solitude, seekers of the highest good; by the power of their austere asceticism they heated up to the Brahma world. To them at that time Sakka, the lord of the gods, came to attend morning and evening. He, reflecting out of respect and friendliness towards them, saw the disappearance of both their eyes in the future; having seen, he said to them thus: 'Do one thing for me, sirs; it would be good if you would produce one son; he will be your attendant and support.' 'Enough, Kosiya, do not speak thus.' They did not accept that word of his. The compassionate, welfare-wishing Sakka, the lord of the gods, for the second time also, etc. for the third time also he said to them thus: 'Do one thing for me, sirs; it would be good if you would produce one son; he will be your attendant and support.' For the third time also they said: 'Enough, Kosiya, do not urge us to harm; when will this body not break up? Let this body break up, it is subject to breaking up; even if the earth were breaking up, even if the mountain peaks were falling, even if the sky were splitting, even if the moon and sun were falling, we will not mingle with worldly adversities. Do not approach our presence; this is your intimacy with one who has approached; you are one who works harm, I think.'

Then Sakka, the lord of the gods, not obtaining their consent, respected, with joined palms, requested again: 'If you are not able to do my bidding, when the female ascetic is in her fertile period, menstruating, then you, venerable sir, should touch her navel with your right thumb; by that she will conceive an embryo; this indeed is the coming together for conception in a womb.' 'I am able, Kosiya, to do that bidding; our austere asceticism is not broken by just that much; let it be so,' they accepted. But at that time in the heavenly abode there was a young god with abundant wholesome roots, whose life was exhausted, who had reached the exhaustion of his lifespan, able to descend at will even into a wheel-turning monarch's family. Then Sakka, the lord of the gods, having approached that young god, said thus: 'Come, dear sir, a well-dawned day for you, the accomplishment of welfare has arrived, since I have come to attend upon you; your dwelling will be in a delightful place, conception will be in a suitable family, to be raised by good mother and father; come, do my bidding,' he requested. For the second time, etc. for the third time also he requested with joined palms on his head.

Then that young god said thus: 'Which is that family, dear sir, that you praise constantly again and again?' 'The ascetic Dukūla and the female ascetic Pārikā.' He, having heard that word of his, pleased, accepted: 'Good, dear sir, let your wish be so; desiring, dear sir, I would arise in the wished-for family; in what kind of family shall I arise - egg-born or womb-born or moisture-born or spontaneously born?' 'Arise, dear sir, in a womb-born realm.' Then Sakka, the lord of the gods, having calculated the day of arising, informed the ascetic Dukūla: 'On such and such a day the female ascetic will be in her fertile period, menstruating; then you, venerable sir, should touch her navel with your right thumb.' On that day, great king, the female ascetic was in her fertile period, menstruating, and the young god had arrived there and was present, and the ascetic touched the navel of the female ascetic with his right thumb; thus there were those three comings together. By the touching of the navel, lust arose in the female ascetic; but that lust of hers was dependent on the touching of the navel. Do not think that the coming together is only transgression; smiling too is a coming together, talking too is a coming together, gazing too is a coming together; because of being a preliminary part, for the arising of lust, by touching a coming together is born; from the coming together there is descent.

"Even without transgression, great king, conception occurs through touching. Just as, great king, a burning fire, even without touching, dispels the cold of one who has approached, even so, great king, even without transgression, conception occurs through touching.

"By four means, great king, conception of beings occurs - by means of action, by means of mode of generation, by means of family, by means of request; but all these beings originate from action, arise from action.

"How, great king, does conception of beings occur by means of action? Beings with abundant wholesome roots, great king, arise at will in a wealthy warrior family or a wealthy brahmin family or a wealthy householder family or among the gods or in an egg-born womb or in a womb-born womb or in a moisture-born womb or in a spontaneously born womb. Just as, great king, a man who is rich, of great wealth, of great possessions, with abundant gold and silver, with abundant means and provisions, with abundant wealth and grain, with abundant relatives and supporters, whatever he desires in his mind - a female slave or a male slave or a field or a site or a village or a market town or a country - he buys at will, giving even double or triple the wealth, even so, great king, beings with abundant wholesome roots arise at will in a wealthy warrior family or a wealthy brahmin family or a wealthy householder family or among the gods or in an egg-born womb or in a womb-born womb or in a moisture-born womb or in a spontaneously born womb. Thus conception of beings occurs by means of action.

"How does conception of beings occur by means of mode of generation? For chickens, great king, conception occurs through wind. For herons, conception occurs through the sound of thunder. All gods too are beings not lying in a womb; for them conception occurs in various ways. Just as, great king, human beings move about on earth in various ways - some cover the front, some cover the back, some are naked, some are shaven wearing white cloth, some have topknots bound, some are shaven wearing orange robes, some wearing orange robes have topknots bound, some are matted-hair ascetics wearing bark garments, some wear leather garments, some wear rays of light - all these human beings move about on earth in various ways, even so, great king, they are all just beings; for them conception occurs in various ways. Thus conception of beings occurs by means of mode of generation.

"How does conception of beings occur by means of family? Family, great king, means there are four families - egg-born, womb-born, moisture-born, and spontaneously born. If therein a gandhabba, having come from wherever, arises in an egg-born family, he becomes egg-born there, etc. in a womb-born family, etc. in a moisture-born family, etc. arises in a spontaneously born family, he becomes spontaneously born there. In those various families, just such beings come to be. Just as, great king, whatever beasts and birds approach Mount Neru in the Himalayas, all of them, having abandoned their own colour, become gold-coloured, even so, great king, whatever gandhabba, having come from wherever, having approached an egg-born womb, having abandoned his intrinsic nature, becomes egg-born, etc. womb-born, etc. moisture-born, etc. having approached a spontaneously born womb, having abandoned his intrinsic nature, becomes spontaneously born. Thus conception of beings occurs by means of family.

"How does conception of beings occur by means of request? Here, great king, there is a family without a son, with much wealth, faithful, devoted, moral, of good character, devoted to asceticism, and a young god with abundant wholesome roots is subject to pass away. Then Sakka, the lord of the gods, out of compassion for that family, requests that young god: 'Direct your aspiration, dear sir, to the womb of the chief queen of such-and-such a family.' He, because of that request, directs his aspiration to that family. Just as, great king, people desiring merit, having requested an ascetic who is pleasing to the mind, bring him to their home, thinking 'This one, having come, will be a bringer of happiness to the whole family.' Even so, great king, Sakka, the lord of the gods, having requested that young god, brings him to that family. Thus conception of beings occurs by means of request.

"Sāma, great king, the boy, requested by Sakka, the lord of the gods, descended into the womb of the female ascetic Pārikā. Sāma, great king, the boy, was a doer of merit, his mother and father were moral, of good character, the requester was Sakka; by the mental aspiration of the three, the boy Sāma was born. Here, great king, suppose a man skilled in method were to plant a seed in well-tilled, watery ground; would there be any obstacle to the growth of that seed avoiding obstacles?" "No indeed, venerable sir, a seed without damage would quickly sprout." "Even so, great king, the boy Sāma, freed from arisen obstacles, was born by the mental aspiration of the three.

"Have you, great king, heard before that a prosperous, flourishing, great country with its people was completely destroyed through the ill-will of sages?" "Yes, venerable sir, it is heard. On the earth, the Daṇḍaka forest, the Majjha forest, the Kāliṅga forest, the Mātaṅga forest - all that forest became wilderness; all these countries went to destruction through the ill-will of sages." "If, great king, through their ill-will, well-prosperous countries are destroyed, would something be produced through their mental satisfaction?" "Yes, venerable sir." "If so, great king, the boy Sāma was born through the mental satisfaction of three powerful ones - created by sages, created by gods, created by merit. Thus, great king, remember this.

"These three young gods, great king, requested by Sakka, the lord of the gods, were born into families. Which three? The prince Sāma, Mahāpanāda, King Kusa - these three were Bodhisattas." "Well shown, Venerable Nāgasena, is the conception, well explained is the reason, darkness has been made light, the tangle has been disentangled, the opposing doctrines have been cast out; thus I accept this as true."

The question on conception in the womb is the sixth.

7.

The Question on the Disappearance of the Good Teaching

7. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Now, Ānanda, the Good Teaching will remain for only five hundred years.' And again, at the time of final Nibbāna, when asked a question by the wandering ascetic Subhadda, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'And if, Subhadda, these monks were to dwell rightly, the world would not be empty of Worthy Ones' - this is a statement without remainder, a statement without exception, a statement without qualification. If, Venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'Now, Ānanda, the Good Teaching will remain for only five hundred years,' then the statement 'the world would not be empty of Worthy Ones' is wrong. If it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'the world would not be empty of Worthy Ones,' then the statement 'Now, Ānanda, the Good Teaching will remain for only five hundred years' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points, more impenetrable than impenetrable, more powerful than powerful, more knotted than knotted; it has come to you; therein show the diffusion of the power of your knowledge, like a sea-monster gone into the midst of the ocean."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'Now, Ānanda, the Good Teaching will remain for only five hundred years.' And at the time of final Nibbāna, it was spoken to the wandering ascetic Subhadda: 'And if, Subhadda, these monks were to dwell rightly, the world would not be empty of Worthy Ones.' But, great king, that statement of the Blessed One is different in meaning and different in phrasing; this is a delimitation of the Dispensation, this is an elucidation of practice - those two are far removed from each other. Just as, great king, the sky is far removed from the earth, hell is far removed from heaven, the wholesome is far removed from the unwholesome, happiness is far removed from suffering. Just so indeed, great king, those two are far removed from each other.

"But moreover, great king, lest your question be in vain, I will explain to you by bringing together the essence. When the Blessed One said: 'Now, Ānanda, the Good Teaching will remain for only five hundred years,' he delimited the remainder while elucidating the destruction: 'Ānanda, the Good Teaching would remain for a thousand years, if nuns were not given the going forth. Now, Ānanda, the Good Teaching will remain for only five hundred years.' Does the Blessed One, great king, speaking thus, speak of the disappearance of the Good Teaching or protest against full realisation?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "He delimited the remainder, great king, while proclaiming what was lost and elucidating. Just as, great king, a man who has suffered loss, having taken all the remainder, might explain to people: 'This much of my goods is lost, this is the remainder.' Just so indeed, great king, the Blessed One, while elucidating what was lost, spoke of the remainder to gods and humans: 'Now, Ānanda, the Good Teaching will remain for only five hundred years.' But, great king, what was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Now, Ānanda, the Good Teaching will remain for only five hundred years' - this is a delimitation of the Dispensation.

"But what at the time of final Nibbāna, while proclaiming ascetics to the wandering ascetic Subhadda, he said: 'And if, Subhadda, these monks were to dwell rightly, the world would not be empty of Worthy Ones' - this is an elucidation of practice; but you make that delimitation and that elucidation into one flavour. If, however, you wish, I will explain having made it into one flavour; listen well and pay close attention with undistracted mind.

"Here, great king, suppose there were a lake, full of fresh water, overflowing at the brim, bounded and enclosed; and while that lake was not yet exhausted, a great cloud, continuously connected, were to rain down upon the water again and again - would the water in that lake, great king, come to utter elimination and exhaustion?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "For what reason, great king?" "Because of the continuity of the cloud, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, the lake of the Good Teaching of the excellent Dispensation of the Conqueror, full of the pure fresh water of the practice of good conduct, morality, virtue, and duty, overflowing, having overcome the highest existence, stands. If therein the sons of the Buddha were to cause the rain-cloud of the practice of good conduct, morality, virtue, and duty to be continuously connected again and again, were to cause it to rain down. Thus this lake of the Good Teaching of the excellent Dispensation of the Conqueror would remain for a long time, for a long duration, the world would not be empty of Worthy Ones - with reference to this meaning it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'And if, Subhadda, these monks were to dwell rightly, the world would not be empty of Worthy Ones.'

"Here again, great king, suppose in a great, blazing mass of fire, they were to bring dry grass, sticks, and cow-dung again and again - would that mass of fire, great king, be extinguished?" "No indeed, venerable sir, that mass of fire would burn more and more, would blaze more and more." "Just so indeed, great king, in the ten-thousand-fold world system, the excellent Dispensation of the Conqueror too burns and blazes with the practice of good conduct, morality, virtue, and duty. If, moreover, great king, beyond that, the sons of the Buddha, possessed of the five factors for striving, constantly diligent, were to strive, were to train with desire arisen in the three trainings, were to fulfil completely the conduct and morality, thus this excellent Dispensation of the Conqueror would remain more and more for a long time, for a long duration, the world would not be empty of Worthy Ones - with reference to this meaning it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'And if, Subhadda, these monks were to dwell rightly, the world would not be empty of Worthy Ones.'

"But here, great king, if they were to polish again and again a smooth, evenly polished, radiant, spotless mirror with fine, subtle red chalk powder, would stain, mud, dust and dirt arise in that mirror?" "No indeed, venerable sir, on the contrary it would become even more spotless." "Just so, great king, the excellent Dispensation of the Conqueror is naturally pure, free from the stain, mud, dust and dirt of defilements. If the sons of the Buddha were to observe the excellent Dispensation of the Conqueror with the virtues of good conduct, morality, qualities, duties, practice, detachment and ascetic practices, thus this excellent Dispensation of the Conqueror would remain for a long time, for a long duration, and the world would not be empty of Worthy Ones - with reference to this meaning it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'And if, Subhadda, these monks were to dwell rightly, the world would not be empty of Worthy Ones.' The Teacher's instruction, great king, is rooted in practice, caused by practice, and remains when practice has not disappeared."

"Venerable Nāgasena, as for what you say 'disappearance of the Good Teaching', what is that disappearance of the Good Teaching?" "There are, great king, these three disappearances of the Dispensation. What three? The disappearance of achievement, the disappearance of practice, the disappearance of the outward sign. When achievement has disappeared, great king, even for one who practises well there is no full realization of the teaching; when practice has disappeared, the regulation of training rules disappears, only the outward sign remains; when the outward sign has disappeared, there is the cutting off of the lineage. These, great king, are the three disappearances."

"Well explained, Venerable Nāgasena, the question has been made clear, the deep has been made shallow, the knot has been cut, the opposing doctrines are destroyed, broken, made without lustre; you have approached the excellent bull among leaders of groups."

The question on the disappearance of the Good Teaching is the seventh.

8.

The Question on Cutting Off the Unwholesome

8. "Venerable Nāgasena, did the Tathāgata attain omniscience having burnt up all unwholesome, or did he attain omniscience with some unwholesome remaining?" "Having burnt up all unwholesome, great king, the Blessed One attained omniscience; there is no remaining unwholesome for the Blessed One."

"But, venerable sir, had unpleasant feeling previously arisen in the Tathāgata's body?" "Yes, great king, at Rājagaha the Blessed One's foot was cut by a splinter, an illness of bloody diarrhoea arose, when the body was congested a purgative was administered by Jīvaka, when a wind illness arose hot water was requested by the attendant elder."

"If, venerable Nāgasena, the Tathāgata attained omniscience having burnt up all unwholesome, then the statement that the Blessed One's foot was cut by a splinter and an illness of bloody diarrhoea arose is wrong. If the Tathāgata's foot was cut by a splinter and an illness of bloody diarrhoea arose, then the statement that the Tathāgata attained omniscience having burnt up all unwholesome, that too is wrong. There is not, venerable sir, any feeling without action; all that feeling is rooted in action, one feels it by action alone. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"No indeed, great king, not all that feeling is rooted in action. By eight causes, great king, feelings arise, by which causes many beings feel feelings. Which eight? Indeed, great king, some feelings arise here originating from wind; indeed, great king, some feelings arise here originating from bile. Etc. Indeed, great king, some feelings arise here originating from phlegm. Etc. Indeed, great king, some feelings arise here from the combination of humours. Etc. Indeed, great king, some feelings arise here born from change of season. Etc. Indeed, great king, some feelings arise here born from improper care. Etc. Indeed, great king, some feelings arise here caused by external assault. Etc. Indeed, great king, some feelings arise here born from the result of action. By these eight causes, great king, many beings feel feelings. Therein, those persons who would say 'action afflicts beings,' those persons reject the seven causes. Their statement is wrong." "Venerable Nāgasena, whatever is caused by wind, whatever is caused by bile, whatever is caused by phlegm, whatever is from the combination of humours, whatever is born from change of season, whatever is born from improper care, whatever is caused by external assault - all these originate from action alone; they all come to be by action alone."

"If, great king, all those illnesses too were originating from action alone, there would be no distinguishing characteristics of them by their portions. Wind, great king, when disturbed, is disturbed in ten ways: by cold, by heat, by hunger, by thirst, by overeating, by standing, by striving, by rushing, by assault, by the result of action. Therein, those nine kinds do not arise in past, nor in future, but in the present existence; therefore it should not be said 'all feelings originate from action.' Bile, great king, when disturbed, is disturbed in three ways: by cold, by heat, by improper food. Phlegm, great king, when disturbed, is disturbed in three ways: by cold, by heat, by food and drink. And, great king, wind, bile, and phlegm, having been disturbed by those various disturbances, becoming mixed, each draws its own feeling. Feeling born from change of season, great king, arises from change of season. Feeling born from improper care arises from improper care. Feeling caused by external assault, great king, there is function, there is result of action; feeling born from the result of action arises from action done before. Thus indeed, great king, little is born from the result of action, more is the remainder. Therein fools run beyond saying 'all is born from the result of action alone.' That action cannot be defined without the Buddha's knowledge.

"But, great king, that the Blessed One's foot was cut by a splinter, that feeling was indeed not originating from wind, not originating from bile, not originating from phlegm, not from the combination of humours, not born from change of season, not born from improper care, not born from the result of action, but caused by external assault only. For, great king, Devadatta bound resentment towards the Tathāgata for many hundreds of thousands of births; he, with that resentment, having taken up a great heavy stone, released it thinking 'I shall drop it on his head'; then two other rocks, having come, received that stone before it reached the Tathāgata; by the blow of those, a splinter having broken off and having fallen on the Blessed One's foot, drew blood. Either from the result of action, great king, or from function, this feeling arose for the Blessed One; beyond these there is no other feeling.

"Just as, great king, either due to the defectiveness of the field a seed does not come to be, or due to the defectiveness of the seed. Just so indeed, great king, either from the result of action or from function, this feeling arose for the Blessed One; beyond these there is no other feeling.

"Or else, great king, just as either due to the defectiveness of the stomach food is digested abnormally, or due to the defectiveness of the nutriment, just so indeed, great king, either from the result of action or from function, this feeling arose for the Blessed One; beyond these there is no other feeling. But moreover, great king, there is no feeling born from the result of action for the Blessed One, there is no feeling born from improper care; from the remaining origins feeling arises for the Blessed One, and yet by that feeling it is not possible to deprive the Blessed One of life.

"Desirable and undesirable, pleasant and unpleasant feelings fall, great king, upon this body made of the four primary elements. Here, great king, a clod of earth thrown into space falls upon the great earth; did that clod of earth, great king, fall upon the great earth because of what was done before?" "No indeed, venerable sir; there is not, venerable sir, that cause for the great earth by which cause the great earth would experience the result of wholesome and unwholesome action; by a present cause that is not action, venerable sir, that clod of earth falls upon the great earth. Just as, great king, the great earth, so should the Tathāgata be seen. Just as a clod of earth falls upon the great earth not because of what was done before, just so indeed, great king, that splinter fell upon the Tathāgata's foot not because of what was done before.

"But here, great king, people break and dig the great earth; do those people, great king, break and dig the great earth because of what was done before?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, that splinter which fell upon the Blessed One's foot, that splinter did not fall upon the Blessed One's foot because of what was done before. Also, great king, the illness of bloody diarrhoea that arose for the Blessed One, that illness too did not arise because of what was done before, it arose only from the combination of humours; whatever bodily illnesses, great king, arose for the Blessed One, they were not produced by action, they arose from one or another of these six origins.

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One, the god above gods, in the explanation to Moḷiyasīvaka, the excellent seal of the Connected Collection:

"'Indeed, Sīvaka, some feelings arise here originating from bile. This, Sīvaka, should be known by oneself, how some feelings arise here originating from bile. This, Sīvaka, is also accepted as truth by the world, how some feelings arise here originating from bile. Therein, Sīvaka, as to those ascetics and brahmins who hold such views and such opinions: "Whatever this male person experiences - whether pleasant or unpleasant or neither-unpleasant-nor-pleasant - all that is caused by what was done in the past." They pass over what is known by oneself, and they pass over what is accepted as truth in the world. Therefore I say it is wrong for those ascetics and brahmins.

"'Indeed, Sīvaka, some feelings arise here originating from phlegm. Indeed, Sīvaka, some feelings arise here originating from wind. Etc. Indeed, Sīvaka, some feelings arise here from the combination of humours. Etc. Indeed, Sīvaka, some feelings arise here born from change of season. Etc. Indeed, Sīvaka, some feelings arise here born from improper care. Etc. Indeed, Sīvaka, some feelings arise here caused by external assault. Etc. Indeed, Sīvaka, some feelings arise here born from the result of action. This, Sīvaka, should be known by oneself, how some feelings arise here born from the result of action. This, Sīvaka, is also accepted as truth by the world, how some feelings arise here born from the result of action. Therein, Sīvaka, as to those ascetics and brahmins who hold such views and such opinions: "Whatever this male person experiences - whether pleasant or unpleasant or neither-unpleasant-nor-pleasant - all that is caused by what was done in the past." They pass over what is known by oneself, and they pass over what is accepted as truth in the world. Therefore I say it is wrong for those ascetics and brahmins.'"

"Thus indeed, great king, not all feelings are born of the result of action; having burnt all unwholesome, the Blessed One attained omniscience - thus remember this." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on cutting off the unwholesome is the eighth.

9.

The Question on What Further is to be Done

9. "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'whatever was to be done by the Tathāgata, all that was fully accomplished at the very root of the Bodhi tree, there is nothing further to be done by the Tathāgata, or any adding to what has been done,' yet this three-month seclusion is seen. If, Venerable Nāgasena, whatever was to be done by the Tathāgata, all that was fully accomplished at the very root of the Bodhi tree, there is nothing further to be done by the Tathāgata, or any adding to what has been done, then the statement 'he was in seclusion for three months' is wrong. If he was in seclusion for three months, then the statement 'whatever was to be done by the Tathāgata, all that was fully accomplished at the very root of the Bodhi tree' is also wrong. There is no seclusion for one who has done what was to be done; seclusion is only for one who still has something to do. Just as only one who is sick has something to be done with medicine; what has one who is not sick to do with medicine? Only one who is hungry has something to be done with food; what has one who is not hungry to do with food? Just so indeed, Venerable Nāgasena, there is no seclusion for one who has done what was to be done; seclusion is only for one who still has something to do. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"Whatever was to be done by the Tathāgata, great king, all that was fully accomplished at the very root of the Bodhi tree, there is nothing further to be done by the Tathāgata, or any adding to what has been done, and the Blessed One was in seclusion for three months. Seclusion indeed, great king, has many virtues; all Tathāgatas too, having gone into seclusion, attained omniscience; recollecting the virtue of that well-done, they resort to seclusion. Just as, great king, a man who has obtained a boon from the king's presence, who has obtained wealth, recollecting the virtue of that well-done, goes again and again to attend upon the king. Just so indeed, great king, all Tathāgatas too, having gone into seclusion, attained omniscience; recollecting the virtue of that well-done, they resort to seclusion.

"Or else, great king, just as a man who is sick, afflicted, severely ill, having attended upon a physician, having attained well-being, recollecting the virtue of that well-done, attends upon the physician again and again. Just so indeed, great king, all Tathāgatas too, having gone into seclusion, attained omniscience; recollecting the virtue of that well-done, they resort to seclusion.

"And there are, great king, these twenty-eight virtues of seclusion, recollecting which virtues the Tathāgatas resort to seclusion. Which twenty-eight? Here, great king, seclusion protects oneself while in seclusion, increases life span, gives strength, closes off faults, removes ill repute, brings fame, dispels discontent, establishes delight, removes fear, creates self-confidence, removes idleness, generates energy, removes lust, removes hate, removes delusion, strikes down conceit, breaks applied thought, makes the mind fully focused, softens the mental state, generates joy, makes one serious, produces material gain, makes one worthy of homage, causes one to attain rapture, creates gladness, shows the intrinsic nature of activities, uproots conception in existence, and gives complete asceticism. These, great king, are the twenty-eight virtues of seclusion, recollecting which virtues the Tathāgatas resort to seclusion.

"And moreover, great king, the Tathāgatas, wishing to experience the peaceful happiness and delight in attainment, resort to seclusion, with their intentions fulfilled. For four reasons, great king, the Tathāgatas resort to seclusion. Which four? For comfortable abiding too, great king, the Tathāgatas resort to seclusion; for the abundance of faultless virtues too, the Tathāgatas resort to seclusion; because it is the complete noble path too, the Tathāgatas resort to seclusion; because it is praised, extolled, commended, and approved by all Buddhas too, the Tathāgatas resort to seclusion. For these four reasons, great king, the Tathāgatas resort to seclusion. Thus indeed, great king, the Tathāgatas resort to seclusion not because they still have something to do, nor for adding to what has been done, but because they see the distinction of virtues, the Tathāgatas resort to seclusion." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on what further is to be done is the ninth.

10.

The Question on the Display of Supernormal Power

10. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'The Tathāgata, Ānanda, has developed, cultivated, mastered, made a basis of, practised, accumulated, and thoroughly undertaken the four bases for spiritual power; if he wishes, Ānanda, the Tathāgata could remain for a cosmic cycle or the remainder of a cosmic cycle.' And again it was said: 'After the elapse of three months from now, the Tathāgata will attain final Nibbāna.' If, Venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'The Tathāgata, Ānanda, has developed the four bases for spiritual power... etc. the remainder of a cosmic cycle,' then the delimitation of three months is wrong. If, venerable sir, it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'After the elapse of three months from now, the Tathāgata will attain final Nibbāna,' then 'The Tathāgata, Ānanda, has developed the four bases for spiritual power... etc. the remainder of a cosmic cycle' - that statement too is wrong. There is no thundering in an impossibility by the Tathāgatas. The Buddhas, the Blessed Ones, are of unfailing speech, of true speech, of unambiguous speech. This too is a question with two points, profound, very subtle, hard to make reflect upon, that has come to you; break this net of wrong views, establish it on one side, break the opposing doctrine."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'The Tathāgata, Ānanda, has developed the four bases for spiritual power... etc. the remainder of a cosmic cycle,' and the delimitation of three months was also spoken; but that cosmic cycle is called a life-span cosmic cycle. The Blessed One, great king, did not say this proclaiming his own power; but the Blessed One, great king, proclaiming his supernormal power, said thus: 'The Tathāgata, Ānanda, has developed the four bases for spiritual power... etc. the remainder of a cosmic cycle.'

"Just as, great king, a king might have a thoroughbred horse, swift in gait, fast as the wind; the king, proclaiming its power of speed, in the midst of townspeople, countryfolk, soldiers, troops, brahmins, householders, ministers, and people, might say thus: 'If he wishes, my good man, this excellent horse, having traversed the earth bounded by the ocean waters, could come here in a moment'; yet he would not show that swift gait in that assembly; but that speed exists in it, and it is capable of traversing the earth bounded by the ocean waters in a moment. Just so indeed, great king, the Blessed One, proclaiming his own supernormal power, said thus; and that too was spoken while seated in the midst of those possessing the threefold true knowledge, those possessing the six higher knowledges, the Worthy Ones, the stainless ones who have eliminated the mental corruptions, and gods and humans: 'The Tathāgata, Ānanda, has developed, cultivated, mastered, made a basis of, practised, accumulated, and thoroughly undertaken the four bases for spiritual power; if he wishes, Ānanda, the Tathāgata could remain for a cosmic cycle or the remainder of a cosmic cycle.' And that supernormal power exists, great king, in the Blessed One; and the Blessed One is capable by supernormal power of remaining for a cosmic cycle or the remainder of a cosmic cycle; yet the Blessed One does not show that supernormal power in that assembly; the Blessed One, great king, is unconcerned with all existences, and all existences are blamed by the Tathāgata. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'Just as, monks, even a small amount of excrement is foul-smelling. Just so indeed, monks, I do not praise even a small amount of existence, even for a mere finger-snap.' Would the Blessed One, great king, having seen all existences, destinations, and modes of generation as equal to excrement, in dependence on supernormal power, create desire and lust for existences?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "If so, great king, the Blessed One, proclaiming his supernormal power, roared such a Buddha's lion's roar." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the display of supernormal power is the tenth.

The Chapter on Supernormal Power is the first.

In this chapter there are ten questions.

2.

The Chapter on the Unbreakable

1.

The Question on the Lesser and Minor Rules

1. "Venerable Nāgasena, this was spoken by the Blessed One: 'I teach the Teaching having directly known, monks, not without having directly known.' And again in the regulation of the monastic discipline it was spoken thus: 'If it wishes, Ānanda, the monastic community may abolish the lesser and minor training rules after my passing.' Were indeed, venerable Nāgasena, the lesser and minor training rules badly laid down, or were they laid down without knowing the case, that the Blessed One has the lesser and minor training rules abolished after his passing? If, venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'I teach the Teaching having directly known, monks, not without having directly known,' then the statement 'If it wishes, Ānanda, the monastic community may abolish the lesser and minor training rules after my passing' is wrong. If by the Tathāgata in the regulation of the monastic discipline it was spoken thus: 'If it wishes, Ānanda, the monastic community may abolish the lesser and minor training rules after my passing,' then the statement 'I teach the Teaching having directly known, monks, not without having directly known' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points, subtle, skilful, profound, very profound, hard to make reflect upon; it has come to you; therein show the diffusion of the power of your knowledge."

"This was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'I teach the Teaching having directly known, monks, not without having directly known,' and in the regulation of the monastic discipline too it was spoken thus: 'If it wishes, Ānanda, the monastic community may abolish the lesser and minor training rules after my passing.' But that, great king, the Tathāgata said while testing the monks: 'Will my disciples, when released by me, exalt the lesser and minor training rules after my passing, or will they take them up?'

"Just as, great king, a wheel-turning monarch might say thus to his sons: 'This, dear sons, is a great country bounded by the ocean in all directions; it is difficult, dear sons, to maintain with just this much power. Come, dear sons, after my passing, abandon the borderland regions.' Would those princes, great king, after their father's passing, release all those borderland regions of the country that had come into their possession?" "No indeed, venerable sir. More greedy than the king, venerable sir, the princes out of greed for the kingdom would take possession of double or triple the country beyond that; why would they release a country that had come into their possession?" "Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata, testing the monks, said thus: 'If it wishes, Ānanda, the monastic community may abolish the lesser and minor training rules after my passing.' For release from suffering, great king, the sons of the Buddha, out of greed for the Teaching, would guard even another one hundred and fifty training rules beyond that; why would they release a training rule that was originally laid down?"

"Venerable Nāgasena, as for what the Blessed One said: 'the lesser and minor training rules,' here people are confused, have become doubtful, are perplexed, have plunged into uncertainty. Which are those lesser training rules, which are the minor training rules?" "Wrong-doing, great king, is the lesser training rule; insulting speech is the minor training rule. These two are the lesser and minor training rules. Even by the great elders of old, great king, doubt was raised here; even by them it was not settled together. In the exposition of the stability of the Teaching, this question was pointed out by the Blessed One." "Long deposited, venerable Nāgasena, the secret of the Conqueror has now today been opened, made manifest, made known in the world."

The question on the lesser and minor rules is the first.

2.

The Question on the Undeclared

2. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'There is not, Ānanda, a closed fist of a teacher in the Tathāgata regarding the teachings,' yet when asked a question by the elder Mālukyaputta, he did not answer. This, venerable Nāgasena, is a question with two points, exclusively based upon either not knowing or keeping secret. If, venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'There is not, Ānanda, a closed fist of a teacher in the Tathāgata regarding the teachings,' then it was not answered to the elder Mālukyaputta by one not knowing. If it was not answered by one knowing, then there is a closed fist of a teacher in the Tathāgata regarding the teachings. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'There is not, Ānanda, a closed fist of a teacher in the Tathāgata regarding the teachings,' and the question asked by the elder Mālukyaputta was not answered, but that was neither by not knowing nor by keeping secret. There are, great king, these four ways of answering questions. What are the four? A question to be answered definitively, a question to be answered analytically, a question to be answered with a counter-question, a question to be set aside.

"And what, great king, is a question to be answered definitively? 'Matter is impermanent' is a question to be answered definitively, 'feeling is impermanent', etc. 'Perception is impermanent', etc. 'Activities are impermanent', etc. 'Consciousness is impermanent' is a question to be answered definitively; this is a question to be answered definitively.

"What is a question to be answered analytically? 'But is matter impermanent?' is a question to be answered analytically, 'but is feeling impermanent?', etc. 'But is perception impermanent?', etc. 'But are activities impermanent?', etc. 'But is consciousness impermanent?' is a question to be answered analytically; this is a question to be answered analytically.

"What is a question to be answered with a counter-question? 'Does one cognize everything with the eye?' - this is a question to be answered with a counter-question.

"What is a question to be set aside? 'The world is eternal' is a question to be set aside, 'the world is non-eternal'. 'The world is finite'. 'The world is infinite'. 'The world is both finite and infinite'. 'The world is neither finite nor infinite'. 'The soul is the same as the body'. 'The soul is one thing and the body another'. 'The Tathāgata exists after death'. 'The Tathāgata does not exist after death'. 'The Tathāgata both exists and does not exist after death'. 'The Tathāgata neither exists nor does not exist after death' is a question to be set aside; this is a question to be set aside.

"The Blessed One, great king, did not answer that question requiring to be set aside for the Elder Mālukyaputta. But why is that question to be set aside? There is no cause or reason for its explanation, therefore that question is to be set aside. There is no utterance of words without reason or cause for the Buddhas, the Blessed Ones." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the undeclared is the second.

3.

The Question on Fearing and Not Fearing Death

3. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'All tremble at the stick, all fear Death,' and again it was said: 'A Worthy One has gone beyond all fear.' Does indeed, venerable Nāgasena, a Worthy One tremble from fear of punishment, or do beings doomed to hell, blazing, boiling, heated, scorched, passing away from that great hell with blazing fire-flames, fear Death? If, venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'All tremble at the stick, all fear Death,' then the statement 'A Worthy One has gone beyond all fear' is wrong. If it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'A Worthy One has gone beyond all fear,' then the statement 'All tremble at the stick, all fear Death' is also wrong. This question with two points has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This statement, great king, was not spoken by the Blessed One with reference to Worthy Ones: 'All tremble at the stick, all fear Death.' The Worthy One is set aside in this matter; the cause of fear has been uprooted for the Worthy One. Those beings, great king, who have mental defilements, and those for whom the view of self is excessive, and those who are elated and dejected in pleasures and pains - with reference to them the Blessed One spoke: 'All tremble at the stick, all fear Death.' For the Worthy One, great king, all destinations have been cut off, the mode of generation has been demolished, conception has been destroyed, the ribs have been broken, all attachments to existence have been uprooted, all activities have been cut off, the wholesome and unwholesome have been destroyed, ignorance has been dispelled, consciousness has been made seedless, all mental defilements have been burnt, worldly adversities have been overcome; therefore the Worthy One does not tremble at all fears.

"Here, great king, a king might have four chief ministers who are protectors, who have gained fame, who are trustworthy, placed in a position of great sovereignty. Then when some royal duty has arisen, the king might command all the people throughout his own realm: 'Let all pay tribute to me; you four chief ministers, accomplish that duty.' Would indeed, great king, fear of tribute arise as terror for those four chief ministers?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "For what reason, great king?" "They, venerable sir, have been placed by the king in the highest position; there is no tribute for them; they have gone beyond tribute; with reference to the rest, the king commanded: 'Let all pay tribute to me.'" "Just so indeed, great king, this statement was not spoken by the Blessed One with reference to Worthy Ones; the Worthy One is set aside in this matter; the cause of fear has been uprooted for the Worthy One. Those beings, great king, who have mental defilements, and those for whom the view of self is excessive, and those who are elated and dejected in pleasures and pains - with reference to them the Blessed One spoke: 'All tremble at the stick, all fear Death.' Therefore the Worthy One does not tremble at all fears."

"This statement, venerable Nāgasena, is not with a remainder; this is a statement without remainder: 'all.' Tell me a further reason in this matter to establish that statement."

"Here, great king, a village owner in a village might command a herald: 'Come, my good herald, as many as are the villagers in the village, assemble all of them quickly in my presence.' He, having received it saying 'Good, my lord,' standing in the middle of the village, would proclaim the announcement three times: 'As many as are the villagers in the village, let all of them assemble very quickly in the presence of the lord.' Then those villagers, by the word of the herald, having assembled very quickly, announce to the village owner: 'All the villagers have assembled, my lord; whatever is to be done by you, do that.' Thus, great king, the village owner, while assembling the householders, commands all the villagers, yet those commanded do not all assemble - only the householders assemble. 'Just this many are my villagers' - thus the village owner accepts it. Many others who have not come - women and men, female and male slaves, hired servants, labourers, villagers, the sick, cattle and buffaloes, goats and sheep, dogs - those who have not come, all of them are not counted; because the command 'Let all assemble' was given with reference to the householders only. Just so indeed, great king, this statement was not spoken by the Blessed One with reference to Worthy Ones; the Worthy One is set aside in this matter; the cause of fear has been uprooted for the Worthy One. Those beings, great king, who have mental defilements, and those for whom the view of self is excessive, and those who are elated and dejected in pleasures and pains - with reference to them the Blessed One spoke: 'All tremble at the stick, all fear Death.' Therefore the Worthy One does not tremble at all fears.

"There is, great king, a statement with a remainder and a meaning with a remainder; there is a statement with a remainder and a meaning without remainder; there is a statement without remainder and a meaning with a remainder; there is a statement without remainder and a meaning without remainder. The meaning should be accepted according to each case.

"By five kinds of reasons, great king, the meaning should be accepted: by the direct statement, by the function, by the teacher's lineage, by the intention, and by the superiority of reason. Here 'direct statement' means the discourse is intended. 'Function' means conformity with the discourse. 'Teacher's lineage' means the teacher's tradition. 'Intention' means one's own understanding. 'Superiority of reason' means a reason that accords with these four. By these five reasons, great king, the meaning should be accepted. Thus this question is well determined."

"Let it be so, Venerable Nāgasena, I accept it thus. Let the Worthy One be set aside in this matter, let the remaining beings tremble, but do beings doomed to hell, experiencing painful, sharp, severe feelings, with all their limbs and minor limbs blazing and burning, with faces weeping, crying, wailing, lamenting and bewailing, overcome by unbearable sharp suffering, without shelter, without refuge, having become without refuge, afflicted with no small sorrow, having the final and last destination, heading for absolute sorrow, possessing the heat of hot, sharp, fierce, harsh, scorching fire, with dreadful, fear-producing roaring great sounds, entangled with sewn garlands of sixfold flames, with the speed of flames pervading a hundred yojanas all around, the miserly, scorching great hells - do they, passing away from there, fear Death?" "Yes, great king."

"Is it not so, Venerable Nāgasena, that hell is experienced as exclusively painful? Why then do those beings doomed to hell, passing away from hells experienced as exclusively painful, fear Death? Why do they delight in hell?" "Those beings doomed to hell, great king, do not delight in hell; they only wish to be released from hell. It is indeed the power of death, great king, by which fear arises in them." "This indeed, Venerable Nāgasena, I do not believe, that fear arises at death for those wishing to be released. It is laughable, Venerable Nāgasena, that state where they obtain what they wished for. Convince me by a reason."

"Death indeed, great king, is a state to be feared for those who have not seen the truth; here people tremble and are agitated. And whoever, great king, fears a black snake, he, fearing death, fears the black snake. And whoever fears an elephant, etc. of a lion, etc. of a tiger, etc. of a panther, etc. of a bear, etc. of a hyena, etc. of a buffalo, etc. of a gayal, etc. of fire, etc. of water, etc. of a stump, etc. fears a thorn. And whoever fears a spear, he, fearing death, fears the spear. That indeed, great king, is the heat of the intrinsic nature of death; by that heat of the intrinsic nature, beings with mental defilements tremble and fear death; even those wishing to be released, great king, beings doomed to hell, tremble and fear death.

"Here, great king, a fatty tumour might arise in a man's body. He, afflicted by that disease, wishing to be completely released from the affliction, might summon a physician, a surgeon. That physician, that surgeon, having accepted his word, might set up equipment for the removal of that disease, might sharpen a knife, might put twin probes into the fire, might have alkaline salt ground on a grindstone. Would fear arise, great king, in that sick person from the cutting with a sharp knife, from the burning with twin probes, from the application of alkaline salt?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Thus, great king, for that sick person, even though wishing to be released from the disease, fear arises from fear of the pain. Just so indeed, great king, for beings doomed to hell, even though wishing to be released from hell, fear arises from fear of death.

"Here, great king, a man who has offended against a lord, bound with bondage of chains, thrown into an inner room, might wish to be completely released; that lord, wishing to release him, might have him summoned. Would fear arise, great king, in that man who has offended against the lord, knowing 'I have committed an offence,' from seeing the lord?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Thus, great king, for that man who has offended against the lord, even though wishing to be completely released, fear arises from fear of the lord. Just so indeed, great king, for beings doomed to hell, even though wishing to be released from hell, fear arises from fear of death."

"Furthermore, venerable sir, tell me a further reason by which reason I might be convinced." "Here, great king, a man might be bitten by a venomous snake with poisonous fangs; he, by that change caused by the poison, might fall, jump up, roll about, and roll over; then a certain man, by a powerful spell, having brought that venomous snake with poisonous fangs, might make it suck back that poison. Would fear arise, great king, in that man from whom the poison has gone, when that venomous snake approaches for the purpose of his well-being?" "Yes, venerable sir." Thus, great king, even when such a snake approaches for the purpose of well-being, fear arises in him. Just so indeed, great king, for beings doomed to hell who wish to be released from hell, fear arises from the fear of death. Death is undesirable for all beings, great king; therefore beings doomed to hell, even though wishing to be released from hell, fear Death." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on fearing and not fearing death is the third.

4.

The Question on Release from the Snare of Death

4. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One -

"And again protections were recited by the Blessed One. As follows: the Ratana Sutta, the Metta Sutta, the Khandha Protection, the Mora Protection, the Dhajagga Protection, the Āṭānāṭiya Protection, the Aṅgulimāla Protection. If, venerable Nāgasena, one gone to space, or gone to the middle of the ocean, or gone into a mansion, hut, rock cell, cave, cliff, cleft, hole, mountain opening, or mountain interior is not freed from the snare of Death, then the act of protection is wrong. If by the making of protection there is release from the snare of Death, then 'Not in the sky, etc. the snare of Death' - that statement too is wrong. This too is a question with two points, more knotted than knotted, that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'Not in the sky, etc. the snare of Death,' and protections were recited by the Blessed One; but that is for one with remaining life span, accomplished in vitality, free from the obstruction of action. There is not, great king, for one whose life span is exhausted, any function or means for duration.

"Just as, great king, for a dead tree, dry, hollow, without sap, with life obstructed, with life formations gone, even if a thousand jars of water were poured, there would be neither wetness nor the state of sprouting green. Just so indeed, great king, by the act of medicine and protection there is no function or means for duration for one whose life span is exhausted. Whatever medicines and remedies there are on earth, great king, they too do not accomplish their function for one whose life span is exhausted. Protection protects and guards one with remaining life span, great king, accomplished in vitality, free from the obstruction of action; for that purpose protections were recited by the Blessed One.

"Just as, great king, a farmer might prevent the entry of water when the grain is fully ripe, when the crop stalks are dead; but whatever crop is young, cloud-like, accomplished in vitality, that grows by the increase of water. Just so indeed, great king, the function of medicine and protection is set aside, rejected for one whose life span is exhausted; but for those people who have remaining life span, who are accomplished in vitality, for their benefit protections and medicines were spoken; they grow by protections and medicines."

"If, venerable Nāgasena, one whose life span is exhausted dies, and one with remaining life span lives, then protections and medicines are useless?" "But have you, great king, seen before any disease turned back by medicines?" "Yes, venerable sir, I have seen many hundreds." "If so, great king, the statement 'the function of protection and medicine is useless' is wrong."

"The efforts of physicians are seen, venerable Nāgasena - medicine drinks and ointments; by those efforts of theirs disease is turned back." "Even when protections are being recited, great king, sound is heard, the tongue becomes dry, the heart is engaged, the throat becomes strained. By that recitation of theirs all diseases are appeased, all calamities depart."

"But have you, great king, seen before anyone bitten by a snake, with the poison being made to fall by a spell, vomiting the poison, rinsing above and below?" "Yes, venerable sir, even now that occurs in the world." "If so, great king, the statement 'the function of protection and medicine is useless' is wrong. For, great king, a snake wishing to bite a man for whom protection has been made does not bite; it closes its opened mouth; even the raised cudgel of thieves does not come to be; they, having released the cudgel, show affection; even an enraged noble elephant, having approached, desists; even a blazing great mass of fire, having approached, is extinguished; even deadly poison when eaten becomes medicine, or spreads for the purpose of nourishment; murderers wishing to kill, having approached, become like servants; even a snare stepped upon does not close.

"But have you heard before, great king, 'For seven hundred years a hunter was not able to bring a snare to a peacock for whom protection had been made; on the very day when protection was not made, he brought the snare'?" "Yes, venerable sir, it is heard; that sound has risen up in the world with its gods." "If so, great king, the statement 'the function of protection and medicine is useless' is wrong.

"But have you heard before, great king, 'a Titan, guarding his wife, having put her in a casket, having swallowed it, carries it about in his belly; then a certain sorcerer, having entered through the mouth of that Titan, enjoys himself together with her; when that Titan knew, then having vomited up the casket, he opened it; as soon as the casket was opened, the sorcerer departed as he wished'?" "Yes, venerable sir, it is heard; that sound too has risen up in the world with its gods." "Was not that sorcerer, great king, freed from seizure by the power of protection?" "Yes, venerable sir." "If so, great king, there is the power of protection.

"But have you heard before, great king, 'another sorcerer also, having corrupted the chief queen in the inner palace of the king of Bārāṇasī, being one who had come to seizure, in a moment went to disappearance by the power of spells'?" "Yes, venerable sir, it is heard." "Was not that sorcerer, great king, freed from seizure by the power of protection?" "Yes, venerable sir." "If so, great king, there is the power of protection."

"Venerable Nāgasena, 'does protection protect everyone indeed'?" "It protects some, great king, it does not protect some." "If so, Venerable Nāgasena, protection is not universal?" "Does food, great king, protect the life of everyone?" "It protects some, venerable sir, it does not protect some." "Why?" "Because, venerable sir, some, having overeaten that very food, die of cholera." "If so, great king, food does not protect the life of everyone?" "By two reasons, Venerable Nāgasena, food takes away life - either by overeating or by weakness of digestive heat; Venerable Nāgasena, food which gives life, by wrong use takes away life." "Just so indeed, great king, protection protects some, does not protect some.

"By three reasons, great king, protection does not protect - by obstruction by kamma, by obstruction by mental defilements, by lack of faith. Protection, great king, which guards beings, by what is done by oneself abandons the safeguarding; just as, great king, a mother nourishes a son gone to the womb, gives birth with beneficial care, having given birth, having removed impurity, stain, and mucus, anoints him with the highest excellent fragrance; he at a later time, when reviling or striking the sons of others, gives a blow. They, having become angry with him, having dragged him from the assembly, having seized him, bring him to the masters; if indeed her son has offended, has transgressed the limit. Then the master's men, dragging him, beat and strike him with sticks, clubs, knees, and fists. Is that mother, great king, able to prevent the dragging and pulling, the seizing, the bringing to the masters?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "For what reason, great king?" "By his own offence, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, protection which safeguards beings, by one's own offence makes it barren." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, the question has been well determined, the thicket has been made not a thicket, darkness has been made light, the net of wrong views has been disentangled; you have approached the most excellent of the excellent leaders of groups."

The question on release from the snare of death is the fourth.

5.

The Question on Obstacles to Attaining Buddhahood

5. "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'the Tathāgata is an obtainer of the requisites of robes, almsfood, lodging and medicine for the sick.' And yet the Tathāgata, having entered Pañcasālā, the brahmin village, for almsfood, not having obtained anything, departed with his bowl as washed. If, venerable Nāgasena, the Tathāgata is an obtainer of the requisites of robes, almsfood, lodging and medicine for the sick, then the statement that having entered Pañcasālā, the brahmin village, for almsfood, not having obtained anything, he departed with his bowl as washed - that statement is wrong. If having entered Pañcasālā, the brahmin village, for almsfood, not having obtained anything, he departed with his bowl as washed, then the statement that the Tathāgata is an obtainer of the requisites of robes, almsfood, lodging and medicine for the sick - that statement too is wrong. This too is a question with two points, very great, hard to unravel, that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"The Tathāgata, great king, is an obtainer of the requisites of robes, almsfood, lodging and medicine for the sick, and having entered Pañcasālā, the brahmin village, for almsfood, not having obtained anything, he departed with his bowl as washed; but that was because of Māra the Evil One." "If so, venerable Nāgasena, how was the wholesome prepared by the Blessed One during cosmic cycles surpassing the path of counting completed, how was the powerful force of that wholesome blocked by Māra the Evil One who had just arisen? If so, venerable Nāgasena, in that matter blame comes in two places: unwholesome is more powerful than wholesome, Māra's power is more powerful than the Buddha's power; if so, the top of a tree is heavier than the root, evil is more powerful than one endowed with virtues." "Not, great king, by just so much is unwholesome indeed more powerful than wholesome, not is Māra's power indeed more powerful than the Buddha's power. But here a reason should be sought.

"Just as, great king, a man might bring honey or a honey-ball or some other tribute to a wheel-turning monarch, and the king's gatekeeper might say to him thus: 'It is not the right time, sir, for seeing the king; if so, sir, having taken your tribute, return very quickly, lest the king impose punishment on you.' Then that man, trembling and agitated from fear of punishment, having taken that tribute, might return very quickly. Would that wheel-turning monarch, great king, by just that mere deficiency of tribute, be called weaker than the gatekeeper, or would he not obtain some other tribute?" "No indeed, venerable sir; out of jealousy, venerable sir, that gatekeeper prevented the tribute; but by another door, even a hundred thousand times as much tribute goes to the king." "Just so indeed, great king, out of jealousy Māra the Evil One took possession of the brahmin householders of Pañcasālā; but many other hundreds of thousands of deities, having taken the deathless divine nutriment, approached, thinking 'We will place nutriment in the Blessed One's body,' standing with joined palms, paying homage to the Blessed One."

"Let it be, venerable Nāgasena, the four requisites are easily obtained for the Blessed One, the highest person in the world; the Blessed One, being requested by gods and humans, uses the four requisites. But yet whatever was Māra's intention, that was accomplished by just so much, in that he created an obstacle to the Blessed One's food. Here, venerable sir, my uncertainty is not cut off; I have become one with doubt, plunged into perplexity. My mind does not spring forward there, that Māra created an obstacle to gain for the Tathāgata, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, the foremost excellent person in the world with its gods, one arisen from excellent wholesome merit, equal to the matchless, incomparable, without equal - something low, sinful, limited, evil, ignoble, failed."

"There are, great king, four obstacles: the obstacle of the unseen, the obstacle of what is designated, the obstacle of what is set aside, and the obstacle of what is being used. Therein, what is the obstacle of the unseen? Without designating, without seeing, someone creates an obstacle to what is not prepared, thinking 'What is the use of what is given to another?' - this is called the obstacle of the unseen.

"What is the obstacle to what is specifically prepared? Here, having pointed out a certain person, food is prepared for him; someone creates an obstacle to that - this is called the obstacle to what is specifically prepared.

"What is the obstacle to what is set aside? Here, whatever is set aside but not yet accepted, someone creates an obstacle to that - this is called the obstacle to what is set aside.

"What is the obstacle to what is for use? Here, whatever is for use, someone creates an obstacle to that - this is called the obstacle to what is for use. These, great king, are the four obstacles.

"But when Māra the Evil One took possession of the brahmin householders of Pañcasālā, that was neither for the Blessed One's use, nor set aside, nor specifically prepared; it was an obstacle created unseen to what had not arrived, what had not reached; and that was not for the Blessed One alone, but rather all those who had gone forth and arrived at that time, all of them did not obtain food on that day. I do not see anyone, great king, in the world with its gods, with its Māras, with its Brahmās, among the generation with its ascetics and brahmins, with its gods and humans, who could create an obstacle to what was made for the Blessed One, what was set aside, what was for use. If anyone out of envy were to create an obstacle to what was specifically prepared, what was set aside, what was for use, his head would split into a hundred or a thousand pieces.

"There are, great king, these four qualities of the Tathāgata that cannot be obstructed by anyone. Which four? Material gain, great king, specifically prepared and set aside for the Blessed One cannot be obstructed by anyone; the fathom-wide radiance accompanying the body of the Blessed One, great king, cannot be obstructed by anyone; the jewel of omniscient knowledge of the Blessed One, great king, cannot be obstructed by anyone; the life of the Blessed One, great king, cannot be obstructed by anyone. These, great king, are the four qualities of the Tathāgata that cannot be obstructed by anyone; all these qualities, great king, are of one flavour, healthy, unshakable, not subject to attack by others, untouchable functions. Unseen, great king, Māra the Evil One, having hidden, took possession of the brahmin householders of Pañcasālā.

"Just as, great king, in a king's borderland region, in uneven terrain, having hidden unseen, thieves spoil the road. If the king were to see those thieves, would those thieves obtain safety?" "No indeed, venerable sir, he would have them split with a hatchet into a hundred or a thousand pieces." "Just so indeed, great king, unseen, Māra the Evil One, having hidden, took possession of the brahmin householders of Pañcasālā.

"Or else, great king, just as a married woman, unseen, having hidden, keeps company with another man, just so indeed, great king, unseen, Māra the Evil One, having hidden, took possession of the brahmin householders of Pañcasālā. If, great king, a woman were to keep company with another man in the presence of her husband, would that woman obtain safety?" "No indeed, venerable sir, the husband might kill her, venerable sir, might slay her, might bind her, or might reduce her to slavery." "Just so indeed, great king, unseen, Māra the Evil One, having hidden, took possession of the brahmin householders of Pañcasālā. If, great king, Māra the Evil One were to create an obstacle to what was made for the Blessed One, what was set aside, what was for use, his head would split into a hundred or a thousand pieces." "Thus it is, Venerable Nāgasena, it was done by theft by Māra the Evil One; having hidden, Māra the Evil One took possession of the brahmin householders of Pañcasālā. If, venerable sir, that Māra the Evil One were to create an obstacle to what was made for the Blessed One, what was set aside, what was for use, either his head would split into a hundred or a thousand pieces, or his body would scatter like a handful of chaff. Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on obstacles to attaining Buddhahood is the fifth.

6.

The Question on Demerit

6. "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'one who not knowing commits killing of living beings, he generates more demerit.' And again it was spoken by the Blessed One in the regulation of the monastic discipline: 'There is no offence for one not knowing.' If, venerable Nāgasena, one not knowing committing killing of living beings generates more demerit, then the statement 'there is no offence for one not knowing' is wrong. If there is no offence for one not knowing, then the statement 'one not knowing committing killing of living beings generates more demerit' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points, difficult to answer, difficult to cross, that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'One who not knowing commits killing of living beings, he generates more demerit.' And again it was spoken by the Blessed One in the regulation of the monastic discipline: 'There is no offence for one not knowing.' Therein there is a difference in meaning. What is the difference in meaning? There is, great king, an offence with mitigation due to misperception; there is an offence with no mitigation due to misperception. That offence, great king, which has mitigation due to misperception - concerning that offence it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'There is no offence for one not knowing.'" "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on demerit is the sixth.

7.

The Question on Caring for the Community of Monks

7. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'The Tathāgata, Ānanda, does not think thus - "I will lead the Community of monks" or "The Community of monks is under my direction."' And again, while illuminating the intrinsic qualities of the Blessed One Metteyya, it was spoken thus by the Blessed One: 'He will look after a Community of monks numbering many thousands, just as I now look after a Community of monks numbering many hundreds.' If, Venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'The Tathāgata, Ānanda, does not think thus - "I will lead the Community of monks" or "The Community of monks is under my direction,"' then the statement 'I look after a Community of monks numbering many hundreds' is wrong. If it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'He will look after a Community of monks numbering many thousands, just as I now look after a Community of monks numbering many hundreds,' then the statement 'The Tathāgata, Ānanda, does not think thus - "I will lead the Community of monks" or "The Community of monks is under my direction"' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'The Tathāgata, Ānanda, does not think thus - "I will lead the Community of monks" or "The Community of monks is under my direction."' And again, while illuminating the intrinsic qualities of the Blessed One Metteyya, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'He will look after a Community of monks numbering many thousands, just as I now look after a Community of monks numbering many hundreds.' And in this question, great king, one meaning is with a remainder, one meaning is without remainder. The Tathāgata, great king, is not a follower of the assembly; but the assembly is a follower of the Tathāgata. This is conventional, great king, 'I' and 'mine,' not ultimate reality. Love has departed from the Tathāgata, great king, affection has departed; there is no grasping of 'mine' for the Tathāgata, but with reference to clinging there is support.

"Just as, great king, the earth is a support and dwelling for beings standing on the ground, and these beings stand on the earth, yet the great earth has no expectation 'these are mine,' just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata is a support and dwelling for all beings, and these beings stand on the Tathāgata, yet the Tathāgata has no expectation 'these are mine.' Or just as, great king, a great rain cloud raining down gives growth to grasses, trees, animals, and humans, and safeguards their continuity. All these beings live on the rain, yet the great cloud has no expectation 'these are mine.' Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata generates and safeguards wholesome mental states for all beings; all these beings live on the Teacher, yet the Tathāgata has no expectation 'these are mine.' What is the reason for this? Because the view of self has been abandoned."

"Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, the question has been well unravelled by many reasons, the deep has been made clear, the knot has been cut, the thicket has been made not a thicket, darkness has been made light, the opposing doctrines are broken, vision has been produced for the sons of the Conqueror."

The question on caring for the community of monks is the seventh.

8.

The Question on the Undivided Assembly

8. "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'the Tathāgata has an assembly that cannot be divided,' and again you say 'by Devadatta, all at once, five hundred monks were split off.' If, venerable Nāgasena, the Tathāgata has an assembly that cannot be divided, then the statement that by Devadatta, all at once, five hundred monks were split off is wrong. If by Devadatta, all at once, five hundred monks were split off, then the statement 'the Tathāgata has an assembly that cannot be divided' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you, deep, hard to unravel, more knotted than knotted; here people are obstructed, hindered, enveloped, closed, covered up; here show the power of your knowledge in refuting the doctrines of others."

"The Tathāgata has an assembly that cannot be divided, great king, and by Devadatta, all at once, five hundred monks were split off; but that was by the power of the one who causes division. When there is one who causes division, great king, there is nothing called 'that which cannot be divided.' When there is one who causes division, even a mother is divided from her son, even a son is divided from his mother, even a father is divided from his son, even a son is divided from his father, even a brother is divided from his sister, even a sister is divided from her brother, even a friend is divided from his friend, even a boat joined together from various timbers is broken by the force of the impact of waves, even a tree with fruit full of honey is broken when struck by the force of the power of the wind, even gold of good birth is broken by copper. But moreover, great king, this is not the intention of the wise, this is not the disposition of the Buddhas, this is not the wish of the wise that 'the Tathāgata has an assembly that can be divided.' But there is a reason here, by which reason the Tathāgata is called 'one with an assembly that cannot be divided.' What is the reason here? It has never been heard before, great king, that the Tathāgata's assembly was split by any conduct he engaged in, whether by not giving, or by unpleasant speech, or by unbeneficial conduct, or by impartiality; for that reason the Tathāgata is called 'one with an assembly that cannot be divided.' This too should be known by you, great king: 'Is there anything in the ninefold word of the Buddha, come down in the discourses, that by this reason, by something done by the Bodhisatta, the Tathāgata's assembly was split?'" "There is not, venerable sir, and this is neither seen nor heard in the world. Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the undivided assembly is the eighth.

The Undivided Chapter is the second.

In this chapter there are eight questions.

3.

The Chapter on Dismissal

1.

The Question on the Foremost Teaching

1. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'For the Teaching, Vāseṭṭha, is foremost among people, both in this present life and in the future life.' And again: 'A lay follower, a householder, a stream-enterer, with the realms of misery closed, one attained to right view, who has understood the teaching, pays respect to a monk or a novice who is a worldling, and rises up in respect.' If, venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'For the Teaching, Vāseṭṭha, is foremost among people, both in this present life and in the future life,' then the statement 'A lay follower, a householder, a stream-enterer, with the realms of misery closed, one attained to right view, who has understood the teaching, pays respect to a monk or a novice who is a worldling, and rises up in respect' is wrong. If 'A lay follower, a householder, a stream-enterer, with the realms of misery closed, one attained to right view, who has understood the teaching, pays respect to a monk or a novice who is a worldling, and rises up in respect,' then the statement 'For the Teaching, Vāseṭṭha, is foremost among people, both in this present life and in the future life' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'For the Teaching, Vāseṭṭha, is foremost among people, both in this present life and in the future life,' and 'A lay follower, a householder, a stream-enterer, with the realms of misery closed, one attained to right view, who has understood the teaching, pays respect to a monk or a novice who is a worldling, and rises up in respect.' But there is a reason for this. What is that reason?

"There are, great king, these twenty qualities that make an ascetic an ascetic and two marks, by which an ascetic is worthy of paying respect, rising up in respect, honour and veneration. What are the twenty qualities that make an ascetic an ascetic and the two marks? Foremost delight in the Teaching, supreme restraint, conduct, abiding, self-control, restraint, patience, meekness, solitary practice, delight in solitude, seclusion, shame and moral fear, energy, diligence, undertaking of the training, recitation, interrogation, delight in morality and so on, freedom from attachment, fulfilment of the training rules, wearing of the orange robe, and the state of being shaven-headed. These, great king, are the twenty qualities that make an ascetic an ascetic and the two marks. A monk lives having undertaken these virtues; because of the non-deficiency, completeness, accomplishment, and endowment with those qualities, he enters the plane of one beyond training, the plane of a Worthy One, he enters the foremost intermediate plane, and because he has approached arahantship, it is proper for a lay follower who is a stream-enterer to pay respect to a monk who is a worldling and to rise up in respect.

"'He has attained fellowship with those who have eliminated the mental corruptions; I do not have that opportunity' - thus it is proper for a lay follower who is a stream-enterer to pay respect to a monk who is a worldling and to rise up in respect.

"'He has attained the foremost assembly; I have not attained that state' - thus it is proper for a lay follower who is a stream-enterer to pay respect to a monk who is a worldling and to rise up in respect.

"'He is able to hear the recitation of the Pātimokkha; I am not able to hear it' - thus it is proper for a lay follower who is a stream-enterer to pay respect to a monk who is a worldling and to rise up in respect.

"'He gives the going forth to others, gives full ordination, and increases the Conqueror's Dispensation; I am not able to do this' - thus it is proper for a lay follower who is a stream-enterer to pay respect to a monk who is a worldling and to rise up in respect.

"'He is one who completely fulfils the immeasurable training rules; I do not practise in them' - thus it is proper for a lay follower who is a stream-enterer to pay respect to a monk who is a worldling and to rise up in respect.

"'He has attained the mark of an ascetic, he stands in the Buddha's intention; I have gone far from that mark' - thus it is proper for a lay follower who is a stream-enterer to pay respect to a monk who is a worldling and to rise up in respect.

"'He has grown hair in the armpits, is unanointed and unadorned, with the fragrance of morality unsmeared; but I delight in adornment and decoration' - thus it is proper for a lay follower who is a stream-enterer to pay respect to a monk who is a worldling and to rise up in respect.

"Moreover, great king, 'Those twenty qualities that make an ascetic an ascetic and the two marks, all these qualities are found in a monk; he himself retains those qualities and also trains others in them; I do not have that approach and training' - thus it is proper for a lay follower who is a stream-enterer to pay respect to a monk who is a worldling and to rise up in respect.

"Just as, great king, a prince studies knowledge in the presence of a chaplain, learns the duties of a warrior, and at a later time, having been consecrated, pays respect to his teacher and rises up in respect, thinking 'This is my trainer,' just so indeed, great king, 'A monk is a trainer, a bearer of the lineage' - thus it is proper for a lay follower who is a stream-enterer to pay respect to a monk who is a worldling and to rise up in respect.

"Moreover, great king, by this method too know the greatness and unequalled vastness of the monk's plane. If, great king, a lay follower who is a stream-enterer realizes arahantship, there are only two destinations for him, no other: on that very day he would either attain final Nibbāna or would attain the state of a monk. For that going forth, great king, is immovable, great and very lofty, namely the monk's plane." "The question has gone to knowledge, venerable Nāgasena, well unravelled by you who are powerful and of superior intelligence; no other is competent to unravel this question thus except one wise like you."

The question on the foremost teaching is the first.

2.

The Question on Pervading All Beings with Welfare

2. "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'the Tathāgata, having removed harm, provides welfare for all beings.' And again you say that when the exposition of the Teaching on the Simile of the Mass of Fire was being spoken, 'hot blood gushed from the mouths of about sixty monks.' Venerable sir, by the Tathāgata teaching the exposition of the Teaching on the Simile of the Mass of Fire, welfare was removed and harm was provided for about sixty monks. If, venerable Nāgasena, the Tathāgata, having removed harm, provides welfare for all beings, then the statement that when the exposition of the Teaching on the Simile of the Mass of Fire was being spoken, hot blood gushed from the mouths of about sixty monks - that statement is wrong. If when the exposition of the Teaching on the Simile of the Mass of Fire was being spoken, hot blood gushed from the mouths of about sixty monks, then the statement that the Tathāgata, having removed harm, provides welfare for all beings - that statement too is wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"The Tathāgata, great king, having removed harm, provides welfare for all beings; when the exposition of the Teaching on the Simile of the Mass of Fire was being spoken, hot blood gushed from the mouths of about sixty monks, but that was not by the Tathāgata's doing, but by their own doing."

"If, venerable Nāgasena, the Tathāgata had not spoken the exposition of the Teaching on the Simile of the Mass of Fire, would hot blood have gushed from their mouths?" "No indeed, great king, for those who were wrongly practised, having heard the Blessed One's exposition of the Teaching, fever arose in their bodies; by that fever of theirs, hot blood gushed from their mouths." "If so, venerable Nāgasena, it was by the Tathāgata's doing that hot blood gushed from their mouths; the Tathāgata alone was the cause there for their destruction. Just as, venerable Nāgasena, a snake might enter an ant-hill, and then a certain man wanting dust, having broken the ant-hill, might carry away the dust, and by his carrying away the dust, the hole of the ant-hill might be blocked, and then right there, not getting breath, it might die - is not that snake, venerable sir, brought to death by that man's doing?" "Yes, great king." "Just so indeed, venerable Nāgasena, the Tathāgata alone was the cause there for their destruction."

"The Tathāgata, great king, while teaching the Teaching, does not create attraction and aversion; free from attraction and aversion, he teaches the Teaching. Thus when the Teaching is being taught, those there who are rightly practised, they understand fully. But those who are wrongly practised, they fall. Just as, great king, when a man is shaking a mango or a rose-apple or a honey tree, whatever fruits there are substantial and firmly attached, they remain there unfallen, but whatever fruits there have rotten stalks and roots and are weakly attached, they fall. Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata, while teaching the Teaching, does not create attraction and aversion; free from attraction and aversion, he teaches the Teaching. Thus when the Teaching is being taught, those there who are rightly practised, they understand fully. But those who are wrongly practised, they fall.

"Or else, great king, a farmer wishing to plant grain ploughs the field; as he ploughs, many hundreds of thousands of grasses die. Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata, awakening beings whose minds are mature, free from attraction and aversion, teaches the Teaching. Thus when the Teaching is being taught, those there who are rightly practised, they understand fully. But those who are wrongly practised, they die like grasses.

"Or just as, great king, human beings for the sake of flavour crush sugar-cane with a machine, and as they are crushing the sugar-cane, whatever worms have entered the mouth of the machine, they are crushed. Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata, awakening beings whose minds are mature, presses the machine of the Teaching, and those who are wrongly practised there, they die like worms."

"Is it not so, Venerable Nāgasena, that those monks fell by that teaching of the Teaching?" "Does a carpenter, great king, planing a tree, make it straight and pure?" "No indeed, venerable sir, having removed what is to be avoided, the carpenter makes the tree straight and pure." "Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata, protecting the assembly, is not able to awaken beings capable of being awakened; but having removed beings who are wrongly practised, he awakens beings capable of being awakened; but by their own doing, great king, those wrongly practised fall.

"Just as, great king, the plantain, the bamboo, and the mule are destroyed by what is self-produced, just so indeed, great king, those who are wrongly practised, they are destroyed by their own doing and fall.

"Just as, great king, thieves by their own doing receive the gouging out of eyes, impalement, and beheading, just so indeed, great king, those who are wrongly practised, they are destroyed by their own doing and fall. For those about sixty monks, great king, from whose mouths hot blood gushed forth, that was neither by the doing of the Blessed One, nor by the doing of others, but indeed by their own doing.

"Just as, great king, a man might give the deathless to all people, and they, having consumed that deathless, healthy and long-lived, might be released from all calamities; then a certain man, through wrong use, having consumed that, might reach death - would that man who gave the deathless, great king, commit any demerit on that account?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata gives the deathless gift of the Teaching to gods and humans in the ten-thousand-fold world system; those beings who are capable, they are awakened by the deathless Teaching. But those beings who are incapable, they are destroyed and fall by the deathless Teaching. Food, great king, protects the life of all beings; some, having eaten it, die of cholera - would that man who gave the food, great king, commit any demerit on that account?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata gives the deathless gift of the Teaching to gods and humans in the ten-thousand-fold world system; those beings who are capable, they are awakened by the deathless Teaching. But those beings who are incapable, they are destroyed and fall by the deathless Teaching." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on pervading all beings with welfare is the second.

3.

The Question on Showing What is Concealed by Cloth

3. "Venerable Nāgasena, this was said by the Tathāgata:

"And yet the Tathāgata, having sat down in the midst of the four assemblies, in front of gods and humans, showed to the brahmin Sela his private parts sheathed in a cloth. If, venerable Nāgasena, it was said by the Blessed One 'Restraint by body is good,' then the statement that he showed to the brahmin Sela his private parts sheathed in a cloth is wrong. If he shows to the brahmin Sela his private parts sheathed in a cloth, then that statement 'Restraint by body is good' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This was said, great king, by the Blessed One 'Restraint by body is good,' and his private parts sheathed in a cloth were shown to the brahmin Sela. For whoever, great king, has uncertainty arisen regarding the Tathāgata, for his awakening the Blessed One shows by supernormal power a corresponding body, he alone sees that wonder."

"But who would believe this, venerable Nāgasena, that one who has gone to an assembly alone sees that secret, while the rest remaining right there do not see it? Come now, point out to me the reason for this, convince me by means of reason." "But have you, great king, previously seen any sick man surrounded by relatives and friends?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Does that assembly, great king, see that feeling by which that man feels the feeling?" "No indeed, venerable sir, that man, venerable sir, feels it only by himself." "Just so, great king, for whoever has uncertainty arisen regarding the Tathāgata, for him alone the Tathāgata shows by supernormal power a corresponding body for his awakening, he alone sees that wonder.

"Or just as, great king, if a spirit were to possess some man, does that assembly, great king, see that coming of the spirit?" "No indeed, venerable sir, only that afflicted one sees the coming of that spirit." "Just so, great king, for whoever has uncertainty arisen regarding the Tathāgata, for him alone the Tathāgata shows by supernormal power a corresponding body for his awakening, he alone sees that wonder."

"A difficult thing, venerable Nāgasena, was done by the Blessed One, in showing that which should not be shown even to one." "The Blessed One, great king, did not show the secret, but by supernormal power he showed a shadow." "Even when a shadow is seen, venerable sir, the secret is indeed seen, having seen which he came to a conclusion." "Even what is difficult to do, great king, the Tathāgata does to awaken beings capable of being awakened. If, great king, the Tathāgata were to neglect the action, beings capable of being awakened would not awaken. But because, great king, the Tathāgata knows the means to awaken beings capable of being awakened, therefore the Tathāgata awakens those capable of being awakened by whatever means they awaken.

"Just as, great king, a physician, a surgeon, approaches the sick with whatever medicine makes the sick healthy, with that medicine he approaches the sick, he administers an emetic, he administers a purgative, he applies an ointment, he administers an enema. Just so, great king, the Tathāgata awakens by whatever means beings capable of being awakened awaken.

"Or just as, great king, a woman with an obstructed womb shows to a physician her secret that should not be shown, just so, great king, the Tathāgata, to awaken beings capable of being awakened, showed by supernormal power a shadow of the secret that should not be shown. There is no place, great king, called 'not to be shown' with reference to a person. If, great king, anyone would awaken by seeing the Blessed One's heart, the Blessed One would show his heart by means, the Tathāgata, great king, knows the means, is skilled in teaching.

"Surely, great king, the Tathāgata, having known the disposition of the elder Nanda, led him to that divine abode and showed him the heavenly maidens, thinking 'by this means this son of good family will understand,' and by that means that son of good family understood. Thus indeed, great king, the Tathāgata, while in many ways scorning, censuring, and loathing the sign of the beautiful, showed the dove-footed nymphs for the sake of his awakening. Thus too the Tathāgata is one who knows the appropriate means, skilled in teaching.

"Furthermore, great king, the Tathāgata, having approached the elder Cūḷapanthaka who had been expelled by his brother, who was distressed and dejected, gave him a fine piece of cloth, thinking 'by this means this son of good family will understand,' and that son of good family by that means attained mastery in the Conqueror's Dispensation. Thus too, great king, the Tathāgata is one who knows the appropriate means, skilled in teaching.

"Furthermore, great king, the Tathāgata, when asked a question by the brahmin Mogharāja up to the third time, did not answer, thinking 'thus this son of good family's conceit will subside, and through the subsiding of conceit there will be full realization,' and by that means that son of good family's conceit subsided, and through the subsiding of conceit that brahmin attained mastery in the six direct knowledges. Thus too, great king, the Tathāgata is one who knows the appropriate means, skilled in teaching."

"Excellent, venerable Nāgasena, the question has been well unravelled by manifold reasons, the thicket has been made a non-thicket, darkness has been made light, the knot has been broken, the opposing doctrines have been shattered, vision has been produced by you for the sons of the Conqueror, the sectarians are without discernment, you have approached the most excellent of the excellent leaders."

The question on showing what is concealed by cloth is the third.

4.

The Question on the Existence of Harsh Speech

4. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the elder Sāriputta, the General of the Teaching: 'The Tathāgata, friends, is of pure verbal conduct; there is no verbal misconduct of the Tathāgata that the Tathāgata should guard against, thinking: "Let not another know this of me."' And yet the Tathāgata, when laying down the offence involving expulsion regarding the offence of the elder Sudinna the Kalanda's son, behaved with harsh speech, with the address 'foolish man,' and because of that, that elder, being obstructed by a dejected mind through the address 'foolish man,' became remorseful and was not able to penetrate the noble path. If, Venerable Nāgasena, the Tathāgata is of pure verbal conduct, there is no verbal misconduct of the Tathāgata, then the statement that the Tathāgata behaved with the address 'foolish man' regarding the offence of the elder Sudinna the Kalanda's son is wrong. If the Blessed One behaved with the address 'foolish man' regarding the offence of the elder Sudinna the Kalanda's son, then the statement that the Tathāgata is of pure verbal conduct, there is no verbal misconduct of the Tathāgata, that too is wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the elder Sāriputta, the General of the Teaching: 'The Tathāgata, friends, is of pure verbal conduct; there is no verbal misconduct of the Tathāgata that the Tathāgata should guard against, thinking: "Let not another know this of me."' And regarding the offence of the Venerable Sudinna the Kalanda's son, when laying down the offence involving expulsion, the Blessed One behaved with the address 'foolish man,' but that was with an uncorrupted mind, without vehemence, with an exact characteristic. And what is the exact characteristic there? For whatever person, great king, there is no full realization of the four truths in this individual existence, his masculinity is empty; one thing being done, another comes to be by another; therefore he is called 'a foolish man.' Thus, great king, the Blessed One behaved towards the Venerable Sudinna the Kalanda's son with a truthful statement, not with a false statement."

"Even regarding the intrinsic nature, Venerable Nāgasena, whoever speaks while reviling, we impose a fine of a coin on him; that is indeed an offence - he reviles while practising a separate convention in dependence on a matter." "But have you, great king, heard before of paying respect or rising up in respect or honour or giving of gifts to one who has stumbled?" "No indeed, venerable sir, from wherever, wherever one has stumbled, he is worthy of censure, worthy of reproof; they even cut off his head, they also strike, they also bind, they also kill, they also burn." "If so, great king, a function was indeed performed by the Blessed One, not non-function."

"Even a function, Venerable Nāgasena, should be done by one doing it in a fitting manner, in a suitable manner. Even by hearing, Venerable Nāgasena, the world with its gods has moral fear and shame towards the Tathāgata; more so by seeing, even more by approaching, by attending upon." "Does a physician, great king, when the body is congested, when the disorder is aggravated, give softening medicines?" "No indeed, venerable sir, he gives sharp, scraping medicines." "Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata gives instruction for the appeasement of all the diseases of mental defilements. Even the harsh speech of the Tathāgata, great king, softens beings, makes them gentle. Just as, great king, even hot water softens whatever is to be softened, makes it soft, just so indeed, great king, even the harsh speech of the Tathāgata is full of meaning, accompanied by compassion. Just as, great king, a father's word is full of meaning for his sons, accompanied by compassion, just so indeed, great king, even the harsh speech of the Tathāgata is full of meaning, accompanied by compassion. Even the harsh speech of the Tathāgata, great king, is for the abandoning of mental defilements of beings. Just as, great king, even foul-smelling cow's urine when drunk, even tasteless medicine when chewed, destroys the disease of beings, just so indeed, great king, even the harsh speech of the Tathāgata is full of meaning, accompanied by compassion. Just as, great king, even a large heap of cotton, having fallen on another's body, does not cause pain, just so indeed, great king, even the harsh speech of the Tathāgata does not produce suffering for anyone." "Well determined, Venerable Nāgasena, is the question by many reasons. Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the existence of harsh speech is the fourth.

5.

The Question on the Existence of Non-Sentience in Trees

5. "Venerable Nāgasena, this was said by the Tathāgata:

And again it was said:

"If, Venerable Nāgasena, a tree is without consciousness, then the statement that the Phandana tree conversed with Bhāradvāja is wrong. If the Phandana tree conversed with Bhāradvāja, then the statement that a tree is without consciousness, that too is wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'A tree is without consciousness,' and the Phandana tree conversed with Bhāradvāja; but that statement was spoken according to popular convention. There is not, great king, any conversation of a tree without consciousness; but, great king, this is a designation for the deity dwelling in that tree as 'tree,' and 'the tree converses' - this is a popular designation. Just as, great king, people call a cart filled with grain a 'grain cart,' yet that cart is not made of grain, the cart is made of wood; but because grain is heaped in that cart, people call it a 'grain cart.' Just so indeed, great king, a tree does not converse, a tree is without consciousness; but the deity dwelling in that tree - that is just a designation for her as 'tree,' and 'the tree converses' - this is a popular designation.

"Or else, great king, one churning curds says 'I am churning buttermilk,' yet it is not buttermilk that he churns; churning just curds, he says 'I am churning buttermilk.' Just so indeed, great king, a tree does not converse, a tree is without consciousness. But the deity dwelling in that tree - that is just a designation for her as 'tree,' and 'the tree converses' - this is a popular designation.

"Or else, great king, one wishing to accomplish what is not yet present says 'I am accomplishing what is present,' one says 'accomplished' of what is not accomplished - thus this is popular convention. Just so indeed, great king, a tree does not converse, a tree is without consciousness. But the deity dwelling in that tree - that is just a designation for her as 'tree,' and 'the tree converses' - this is a popular designation. By whatever popular convention, great king, people express themselves, by that very popular convention the Tathāgata too teaches the Teaching to beings." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the existence of non-sentience in trees is the fifth.

6.

The Question on the Great Fruit of Almsfood

6. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the elder monks who held the recital of sacred scriptures -

"And again it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'These two, Ānanda, almsfoods are of equal fruit, of equal result, far greater in fruit and far greater in benefit than other almsfoods. Which two? The almsfood having eaten which the Tathāgata fully awakens to the unsurpassed perfect enlightenment, and the almsfood having eaten which the Tathāgata attains final Nibbāna through the Nibbāna element without residue of clinging. These two almsfoods are of equal fruit, of equal result, far greater in fruit and far greater in benefit than other almsfoods.' If, venerable Nāgasena, a severe illness arose in the Blessed One who had finished eating the meal of Cunda, and painful feelings occurred bordering on death, then the statement 'These two, Ānanda, almsfoods are of equal fruit, of equal result, far greater in fruit and far greater in benefit than other almsfoods' is wrong. If these two almsfoods are of equal fruit, of equal result, far greater in fruit and far greater in benefit than other almsfoods, then the statement that a severe illness arose in the Blessed One who had finished eating the meal of Cunda, and painful feelings occurred bordering on death, that too is wrong. Is that almsfood indeed, venerable Nāgasena, of great fruit because of going to poison, of great fruit because of producing disease, of great fruit because of destroying life, of great fruit because of taking the Blessed One's life? Tell me the reason for this, for the refutation of the doctrines of others; here people are deluded, thinking that bloody diarrhoea arose through eating too much under the influence of greed. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the elder monks who held the recital of sacred scriptures -

"And it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'These two, Ānanda, almsfoods are of equal fruit, of equal result, far greater in fruit and far greater in benefit than other almsfoods. Which two? The almsfood having eaten which the Tathāgata fully awakens to the unsurpassed perfect enlightenment, and the almsfood having eaten which the Tathāgata attains final Nibbāna through the Nibbāna element without residue of clinging - these two almsfoods are of equal fruit, of equal result, far greater in fruit and far greater in benefit than other almsfoods.'

"That almsfood, however, was of many virtues and many benefits. The deities, great king, joyful, with devoted minds, thinking 'This is the Blessed One's last almsfood,' sprinkled divine nutriment on the pig's delight. And that was properly cooked, easily digestible, delightful, of many flavours, beneficial for the fire of the stomach. Not, great king, on that account did any unarisen disease arise in the Blessed One; but rather, great king, in the Blessed One's body which was naturally weak, with the life principle exhausted, the arisen disease increased further.

"Just as, great king, a fire burning naturally, when other fuel is given, blazes up more, even so indeed, great king, in the Blessed One's body which was naturally weak, with the life principle exhausted, the arisen disease increased further.

"Or just as, great king, a stream flowing naturally, when a great rain cloud has emerged, becomes a great flood carrying water, even so indeed, great king, in the Blessed One's body which was naturally weak, with the life principle exhausted, the arisen disease increased further.

"Or just as, great king, a belly naturally full of humours, when something else is swallowed, would extend further, even so indeed, great king, in the Blessed One's body which was naturally weak, with the life principle exhausted, the arisen disease increased further. There is not, great king, any fault in that almsfood, nor is it possible to attribute fault to it."

"Venerable Nāgasena, for what reason are those two almsfoods of equal fruit, of equal result, far greater in fruit and far greater in benefit than other almsfoods?" "By the power of attainment through reviewing the mental states, great king, those two almsfoods are of equal fruit, of equal result, far greater in fruit and far greater in benefit than other almsfoods."

"Venerable Nāgasena, by the power of attainment through reviewing which mental states are those two almsfoods of equal fruit, of equal result, far greater in fruit and far greater in benefit than other almsfoods?" "By the power of attaining the nine progressive abiding attainments in forward and reverse order, great king, those two almsfoods are of equal fruit, of equal result, far greater in fruit and far greater in benefit than other almsfoods."

"Venerable Nāgasena, did the Tathāgata exceedingly attain the nine progressive abiding attainments in forward and reverse order in just two days?" "Yes, great king." "Wonderful, Venerable Nāgasena, marvellous, Venerable Nāgasena. That which is the incomparable supreme gift in this Buddha-field, even that is not counted among these two almsfoods. Wonderful, Venerable Nāgasena, marvellous, Venerable Nāgasena. How great are the nine progressive abiding attainments, inasmuch as by the power of the nine progressive abiding attainments a gift becomes of greater fruit and greater benefit. Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the great fruit of almsfood is the sixth.

7.

The Question on Honouring the Buddha

7. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'You, Ānanda, should not be occupied with the veneration of the Tathāgata's body.' And again it was said:

"If, Venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'You, Ānanda, should not be occupied with the veneration of the Tathāgata's body,' then the statement 'Venerate the relic of one worthy of veneration, thus doing you will go from here to heaven' is wrong. If it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'Venerate the relic of one worthy of veneration, thus doing you will go from here to heaven,' then the statement 'You, Ānanda, should not be occupied with the veneration of the Tathāgata's body' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'You, Ānanda, should not be occupied with the veneration of the Tathāgata's body,' and again it was said: 'Venerate the relic of one worthy of veneration, thus doing you will go from here to heaven,' but that was not spoken concerning all the sons of the Conqueror: 'You, Ānanda, should not be occupied with the veneration of the Tathāgata's body.' For this, great king, is an invalid act for the sons of the Conqueror, that is to say, veneration; exploration of activities, wise attention, observation of the establishments of mindfulness, grasping the essence of the object, warfare against defilements, pursuit of one's own welfare - this is to be done by the sons of the Conqueror; veneration is to be done by the remaining gods and humans.

"Just as, great king, on earth for princes, training in elephants, horses, chariots, bows, sword-hilts, writing, seals, swords, sacred hymns, the Vedas, convention, warfare, and military tactics is to be done, while for the remaining various merchants and workers, farming, trade, and cow-keeping is to be done, even so, great king, this is an invalid act for the sons of the Conqueror, that is to say, veneration; exploration of activities, wise attention, observation of the establishments of mindfulness, grasping the essence of the object, warfare against defilements, pursuit of one's own welfare - this is to be done by the sons of the Conqueror; veneration is to be done by the remaining gods and humans.

"Or else, great king, just as for brahmin students, training in the Rig Veda, Yajur Veda, Sāma Veda, Atharva Veda, marks, history, ancient texts, glossary, ritual, phonetics, terms, grammar, linguistics, omens, dreams, signs, the six factors, lunar eclipses, solar eclipses, the course of Venus and Rāhu, planetary warfare, divine thunder, descent, meteor falls, earthquakes, burning of directions, terrestrial and atmospheric phenomena, astrology, sophistry, the cart-wheel, the deer-wheel, the intermediate wheel, mixed arising, and bird calls and cries is to be done, while for the remaining various merchants and workers, farming, trade, and cow-keeping is to be done, even so, great king, this is an invalid act for the sons of the Conqueror, that is to say, veneration; exploration of activities, wise attention, observation of the establishments of mindfulness, grasping the essence of the object, warfare against defilements, pursuit of one's own welfare - this is to be done by the sons of the Conqueror; veneration is to be done by the remaining gods and humans. Therefore, great king, the Tathāgata said 'You, Ānanda, should not be occupied with the veneration of the Tathāgata's body,' thinking 'Let these not engage in an invalid act, let these engage in a valid act.' If, great king, the Tathāgata had not spoken this, monks, having even exhausted their own bowls and robes, would just make offerings to the Buddha." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on honouring the Buddha is the seventh.

8.

The Question on the Foot Struck by a Splinter

8. "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'when the Blessed One was walking, this senseless great earth rises up where it is low, and bends down where it is high,' and again you say 'the Blessed One's foot was cut by a splinter.' That splinter which fell upon the Blessed One's foot, why then did that splinter not turn back from the Blessed One's foot? If, venerable Nāgasena, when the Blessed One was walking, this senseless great earth rises up where it is low, and bends down where it is high, then the statement 'the Blessed One's foot was cut by a splinter' is wrong. If the Blessed One's foot was cut by a splinter, then the statement 'when the Blessed One was walking, this senseless great earth rises up where it is low, and bends down where it is high' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"True, great king, it is so that when the Blessed One was walking, this senseless great earth rises up where it is low, and bends down where it is high, and the Blessed One's foot was cut by a splinter; but that splinter did not fall by its own nature, it fell by Devadatta's assault. Devadatta, great king, bound resentment towards the Blessed One for many hundreds of thousands of births; he, with that resentment, released a great stone the size of a pinnacle building, thinking 'I shall drop it upon the Blessed One.' Then two rocks, having risen up from the earth, received that stone; then by the blow of those, a splinter having broken off from the stone, falling here and there, fell upon the Blessed One's foot."

"But just as, venerable Nāgasena, the two rocks received the stone, so too the splinter should have been received?" "Even when received, great king, something here trickles through and flows away and does not stay in place; just as, great king, water held in the hand trickles through the spaces between the fingers and flows away and does not stay in place; milk, buttermilk, honey, ghee, fish sauce, meat sauce held in the hand trickles through the spaces between the fingers and flows away and does not stay in place; just so indeed, great king, by the blow of the two rocks that had come for the purpose of receiving, a splinter having broken off from the stone, falling here and there, fell upon the Blessed One's foot.

"Or else, great king, just as sand equal to smooth, fine, minute dust, held in the fist, trickles through the spaces between the fingers and flows away and does not stay in place; just so indeed, great king, by the blow of the two rocks that had come for the purpose of receiving, a splinter having broken off from the stone, falling here and there, fell upon the Blessed One's foot.

"Or else, great king, just as a mouthful held in the mouth, having slipped from someone's mouth, trickles through and flows away and does not stay in place; just so indeed, great king, by the blow of the two rocks that had come for the purpose of receiving, a splinter having broken off from the stone, falling here and there, fell upon the Blessed One's foot."

"Let it be, venerable Nāgasena, that the stone was received by the rocks; then should not esteem have been shown by the splinter too, just as by the great earth?" "These twelve, great king, do not show esteem. Which twelve? One lustful does not show esteem through the influence of lust; one corrupt through the influence of hate; one deluded through the influence of delusion; one conceited through the influence of conceit; one without virtue through lack of distinction; one obstinate through inability to be restrained; one inferior through inferior nature; one obedient through lack of independence; one evil through miserliness; one made to suffer through causing suffering in return; one greedy through being overcome by greed; one striving does not show esteem through accomplishing one's own purpose. These, great king, are the twelve that do not show esteem. But that splinter, having broken off by the blow of the stone, with direction made signless, falling here and there, fell upon the Blessed One's foot.

"Or else, great king, just as smooth, fine, minute dust, struck by the force of the wind, with direction made signless, scatters here and there; just so indeed, great king, that splinter, having broken off by the blow of the stone, with direction made signless, falling here and there, fell upon the Blessed One's foot. If, moreover, great king, that splinter had not become separate from the stone, those rocks, having flown up, would have seized even the stone with its splinter. But this splinter, great king, was neither situated on the ground nor situated in the sky; having broken off by the force of the blow of the stone, with direction made signless, falling here and there, it fell upon the Blessed One's foot.

"Or else, great king, just as an old leaf lifted up by a whirlwind, with direction made signless, falls here and there; just so indeed, great king, this splinter, with direction made signless by the force of the blow of the stone, falling here and there, fell upon the Blessed One's foot. But moreover, great king, for the ungrateful, miserly Devadatta's experiencing of suffering, the splinter fell upon the Blessed One's foot." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the foot struck by a splinter is the eighth.

9.

The Question on the Foremost of the Foremost Ascetics

9. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'With the elimination of the mental corruptions, he is an ascetic.' And again it was said:

Here these are the four qualities: patience, eating little, abandoning of delight, and nothingness. But all these exist for one whose mental corruptions are not eliminated, for one with mental defilements. If, Venerable Nāgasena, with the elimination of the mental corruptions he is an ascetic, then the statement 'Endowed with four qualities, him indeed they call an ascetic in the world' is wrong. If one endowed with four qualities is an ascetic, then the statement 'With the elimination of the mental corruptions, he is an ascetic' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'With the elimination of the mental corruptions, he is an ascetic.' And again it was said: 'Endowed with four qualities, him indeed they call an ascetic in the world.' That statement, great king, was spoken with reference to the qualities of those various persons: 'Endowed with four qualities, him indeed they call an ascetic in the world'; but this is a statement without remainder: 'With the elimination of the mental corruptions, he is an ascetic.'

"Moreover, great king, whoever are practising for the peace of mental defilements, all of them, taking again and again, one who has eliminated the mental corruptions is declared the foremost ascetic. Just as, great king, whatever water-born and land-born flowers there are, jasmine is declared the foremost among them; whatever remaining various kinds of flowers there are, all of them are indeed flowers, but taking again and again, jasmine alone is the flower wished for and desired by people. Just so, great king, whoever are practising for the peace of mental defilements, all of them, taking again and again, one who has eliminated the mental corruptions is declared the foremost ascetic.

"Or else, great king, among all grains, rice is declared the foremost; whatever remaining various kinds of grains there are, all of them, taking again and again, are foods for the sustenance of the body, but rice alone is declared the foremost among them. Just so, great king, whoever are practising for the peace of mental defilements, all of them, taking again and again, one who has eliminated the mental corruptions is declared the foremost ascetic." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the foremost of the foremost ascetics is the ninth.

10.

The Question on Speaking Praise

10. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Monks, if others speak in praise of me, or in praise of the Teaching, or in praise of the Community, therein you should not feel joy, pleasure, or mental elation.' And yet the Tathāgata, when the brahmin Sela was speaking praise in conformity with the truth, delighted, glad, elated, spoke highly of his own qualities even more and further –

"If, Venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Monks, if others speak in praise of me, or in praise of the Teaching, or in praise of the Community, therein you should not feel joy, pleasure, or mental elation,' then the statement that when the brahmin Sela was speaking praise in conformity with the truth, he, delighted, glad, elated, spoke highly of his own qualities even more and further, is wrong. If when the brahmin Sela was speaking praise in conformity with the truth, he, delighted, glad, elated, spoke highly of his own qualities even more and further, then that statement 'Monks, if others speak in praise of me, or in praise of the Teaching, or in praise of the Community, therein you should not feel joy, pleasure, or mental elation' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'Monks, if others speak in praise of me, or in praise of the Teaching, or in praise of the Community, therein you should not feel joy, pleasure, or mental elation.' And when the brahmin Sela was speaking praise in conformity with the truth, his own qualities were spoken highly of even more and further –

"First, great king, by the Blessed One, while illuminating the Teaching's characteristic of intrinsic nature and function, its intrinsic nature, unerring, factual, true, and true in meaning, it was spoken: 'Monks, if others speak in praise of me, or in praise of the Teaching, or in praise of the Community, therein you should not feel joy, pleasure, or mental elation.' But that which was spoken highly of by the Blessed One as his own qualities even more and further, when the brahmin Sela was speaking praise in conformity with the truth – 'I am a king, Sela,' said the Blessed One, 'the unsurpassed king of righteousness' – that was not because of material gain, not because of fame, not for one's own sake, not because of faction, not from desire for pupils, but rather out of compassion, out of pity, for the sake of welfare, thinking 'Thus there will be full realization of the teaching for this one and for three hundred young men'; thus his own qualities were spoken of even more and further – 'I am a king, Sela,' said the Blessed One, 'the unsurpassed king of righteousness.' "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on speaking praise is the tenth.

11.

The Question on Restraining through Non-Violence

11. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Not harming another in the world, you will become dear, devoted to me.' And again it was said: 'One should restrain one deserving restraint, one should encourage one deserving encouragement.' Restraint, Venerable Nāgasena, means cutting off of hands, cutting off of feet, murder, imprisonment, torture, killing, disruption of continuity; this statement is not fitting for the Blessed One, nor is the Blessed One worthy to speak this statement. If, Venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Not harming another in the world, you will become dear, devoted to me,' then the statement 'One should restrain one deserving restraint, one should encourage one deserving encouragement' is wrong. If it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'One should restrain one deserving restraint, one should encourage one deserving encouragement,' then the statement 'Not harming another in the world, you will become dear, devoted to me' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'Not harming another in the world, you will become dear, devoted to me,' and it was said: 'One should restrain one deserving restraint, one should encourage one deserving encouragement.' 'Not harming another in the world, you will become dear, devoted to me' - this, great king, is approved by all Tathāgatas; this is the instruction, this is the teaching of the Teaching; for the Teaching, great king, has the characteristic of non-violence; this is a statement of intrinsic nature. But that which, great king, the Tathāgata said: 'One should restrain one deserving restraint, one should encourage one deserving encouragement' - this is a manner of speaking; the agitated mind, great king, should be restrained; the sluggish mind should be encouraged. Unwholesome consciousness should be restrained; wholesome consciousness should be encouraged. Unwise attention should be restrained; wise attention should be encouraged. One wrongly practising should be restrained; one rightly practising should be encouraged. The ignoble one should be restrained; the noble one should be encouraged. A thief should be restrained; a non-thief should be encouraged."

"Let it be so, Venerable Nāgasena, now you have come back to my domain; what I ask, that purpose has been attained by me. But, Venerable Nāgasena, how should a thief be restrained by one who restrains?" "A thief, great king, should be restrained by one who restrains thus: one deserving rebuke should be rebuked, one deserving punishment should be punished, one deserving banishment should be banished, one deserving imprisonment should be imprisoned, one deserving execution should be executed." "But, Venerable Nāgasena, is the execution of thieves approved by the Tathāgatas?" "No indeed, great king." "But why is a thief to be instructed approved by the Tathāgatas?" "He who, great king, is executed, is not executed by the approval of the Tathāgatas; he is executed by what was done by himself; but he is instructed by the instruction of the Teaching. But is it possible, great king, for you to seize and execute an innocent man who has committed no offence, walking along the street?" "It is not possible, venerable sir." "For what reason, great king?" "Because of his innocence, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, a thief is not killed by the approval of the Tathāgatas; he is killed by what was done by himself. But does the instructor here commit any fault?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "If so, great king, the instruction of the Tathāgatas is right instruction." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on restraining through non-violence is the eleventh.

12.

The Question on the Dismissal of a Monk

12. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'I am without wrath, free from barrenness,' yet the Tathāgata dismissed the elders Sāriputta and Moggallāna together with their following. Did indeed, venerable Nāgasena, the Tathāgata dismiss the assembly being angry, or did he dismiss them being satisfied? Know this much, this is the name of it. If, venerable Nāgasena, he dismissed the assembly being angry, then the Tathāgata's wrath was not turned back; if he dismissed them being satisfied, then they were dismissed without grounds by one not knowing. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'I am without wrath, free from barrenness,' and the elders Sāriputta and Moggallāna together with their following were dismissed, but that was not by irritation. Here, great king, some man, having stumbled on a root or a stump or a stone or a potsherd or an uneven piece of ground of the great earth, falls. Does indeed, great king, the great earth, being angry, cause him to fall?" "No indeed, venerable sir, there is no irritation or confidence in the great earth; the great earth is free from favouritism and aversion; he himself, being lazy, having stumbled, fell." "Just so indeed, great king, there is no irritation or confidence in the Tathāgatas; the Tathāgatas, Worthy Ones, Perfectly Self-awakened Ones are free from favouritism and aversion; but they were dismissed by their own deed, by their own offence.

"But here, great king, the great ocean does not associate with a dead corpse; whatever dead corpse there is in the great ocean, it quickly throws it out, pushes it onto dry land. Does indeed, great king, the great ocean, being angry, throw out that corpse?" "No indeed, venerable sir, there is no irritation or confidence in the great ocean; the great ocean is free from favouritism and aversion." "Just so indeed, great king, there is no irritation or confidence in the Tathāgatas; the Tathāgatas, Worthy Ones, Perfectly Self-awakened Ones are free from favouritism and aversion; but they were dismissed by their own deed, by their own offence.

"Just as, great king, one who has stumbled on the earth falls, so one who has stumbled in the excellent Dispensation of the Conqueror is dismissed. Just as, great king, a dead corpse is thrown out in the ocean, so one who has stumbled in the excellent Dispensation of the Conqueror is dismissed. But those whom, great king, the Tathāgata dismissed, wishing for their welfare, wishing for their benefit, wishing for their happiness, wishing for their purification, thinking 'thus these will be released from birth, ageing, disease, and death,' he dismissed them." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the dismissal of a monk is the twelfth.

The Dismissal Chapter is the third.

In this chapter there are twelve questions.

4.

The Chapter on Omniscient Knowledge

1.

The Question on Supernormal Power and the Result of Action

1. "Venerable Nāgasena, this was spoken by the Blessed One: 'This is the foremost, monks, of my disciples who are monks possessing supernormal power, namely Mahāmoggallāna.' And yet, it is said, he was beaten all over with cudgels, his head broken, his bones and flesh crushed, his veins severed, his limbs destroyed, and attained final Nibbāna. If, Venerable Nāgasena, the Elder Mahāmoggallāna had reached the summit of supernormal power, then the statement that he was beaten with cudgels and attained final Nibbāna is wrong. If he was beaten all over with cudgels and attained final Nibbāna, then the statement that he had reached the summit of supernormal power is also wrong. Was he not able to remove harm to himself by supernormal power, and worthy to become a refuge for the world including the gods? This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'This is the foremost, monks, of my disciples who are monks possessing supernormal power, namely Mahāmoggallāna.' And the Venerable Mahāmoggallāna, struck by cudgels, attained final Nibbāna; but that was because he was seized by kamma."

"Is it not so, Venerable Nāgasena, that for one possessing supernormal power, both the domain of supernormal power and the result of kamma are two inconceivables; should not the inconceivable be removed by the inconceivable? Just as, venerable sir, some desiring fruit knock down a wood-apple with a wood-apple, knock down a mango with a mango, even so, Venerable Nāgasena, having struck the inconceivable with the inconceivable, should it not be removed?" "Even among the inconceivables, great king, one is exceeding, more powerful. Just as, great king, on earth there are kings of equal birth, yet among those of equal birth, one, having overcome all, wields authority. Just so indeed, great king, among those inconceivables, the result of kamma alone is exceeding, more powerful; the result of kamma alone, having overcome all, wields authority; for one seized by kamma, the remaining functions do not obtain opportunity.

"But here, great king, some man commits an offence in some matter; neither his mother nor father nor sister nor brothers nor friend nor companions protect him; then the king alone, having overcome there, wields authority. What is the reason there? The state of being an offender. Just so indeed, great king, among those inconceivables, the result of kamma alone is exceeding, more powerful; the result of kamma alone, having overcome all, wields authority; for one seized by kamma, the remaining functions do not obtain opportunity.

"Or else, great king, when a forest fire has arisen on earth, even a thousand pots of water cannot extinguish it; then the fire alone, having overcome there, wields authority. What is the reason there? Because of the power of the heat. Just so indeed, great king, among those inconceivables, the result of kamma alone is exceeding, more powerful; the result of kamma alone, having overcome all, wields authority; for one seized by kamma, the remaining functions do not obtain opportunity. Therefore, great king, for the Venerable Mahāmoggallāna, seized by kamma, being beaten with cudgels, there was no attentiveness to supernormal power." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on supernormal power and the result of action is the first.

2.

The Question on What is Concealed and Not Concealed in the Teaching and Discipline

2. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'The Teaching and discipline proclaimed by the Tathāgata, monks, shines when unveiled, not when concealed.' And yet the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) and the entire Canon of monastic discipline are closed and concealed. If, venerable Nāgasena, in the Conqueror's Dispensation one who is fit or proper should obtain the right time, the regulation of monastic discipline when unveiled would shine. For what reason? Only therein is training, self-control, restraint, the regulation of morality, virtue, and good conduct, the flavour of meaning, the flavour of the teaching, the flavour of liberation. If, venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'The Teaching and discipline proclaimed by the Tathāgata, monks, shines when unveiled, not when concealed,' then the statement 'the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) and the entire Canon of monastic discipline are closed and concealed' is wrong. If the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) and the entire Canon of monastic discipline are closed and concealed, then the statement 'The Teaching and discipline proclaimed by the Tathāgata, monks, shines when unveiled, not when concealed' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'The Teaching and discipline proclaimed by the Tathāgata, monks, shines when unveiled, not when concealed.' And yet the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) and the entire Canon of monastic discipline are closed and concealed, but that is not for everyone; having made a boundary, it is closed.

"In three ways, great king, the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) was closed by the Blessed One having made a boundary: by the lineage of the former Tathāgatas the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) was closed having made a boundary, closed due to the weightiness of the Teaching, closed due to the weightiness of the monk's plane.

"How was the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) closed having made a boundary by the lineage of the former Tathāgatas? This is the lineage, great king, of all the former Tathāgatas, that is to say, the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) in the midst of monks is closed to the rest. Just as, great king, the special knowledge of the warriors circulates only among the warriors, thus this tradition of the warriors of the world is closed to the rest. Just so indeed, great king, this is the lineage of all the former Tathāgatas, that is to say, the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) in the midst of monks is closed to the rest.

"Or else, great king, groups exist on earth, as follows: the Mallas, the Atoṇas, the Pabbatas, the Dhammagiriyas, the Brahmagiriyas, the performers, the dancers, the acrobats, the goblins, the Maṇibhaddas, the Puṇṇabaddhas, the moon-and-sun worshippers, the Siri-deity worshippers, the Kāli-deity worshippers, the Sivas, the Vasudevas, the Ghaṇikas, the sword-and-snare performers, the Bhaddiputtās - the secret of each of those circulates only in those respective groups, closed to the rest. Just so indeed, great king, this is the lineage of all the former Tathāgatas, that is to say, the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) in the midst of monks is closed to the rest. Thus by the lineage of the former Tathāgatas the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) was closed having made a boundary.

"How was the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) closed having made a boundary due to the weightiness of the Teaching? The Teaching, great king, is weighty and heavy; therein one who practises the right course pleases another, one attains that therein through successive practice of the right course, one does not attain that therein without successive practice of the right course; may this essential Teaching, this excellent Teaching, having come into the hands of those who do not practise the right course, not be looked down upon, despised, scorned, mocked, and blamed; may this essential Teaching, this excellent Teaching, having gone to bad people, not be looked down upon, despised, scorned, mocked, and blamed. Thus due to the weightiness of the Teaching the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) was closed having made a boundary.

"Just as, great king, the essential, excellent, noble, well-born, genuine, red sandalwood, when it has gone to an inferior city, becomes looked down upon, despised, scorned, mocked, and blamed, just so indeed, great king, may this essential Teaching, this excellent Teaching, having come into the hands of those who successively do not practise the right course, not be looked down upon, despised, scorned, mocked, and blamed; may this essential Teaching, this excellent Teaching, having gone to bad people, not be looked down upon, despised, scorned, mocked, and blamed. Thus due to the weightiness of the Teaching the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) was closed having made a boundary.

"How was the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) closed having made a boundary due to the weightiness of the monk's plane? The state of being a monk, great king, is incomparable in the world, immeasurable, priceless; it is not possible for anyone to value it, to weigh it, to measure it; thinking 'May one standing in such a state of being a monk not become equal to the world,' the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) circulates only among monks. Just as, great king, in the world excellent and noble goods - whether cloth or bed-sheets, or elephants, horses, chariots, gold, silver, gems, pearls, women-jewels and so on, or heroes victorious in battle - all of them go to the king, just so indeed, great king, as far as in the world there are virtues of the Fortunate One's teaching, learning, good conduct, self-control, morality, and restraint, all of them have gone to the community of monks. Thus due to the weightiness of the monk's plane the recitation of the principal monastic code (Pātimokkha) was closed having made a boundary." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on what is concealed and not concealed in the Teaching and discipline is the second.

3.

The Question on the Heavy and Light Nature of Lying

3. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'For conscious lying he is expelled.' And again it was said: 'For conscious lying he commits a light offence, having its ground in confession in the presence of one.' Venerable Nāgasena, what then is the distinction here, what is the reason, that by one lie one is cut off, and by one lie one is curable? If, venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'For conscious lying he is expelled,' then the statement 'For conscious lying he commits a light offence, having its ground in confession in the presence of one' is wrong. If it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'For conscious lying he commits a light offence, having its ground in confession in the presence of one,' then the statement 'For conscious lying he is expelled' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'For conscious lying he is expelled.' And it was said: 'For conscious lying he commits a light offence, having its ground in confession in the presence of one,' but that is heavy or light by way of subject matter. What do you think, great king, suppose here some man were to strike another with the hand, what punishment would you impose on him?" "If he, venerable sir, says 'I do not accept,' we would have a coin taken from him when he does not accept." "But here, great king, if that same man were to strike you with the hand, what then would be the punishment?" "We would have his hand cut off, venerable sir, we would have his foot cut off, we would have him cut off up to the head at the soft part, we would have all that household plundered, we would have both sides uprooted up to the seventh generation." "What then is the distinction here, great king, what is the reason, that for a blow with the hand to one person there is a subtle punishment of a coin, but for a blow with the hand to you there is cutting off of the hand, cutting off of the foot, up to cutting off at the soft part, taking of all household property, uprooting on both sides up to the seventh generation?" "Because of the difference in persons, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, conscious lying is heavy or light by way of subject matter." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the heavy and light nature of lying is the third.

4.

The Question on the Nature of a Bodhisatta

4. "Venerable Nāgasena, this was spoken by the Blessed One in the exposition on the natural order of things: 'From the very beginning, the mother and father of Bodhisattas are fixed in destiny, the enlightenment is fixed in destiny, the chief disciples are fixed in destiny, the son is fixed in destiny, the attendant is fixed in destiny.' And again you say: 'The Bodhisatta, standing in the Tusita realm, looks at the eight great investigations: he looks at the time, he looks at the continent, he looks at the region, he looks at the family, he looks at the mother, he looks at the life span, he looks at the month, he looks at the renunciation.' Venerable Nāgasena, when knowledge is not fully matured, there is no awakening; when knowledge is fully matured, it is not possible to wait even for the interval of a wink; a fully matured mind cannot be transgressed. Why did the Bodhisatta look at the time, thinking 'At what time shall I arise?' When knowledge is not fully matured, there is no awakening; when knowledge is fully matured, it is not possible to wait even for the interval of a wink; why does the Bodhisatta look at the family, thinking 'In what family shall I arise?' If, Venerable Nāgasena, the mother and father of the Bodhisatta are fixed in destiny from the very beginning, then the statement 'he looks at the family' is wrong. If he looks at the family, then the statement 'the mother and father of the Bodhisatta are fixed in destiny from the very beginning' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"The mother and father of the Bodhisatta are fixed in destiny from the very beginning, great king, and the Bodhisatta also looks at the family. But how does he look at the family? 'Are my mother and father of the warrior caste or are they brahmins?' Thus he looks at the family.

"For eight, great king, the future should be looked at beforehand. Which eight? For a merchant, great king, the goods for sale should be looked at beforehand; for a noble elephant, the path ahead should be looked at with the trunk beforehand; for a carter, the ford ahead should be looked at beforehand; for a helmsman, having looked at the shore ahead, the boat should be sent beforehand; for a physician, having looked at the life span, the sick person should be approached beforehand; for a northern bridge, having known whether it is firm or not firm, it should be ascended beforehand; for a monk, having reviewed the time ahead, food should be eaten beforehand; for Bodhisattas, the family should be looked at beforehand - 'whether a family of the warrior caste or a brahmin family.' For these eight, great king, the future should be looked at beforehand." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the nature of a Bodhisatta is the fourth.

5.

The Question on Self-Destruction

5. "Venerable Nāgasena, this was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Monks, one should not throw oneself down; whoever should throw himself down, should be dealt with according to the rule.' And again you say: 'Wherever the Blessed One, while teaching the Teaching to disciples, in many ways teaches the Teaching for the eradication of birth, ageing, illness, and death; whoever transcends birth, ageing, illness, and death, him he praises with the highest praise.' If, Venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Monks, one should not throw oneself down; whoever should throw himself down, should be dealt with according to the rule,' then the statement 'he teaches the Teaching for the eradication of birth, ageing, illness, and death' is wrong. If he teaches the Teaching for the eradication of birth, ageing, illness, and death, then the statement 'Monks, one should not throw oneself down; whoever should throw himself down, should be dealt with according to the rule' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'Monks, one should not throw oneself down; whoever should throw himself down, should be dealt with according to the rule.' And wherever the Teaching was taught by the Blessed One while teaching the Teaching to disciples in many ways for the eradication of birth, ageing, illness, and death, there is a reason for this, by which reason the Blessed One rejected and encouraged."

"But what, Venerable Nāgasena, is the reason here, by which reason the Blessed One rejected and encouraged?" "One who is moral, great king, accomplished in morality, is like an antidote in the destruction of the poison of defilements for beings, like medicine in the appeasement of the illness of defilements for beings, like water in the removal of the dust and dirt of defilements for beings, like a gem-jewel in the giving of all success for beings, like a boat in the crossing to the far shore of the four floods for beings, like a caravan leader in the crossing of the wilderness of birth for beings, like wind in the quenching of the heat of the threefold fire for beings, like a great rain cloud in the fulfilment of the mind for beings, like a teacher in the training in the wholesome for beings, like a good guide in the pointing out of the secure path for beings. Such a one, great king, of many virtues, of various virtues, of immeasurable virtues, a heap of virtues, a mass of virtues, one who brings growth to beings, one who is moral - 'May he not perish' - out of compassion for beings, the Blessed One laid down the training rule: 'Monks, one should not throw oneself down; whoever should throw himself down, should be dealt with according to the rule.' This, great king, is the reason here, by which reason the Blessed One rejected. This too was spoken, great king, by the elder Kumārakassapa, the varied speaker, while explaining the world beyond to the chieftain Pāyāsi: 'In whatever way, chieftain, ascetics and brahmins who are moral, of good character, remain for a long time, for a long duration, in that way they generate much merit, and they proceed for the welfare of many people, for the happiness of many people, out of compassion for the world, for the good, welfare, and happiness of gods and humans.'

"But for what reason did the Blessed One encourage? Birth, great king, is suffering, ageing is suffering, illness is suffering, death is suffering, sorrow is suffering, lamentation is suffering, suffering is suffering, displeasure is suffering, anguish is suffering, association with what is not dear is suffering, separation from what is dear is suffering, the death of a mother is suffering, the death of a father is suffering, the death of a brother is suffering, the death of a sister is suffering, the death of a son is suffering, the death of a wife is suffering, the death of a slave is suffering, the death of a relative is suffering, disaster to relatives is suffering, disaster through illness is suffering, disaster to wealth is suffering, disaster to morality is suffering, disaster to views is suffering, fear of kings is suffering, fear of thieves is suffering, fear of enemies is suffering, fear of famine is suffering, fear of fire is suffering, fear of water is suffering, fear of waves is suffering, fear of whirlpools is suffering, fear of crocodiles is suffering, fear of sharks is suffering, fear of self-censure is suffering, fear of censure by others is suffering, fear of punishment is suffering, fear of unfortunate realms is suffering, fear of timidity in assemblies is suffering, fear concerning livelihood is suffering, fear of death is suffering, being flogged with canes is suffering, being flogged with whips is suffering, being flogged with half-clubs is suffering, cutting off of the hand is suffering, cutting off of the foot is suffering, cutting off of hand and foot is suffering, cutting off of the ear is suffering, cutting off of the nose is suffering, cutting off of ear and nose is suffering, the gruel pot torture is suffering, the shell-tonsure torture is suffering, the Rāhu's mouth torture is suffering, the fire garland torture is suffering, the hand torch torture is suffering, the grass-strip torture is suffering, the bark-dress torture is suffering, the antelope torture is suffering, the flesh-hook torture is suffering, the coin-cutting torture is suffering, the lye-pickling torture is suffering, the pivot-turning torture is suffering, the straw-chair torture is suffering, being sprinkled with boiling oil is suffering, being eaten by dogs is suffering, being impaled alive on a stake is suffering, cutting off of the head with a sword is suffering; such manifold, various sufferings, great king, one gone into the round of rebirths experiences.

"Just as, great king, water rained down on the Himalaya mountain, flowing in the river Ganges, spreads over stones, gravel, pebbles, sand, whirlpools, rapids, waves, bends, obstacles, obstructions, roots, and branches, even so indeed, great king, such manifold, various sufferings, one gone into the round of rebirths experiences. Occurrence, great king, is suffering; non-occurrence is happiness. While explaining the virtue of non-occurrence and the danger of occurrence, great king, the Blessed One encouraged for the realisation of non-occurrence, for the transcendence of birth, ageing, illness, and death; this, great king, is the reason here, by which reason the Blessed One encouraged." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, the question has been well unravelled, the reason well explained; thus I accept this as true."

The question on self-destruction is the fifth.

6.

The Question on the Benefits of Developing Friendliness

6. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Monks, when the liberation of mind through friendliness has been practised, developed, cultivated, mastered, made a basis of, practised, accumulated, and thoroughly undertaken, eleven benefits are to be expected. What are the eleven? One sleeps pleasantly, one wakes up pleasantly, one does not see evil dreams, one is dear to human beings, one is dear to non-human beings, deities protect one, neither fire nor poison nor weapon affects one, the mind quickly becomes concentrated, one's complexion becomes bright, one dies undeluded, if not penetrating further one is reborn in the Brahma world.' And again you say: 'The boy Sāma, abiding in friendliness, surrounded by a herd of deer, wandering in the forest wilds, was shot by King Pīḷiyakkha with a poisoned arrow, and right there he fainted and fell.'

"If, Venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Monks, when the liberation of mind through friendliness, etc. one is reborn in the Brahma world,' then the statement 'The boy Sāma, abiding in friendliness, surrounded by a herd of deer, wandering in the forest wilds, was shot by King Pīḷiyakkha with a poisoned arrow, and right there he fainted and fell' is wrong. If the boy Sāma, abiding in friendliness, surrounded by a herd of deer, wandering in the forest wilds, was shot by King Pīḷiyakkha with a poisoned arrow, and right there he fainted and fell, then 'Monks, when the liberation of mind through friendliness, etc. neither weapon affects one' - that statement too is wrong. This too is a question with two points, very subtle, smooth, refined, and deep; it might cause sweat to break out on the bodies of even very subtle men. It has come to you; unravel that great tangle of tangles, give vision to the future sons of the Conqueror for their guidance."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'Monks, when the liberation of mind through friendliness, etc. neither weapon affects one.' And the boy Sāma, abiding in friendliness, surrounded by a herd of deer, wandering in the forest wilds, was shot by King Pīḷiyakkha with a poisoned arrow, and right there he fainted and fell; but there, great king, there is a reason. What is the reason there? These, great king, are not qualities of the person; these are qualities of the development of friendliness. The boy Sāma, great king, while lifting up a water pot, at that moment was heedless of the development of friendliness.

"At whatever moment, great king, a person has attained friendliness, at that moment neither fire nor poison nor weapon affects that person. Whatever ill-wishers, having approached him, do not see him, do not get an opportunity against him. These, great king, are not qualities of the person; these are qualities of the development of friendliness. Here, great king, a man, a hero in battle, having fastened on an impenetrable coat of mail armour, might enter battle; arrows shot at him, having approached, fall and scatter, they do not get an opportunity against him. This, great king, is not a quality of the hero in battle; this is a quality of the impenetrable coat of mail armour, against which arrows shot, having approached, fall and scatter. Just so indeed, great king, these are not qualities of the person; these are qualities of the development of friendliness.

"At whatever moment, great king, a person has attained friendliness, at that moment neither fire nor poison nor weapon affects that person. Whatever ill-wishers, having approached him, do not see him, do not get an opportunity against him; these, great king, are not qualities of the person; these are qualities of the development of friendliness. But here, great king, a man might place a divine root of disappearance in his hand; as long as that root is in his hand, so long no other ordinary human being sees that man. This, great king, is not a quality of the man; this is a quality of the root of disappearance, that he is not seen in the range of vision of ordinary human beings. Just so indeed, great king, these are not qualities of the person; these are qualities of the development of friendliness.

"At whatever moment, great king, a person has attained friendliness, at that moment neither fire nor poison nor weapon affects that person. Whatever ill-wishers, having approached him, do not see him, do not get an opportunity against him. These, great king, are not qualities of the person; these are qualities of the development of friendliness. Or else, great king, just as a great rain cloud raining down is not able to wet a man who has entered a well-made great cave, this, great king, is not a quality of the man; this is a quality of the great cave, that the great rain cloud raining down does not wet him. Just so indeed, great king, these are not qualities of the person; these are qualities of the development of friendliness.

"At whatever moment, great king, a person has attained friendliness, at that moment neither fire nor poison nor weapon affects that person. Whatever ill-wishers, having approached, do not see him, they are unable to do him harm. These, great king, are not the virtues of the person; these are the virtues of the development of friendliness." "Wonderful, Venerable Nāgasena, marvellous, Venerable Nāgasena, the development of friendliness is the warding off of all evil." "The development of friendliness brings all wholesome virtues, great king; to both the friendly and the unfriendly, to whatever beings are bound by consciousness, the development of friendliness of great benefit should be shared with all."

The question on the benefits of developing friendliness is the sixth.

7.

The Question on Wholesome-Unwholesome and Righteous-Unrighteous

7. "Venerable Nāgasena, is the result the same for one who does wholesome and one who does unwholesome, or is there some distinction?" "There is, great king, a distinction between wholesome and unwholesome. Wholesome, great king, has pleasant results and leads to heaven; unwholesome has painful results and leads to hell."

"Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'Devadatta is exclusively dark, endowed with exclusively dark qualities; the Bodhisatta is exclusively pure, endowed with exclusively pure qualities.' And yet Devadatta in existence after existence was equal to the Bodhisatta in fame and following, sometimes even superior. When Devadatta was the son of the royal chaplain of King Brahmadatta in the city of Bārāṇasī, then the Bodhisatta was an outcast corpse-handler, a knower of charms; having recited a charm, he produced mango fruits out of season. Here at least the Bodhisatta was inferior to Devadatta in birth and inferior in fame.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a king, a great lord of the earth, endowed with all sensual pleasures, then the Bodhisatta was his possession, a noble elephant endowed with all auspicious marks. Not enduring his graceful gait and charm, the king, wishing to kill him, said this to the elephant trainer: 'Your elephant is untrained, teacher; perform on him the procedure called walking through the sky.' There too the Bodhisatta was inferior to Devadatta in birth, lowly, gone to the animal realm.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a human being, one who had suffered loss in the forest wilds, then the Bodhisatta was a monkey named Mahāpathavī. Here too is seen the distinction between a human being and one gone to the animal realm; there too the Bodhisatta was inferior to Devadatta in birth.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a human being, a hunter named Soṇuttara, powerful, more powerful, with the strength of an elephant, then the Bodhisatta was a king of elephants named Chaddanta. Then that hunter killed that noble elephant; there too Devadatta was superior.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a human being, a forester dwelling without abode, then the Bodhisatta was a bird, a partridge, a reciter of charms. Then too that forester killed that bird; there too Devadatta was superior in birth.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was the King of Kāsi named Kalābu, then the Bodhisatta was an ascetic, a preacher of patience. Then that king, angry at that ascetic, had his hands and feet cut off like bamboo shoots; there too Devadatta was superior in birth and in fame.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a human being, a forester, then the Bodhisatta was a monkey king named Nandiya. Then too that forester killed that monkey king together with his mother and younger brother; there too Devadatta was superior in birth.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a human being, a naked ascetic named Kārambhiya, then the Bodhisatta was a king of serpents named Paṇḍaraka; there too Devadatta was superior in birth.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a human being, a matted-hair ascetic in the forest wilds, then the Bodhisatta was a great boar named Tacchaka; there too Devadatta was superior in birth.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a king named Sūraparicara among the Cetis, able to travel through the sky at the height of a man above, then the Bodhisatta was a brahmin named Kapila; there too Devadatta was superior in birth and in fame.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a human being named Sāma, then the Bodhisatta was a king of deer named Ruru; there too Devadatta was superior in birth.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a human being, a hunter roaming the forest wilds, then the Bodhisatta was a noble elephant. That hunter, having cut off the tusks of that noble elephant seven times, carried them away; there too Devadatta was superior in realm.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a jackal with the nature of a warrior, he made all the sub-kings throughout the Indian subcontinent his vassals; then the Bodhisatta was a wise man named Vidhura; there too Devadatta was superior in fame.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta, having become a noble elephant, killed the young ones of the quail bird, then the Bodhisatta too was a noble elephant, a leader of the herd; there, so far, both of them were exactly equal.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a demon named Adhammo, then the Bodhisatta too was a demon named Dhammo; there too, so far, both were exactly equal.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a sailor, lord of five hundred families, then the Bodhisatta too was a sailor, lord of five hundred families; there too, so far, both were exactly equal.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a caravan leader, lord of five hundred carts, then the Bodhisatta too was a caravan leader, lord of five hundred carts; there too, so far, both were exactly equal.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a king of deer named Sākha, then the Bodhisatta too was a king of deer named Nigrodha; there too, so far, both were exactly equal.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a general named Sākha, then the Bodhisatta too was a king named Nigrodha; there too, so far, both were exactly equal.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a brahmin named Khaṇḍahāla, then the Bodhisatta was a prince named Canda; then that Khaṇḍahāla was indeed superior.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a king named Brahmadatta, then the Bodhisatta was his son, a prince named Mahāpaduma; then that king had his own son thrown into the Thieves' Precipice, since from whatever source a father is superior to his sons, being distinguished; there too, so far, Devadatta was indeed superior.

"Furthermore, when Devadatta was a king named Mahāpatāpa, then the Bodhisatta was his son, a prince named Dhammapāla; then that king had his own son's hands, feet, and head cut off; there too, so far, Devadatta was indeed higher, superior.

Now today both were born in the Sakyan clan. The Bodhisatta became the Buddha, the Omniscient One, the leader of the world; Devadatta, having gone forth in the Dispensation of that god of gods, having produced supernormal power, made an assault on the Buddha. What then, venerable Nāgasena, is all that spoken by me true or false?"

"What you, great king, have expounded as manifold reasons, all that is just so, not otherwise." "If, Venerable Nāgasena, both the dark and the bright have the same destination, then indeed both the wholesome and the unwholesome have the same result?" "No indeed, great king, the wholesome and the unwholesome do not have the same result; no indeed, great king, Devadatta was not opposed to all people, he was opposed only to the Bodhisatta. That which was his opposition to the Bodhisatta, that is cooked and gives fruit in each and every existence. Devadatta too, great king, standing in sovereignty, gives protection in the districts, has bridges, assembly halls, and merit halls built, and gives gifts as aspired to ascetics and brahmins, to the poor, travellers, and beggars, to those with protectors and the destitute. By that result he obtains successes in existence after existence. Who, great king, could say that without giving, self-control, restraint, and Observance practice one will experience success?

"But as for what you, great king, say thus: 'Devadatta and the Bodhisatta keep moving round together,' that meeting did not occur after the passing of a hundred births, nor after the passing of a thousand births, nor after the passing of a hundred thousand births; at some time, seldom, after the passing of many days and nights, a meeting occurred. But that simile of the blind turtle shown by the Blessed One for the obtaining of human existence, great king, remember the meeting of these as being like that simile.

"Not only with Devadatta, great king, did the Bodhisatta have a meeting; the Elder Sāriputta too, great king, in many hundreds of thousands of births was the Bodhisatta's father, was his grandfather, was his uncle, was his brother, was his son, was his nephew, was his friend.

"The Bodhisatta too, great king, in many hundreds of thousands of births was the Elder Sāriputta's father, was his grandfather, was his uncle, was his brother, was his son, was his nephew, was his friend; all, great king, who are included in the orders of beings, who follow the stream of the round of rebirths, being carried along by the stream of the round of rebirths, meet with both the unpleasant and the pleasant. Just as, great king, water being carried along by a stream meets with the clean and unclean, the good and the bad, even so indeed, great king, all who are included in the orders of beings, who follow the stream of the round of rebirths, being carried along by the stream of the round of rebirths, meet with both the unpleasant and the pleasant. Devadatta, great king, being a demon, himself not according to the Teaching, having urged others to what is not according to the Teaching, was cooked in the great hell for fifty-seven ten million years and sixty hundred thousand years; the Bodhisatta too, great king, being a demon, himself according to the Teaching, having urged others to the Teaching, rejoiced in heaven for fifty-seven ten million years and sixty hundred thousand years, endowed with all sensual pleasures; but moreover, great king, Devadatta in this existence, having assailed the Buddha who should not be assailed and having split the united Community, entered the earth; the Tathāgata, having awakened, attained final Nibbāna regarding all phenomena in the extinction of clinging." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on wholesome-unwholesome and righteous-unrighteous is the seventh.

8.

The Question on Queen Amarā

8. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One -

And again it is said: 'Mahosadha's wife, a woman named Amarā, placed in a small village, whose husband was away from home, seated in a secret place, secluded, having made her husband equal to a king, being invited with a thousand, did not do evil.' If, Venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'If, etc. with a cripple,' then 'Mahosadha's wife, etc. did not do evil' - that statement is wrong. If Mahosadha's wife, etc. did not do evil, then 'If, etc. with a cripple' - that statement too is wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'If, etc. with a cripple.' And it is said: 'Mahosadha's wife, etc. did not do evil.' That woman, great king, receiving a thousand, would do an evil deed with such a man; she would not do it if she should obtain a moment or a secret place or such an inviter. Searching, great king, that woman Amarā did not see a moment or a secret place or such an inviter.

"Here in this world, through fear of blame, she did not see a moment; in the world beyond, through fear of hell, she did not see a moment; thinking 'evil has bitter result,' she did not see a moment; not wishing to let go of her beloved, she did not see a moment; through respect for her husband, she did not see a moment; honouring the Teaching, she did not see a moment; censuring the ignoble, she did not see a moment; not wishing to break the action, she did not see a moment. By many such reasons she did not see a moment.

"And searching in the world, not seeing a secret place, she did not do evil. If she should obtain a secret place from humans, then she would not obtain a secret place from non-humans. If she should obtain a secret place from non-humans, then she would not obtain a secret place from those gone forth who know others' minds. If she should obtain a secret place from those gone forth who know others' minds, then she would not obtain a secret place from deities who know others' minds. If she should obtain a secret place from deities who know others' minds, she would not obtain a secret place from her own evil deeds. If she should obtain a secret place from her own evil deeds, then she would not obtain a secret place from what is not the Teaching. By many such various reasons, not having obtained a secret place, she did not do evil.

"And searching in the world, not obtaining such an inviter, she did not do evil. Mahosadha, great king, the wise one, was endowed with twenty-eight qualities. With which twenty-eight qualities was he endowed? Mahosadha, great king, was heroic, modest, conscientious, having supporters, accomplished in friends, patient, moral, a truth-speaker, accomplished in purity, without wrath, not arrogant, not envious, energetic, striving, treating kindly, generous, kindly in speech, humble in conduct, smooth, not fraudulent, not deceitful, accomplished in higher intelligence, famous, accomplished in true knowledge, seeking welfare, wished for by dependents, by all people, wealthy, and glorious. Mahosadha, great king, the wise one, was endowed with these twenty-eight qualities. She, not having obtained another such inviter, did not do evil." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on Queen Amarā is the eighth.

9.

The Question on the Worthy One's Fearlessness

9. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Worthy Ones are free from fear and trembling.' And again, in the city of Rājagaha, having seen the elephant Dhanapālaka rushing at the Blessed One, five hundred who had eliminated the mental corruptions, having abandoned the excellent conqueror, departed in all directions, except for one, the elder Ānanda. What indeed, venerable Nāgasena, did those Worthy Ones depart out of fear, or did they depart wishing to fell the one of ten powers, thinking 'it will become known through his own action,' or did they depart wishing to see the incomparable, vast, matchless wonder of the Tathāgata? If, venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Worthy Ones are free from fear and trembling,' then 'in the city, etc. Ānanda' - that statement is wrong. If in the city of Rājagaha, having seen the elephant Dhanapālaka rushing at the Blessed One, five hundred who had eliminated the mental corruptions, having abandoned the excellent conqueror, departed in all directions, except for one, the elder Ānanda, then the statement 'Worthy Ones are free from fear and trembling' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'Worthy Ones are free from fear and trembling,' and in the city of Rājagaha, having seen the elephant Dhanapālaka rushing at the Blessed One, five hundred who had eliminated the mental corruptions, having abandoned the excellent conqueror, departed in all directions, except for one, the elder Ānanda; but that was not out of fear, nor out of wishing to fell the Blessed One.

"But, great king, that cause by which Worthy Ones might fear or tremble, that cause has been cut off for Worthy Ones; therefore Worthy Ones are free from fear and trembling. Does, great king, the great earth fear when being dug or broken or supported by the ocean, mountains, and mountain peaks?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "For what reason, great king?" "There is not, venerable sir, that cause for the great earth by which cause the great earth might fear or tremble." "Just so, great king, there is not that cause for Worthy Ones by which cause Worthy Ones might fear or tremble.

"Does, great king, a mountain peak fear when being cut or broken or falling or being burnt by fire?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "For what reason, great king?" "There is not, venerable sir, that cause for a mountain peak by which cause a mountain peak might fear or tremble." "Just so, great king, there is not that cause for Worthy Ones by which cause Worthy Ones might fear or tremble.

"Even if, great king, in a hundred thousand world systems, all those included in the orders of beings, all of them with spears in hand, having run up to one Worthy One, were to try to frighten him, there would not be any alteration of the Worthy One's consciousness. What is the reason? Because it is impossible and without opportunity.

"But moreover, great king, this reflection arose in the minds of those who had eliminated the mental corruptions: 'Today, when the most excellent of men, the excellent conqueror, the bull among men, has entered the excellent city, the elephant Dhanapālaka will rush at him on the street; without doubt the attendant will not abandon the god of gods; if we all do not abandon the Blessed One, the virtue of Ānanda will not become known, and the noble elephant will not approach the Tathāgata; come, let us depart; thus there will be release from the bondage of mental defilements for a great crowd of people, and the virtue of Ānanda will become known.' Thus those Worthy Ones, having seen the benefit, departed in all directions." "Well analysed, venerable Nāgasena, is the question; thus there is no fear or trembling for Worthy Ones; having seen the benefit, the Worthy Ones departed in all directions."

The question on the Worthy One's fearlessness is the ninth.

10.

The Question on the Buddha's Omniscience

10. "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'the Tathāgata is omniscient.' And again you say 'when the community of monks headed by Sāriputta and Moggallāna was dismissed by the Tathāgata, the Sakyans of Cātumā and Brahmā Sahampati, having shown the simile of the seed and the simile of the young calf, inspired confidence in the Blessed One, asked his forgiveness, and brought him to acceptance.' Were those similes, venerable Nāgasena, unknown to the Tathāgata, by which similes the Tathāgata was brought to forgiveness, was calmed, and came to acceptance? If, venerable Nāgasena, those similes were unknown to the Tathāgata, then the Buddha is not omniscient; if they were known, then he dismissed them forcibly, expecting investigation, and thus his lack of compassion arises. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"The Tathāgata is omniscient, great king, and by those similes the Blessed One was pleased, was brought to forgiveness, was calmed, and came to acceptance. The Tathāgata is the lord of the Teaching, great king; by those very similes made known by the Tathāgata they pleased, satisfied, and inspired confidence in the Tathāgata, and the Tathāgata, being pleased with them, gave thanks saying 'Good!'

"Just as, great king, a wife pleases, satisfies, and inspires confidence in her husband with wealth that is her husband's own, and the husband gives thanks saying 'Good!' - just so indeed, great king, the Sakyans of Cātumā and Brahmā Sahampati, by those very similes made known by the Tathāgata, pleased, satisfied, and inspired confidence in the Tathāgata, and the Tathāgata, being pleased with them, gave thanks saying 'Good!'

"Or else, great king, just as a barber, adorning the king's head with the king's own golden comb, pleases, satisfies, and inspires confidence in the king, and the king, being pleased with him, gives thanks saying 'Good!' and grants whatever he wishes - just so indeed, great king, the Sakyans of Cātumā and Brahmā Sahampati, by those very similes made known by the Tathāgata, pleased, satisfied, and inspired confidence in the Tathāgata, and the Tathāgata, being pleased with them, gave thanks saying 'Good!'

"Or else, great king, just as a co-resident pupil, having taken almsfood brought by his preceptor, offering it to his preceptor, pleases, satisfies, and inspires confidence in his preceptor, and the preceptor, being pleased with him, gives thanks saying 'Good!' - just so indeed, great king, the Sakyans of Cātumā and Brahmā Sahampati, by those very similes made known by the Tathāgata, pleased, satisfied, and inspired confidence in the Tathāgata, and the Tathāgata, being pleased with them, having given thanks saying 'Good!', taught the Teaching for complete release from all suffering." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the Buddha's omniscience is the tenth.

The Chapter on Omniscient Knowledge is the fourth.

In this chapter there are ten questions.

5.

The Chapter on Association

1.

The Question on Intimacy

1. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One -

"And again it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Should have charming dwellings built, and lodge the very learned there.' If, Venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'From intimacy fear is born, from abode arises dust. Without abode, without intimacy - this indeed is the sage's vision,' then the statement 'Should have charming dwellings built, and lodge the very learned there' is wrong. If it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'Should have charming dwellings built, and lodge the very learned there,' then 'From intimacy fear is born, from abode arises dust. Without abode, without intimacy - this indeed is the sage's vision' - that statement too is wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'From intimacy fear is born, from abode arises dust. Without abode, without intimacy - this indeed is the sage's vision.' And it was spoken: 'Should have charming dwellings built, and lodge the very learned there.' That which, great king, was spoken by the Blessed One: 'From intimacy fear is born, from abode arises dust. Without abode, without intimacy - this indeed is the sage's vision' - that is a statement of intrinsic nature, a statement without remainder, a statement without exception, a statement without qualification, befitting an ascetic, suitable for an ascetic, proper for an ascetic, worthy of an ascetic, the resort of an ascetic, the practice of an ascetic, the conduct of an ascetic. Just as, great king, a forest deer, roaming in the forest wilds, without attachment, without abode, lies down wherever he wishes, even so, great king, by a monk 'From intimacy fear is born, from abode arises dust. Without abode, without intimacy - this indeed is the sage's vision' - thus should it be considered.

"But, great king, what was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Should have charming dwellings built, and lodge the very learned there' - that was spoken by the Blessed One considering two reasons. Which two? The gift of a dwelling is praised, approved, extolled, and commended by all Buddhas; having given that gift of a dwelling, they will be released from birth, ageing, and death. This is the first benefit in the gift of a dwelling.

"Furthermore, when a dwelling exists, nuns will be at a known meeting place, easy to see for those wishing to see them; without an abode they will be difficult to see. This is the second benefit in the gift of a dwelling. Considering these two reasons, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Should have charming dwellings built, and lodge the very learned there'; therein attachment should not be made by a son of the Buddha to an abode." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on intimacy is the first.

2.

The Question on Stomach Restraint

2. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One -

"And again it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'But I, Udāyī, sometimes eat from this bowl filled level to the brim, and even more.' If, venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'One should not be negligent in what is to be undertaken, one should be restrained in the belly,' then the statement 'But I, Udāyī, sometimes eat from this bowl filled level to the brim, and even more' is wrong. If it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'But I, Udāyī, sometimes eat from this bowl filled level to the brim, and even more,' then the statement 'One should not be negligent in what is to be undertaken, one should be restrained in the belly' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'One should not be negligent in what is to be undertaken, one should be restrained in the belly,' and it was said: 'But I, Udāyī, sometimes eat from this bowl filled level to the brim, and even more.' That which, great king, was spoken by the Blessed One: 'One should not be negligent in what is to be undertaken, one should be restrained in the belly' - that is a statement of intrinsic nature, a statement without remainder, a statement without exception, a statement without qualification, a factual statement, a true statement, an exact statement, an unreversed statement, a statement of a seer, a statement of a sage, a statement of a Blessed One, a statement of a Worthy One, a statement of an Individually Enlightened One, a statement of a Conqueror, a statement of an Omniscient One, a statement of the Tathāgata, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One.

"One unrestrained in the belly, great king, kills living beings, takes what is not given, goes to another's wife, speaks falsely, drinks intoxicants, deprives one's mother of life, deprives one's father of life, deprives a Worthy One of life, splits the monastic community, and with a malicious mind draws blood from a Tathāgata. Is it not, great king, that Devadatta, unrestrained in the belly, having split the monastic community, accumulated action lasting for a cosmic cycle? Having seen such manifold reasons, great king, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'One should not be negligent in what is to be undertaken, one should be restrained in the belly.'

"One restrained in the belly, great king, fully realises the full realization of the four truths, realizes the four fruits of asceticism, attains mastery in the four analytical knowledges, in the eight attainments, in the six direct knowledges, and fulfils the entire ascetic practice. Is it not, great king, that the young parrot, having become restrained in the belly, having shaken even the realm of the Thirty-three, brought Sakka, the lord of the gods, into attendance? Having seen such manifold reasons, great king, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'One should not be negligent in what is to be undertaken, one should be restrained in the belly.'

"But, great king, what was spoken by the Blessed One: 'But I, Udāyī, sometimes eat from this bowl filled level to the brim, and even more' - that was spoken by the Tathāgata with reference to himself, by one whose task is done, whose function is finished, whose purpose is accomplished, who has reached the end of the holy life, who is without obstruction, who is omniscient, who is self-become.

"Just as, great king, for one who has vomited, who has been purged, who has been given an enema, who is sick, doing what is suitable is to be desired, just so indeed, great king, for one with mental defilements, who has not seen the truth, restraint in the belly is to be done. Just as, great king, for a jewel gem that is radiant, that has genuine qualities, that is pure by nature, there is nothing to be done by polishing, rubbing, and cleansing, just so indeed, great king, for the Tathāgata who has gone to perfection in the domain of a Buddha, there is no obstruction in functional activities." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on stomach restraint is the second.

3.

The Question on the Buddha's Freedom from Illness

3. "Venerable Nāgasena, this was spoken by the Blessed One: 'I am, monks, a brahmin, accessible to requests, always with purified hands, bearing my final body, an unsurpassed physician, a surgeon.' And again it was said by the Blessed One: 'This is the foremost, monks, of my disciples who are monks with few illnesses, namely Bākula.' And illness is seen to have arisen many times in the Blessed One's body. If, venerable Nāgasena, the Tathāgata is unsurpassed, then 'This is the foremost... etc. Bākula' - that statement is wrong. If the Elder Bākula is the foremost of those with few illnesses, then 'I am... etc. a surgeon' - that statement too is wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'I am... etc. a surgeon,' and it was said: 'This is the foremost... etc. Bākula' - but that was spoken with reference to the existence in oneself of external traditions, attainments, and scriptural learning.

"Now there are, great king, disciples of the Blessed One who practise standing and walking meditation; they spend the day and night by standing and walking. But the Blessed One, great king, spends the day and night by standing, walking, sitting, and lying down. Those monks, great king, who practise standing and walking meditation, they are superior in that factor.

"Now there are, great king, disciples of the Blessed One who are one-session eaters; they do not eat a second meal even for the sake of their life. But the Blessed One, great king, eats a second and even a third meal. Those monks, great king, who are one-session eaters, they are superior in that factor. Those various reasons, great king, were spoken with reference to those various persons. But the Blessed One, great king, is unsurpassed in morality, concentration, wisdom, liberation, knowledge and vision of liberation, the ten powers, the four grounds of self-confidence, the eighteen qualities of a Buddha, and the six kinds of knowledge not shared with others; with reference to the entire domain of a Buddha, it was spoken: 'I am... etc. a surgeon.'

"Here, great king, among human beings, one is of noble birth, one is wealthy, one possesses true knowledge, one is skilled in crafts, one is a hero, one is discerning; having overcome all these, the king alone is the highest among them. Just so indeed, great king, the Blessed One is the foremost, the eldest, the best of all beings.

"But that the Venerable Bākula was one with few illnesses was by the power of his resolution. For he, great king, when a wind illness of the stomach arose in the Blessed One Anomadassī, and when a grass-flower disease arose in the Blessed One Vipassī and in sixty-eight hundred thousand monks, being himself an ascetic, having removed that disease with various medicines, attained the state of having few illnesses, and it was said: 'This is the foremost... etc. Bākula.'

"Whether illness arises or does not arise in the Blessed One, great king, whether ascetic practices are undertaken or not undertaken, there is no being equal to the Blessed One. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One, the god above gods, in the excellent seal of the Connected Collection:

"'As far as there are beings, monks, whether footless or two-footed or four-footed or many-footed, whether material or immaterial, whether percipient or non-percipient or neither-percipient-nor-non-percipient, the Tathāgata is declared the foremost among them, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One.' "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the Buddha's freedom from illness is the third.

4.

The Question on the Arising of the Path

4. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'The Tathāgata, monks, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, is the producer of the unarisen path.' And again it was said: 'I saw, monks, an ancient path, an ancient road, followed by the perfectly Self-awakened Ones of former times.' If, Venerable Nāgasena, the Tathāgata is the producer of the unarisen path, then the statement 'I saw, monks, an ancient path, an ancient road, followed by the perfectly Self-awakened Ones of former times' is wrong. If it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'I saw, monks, an ancient path, an ancient road, followed by the perfectly Self-awakened Ones of former times,' then the statement 'The Tathāgata, monks, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, is the producer of the unarisen path' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'The Tathāgata, monks, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, is the producer of the unarisen path.' And it was said: 'I saw, monks, an ancient path, an ancient road, followed by the perfectly Self-awakened Ones of former times' - both of these are statements of intrinsic nature. With the disappearance of the former Tathāgatas, great king, when there was no instructor, the path disappeared. That path, broken down, crumbling, hidden, closed, concealed, not traversed - the Tathāgata, seeing it with the eye of wisdom, saw it as followed by the perfectly Self-awakened Ones of former times. For that reason he said: 'I saw, monks, an ancient path, an ancient road, followed by the perfectly Self-awakened Ones of former times.'

"With the disappearance of the former Tathāgatas, great king, when there was no instructor, the path that was broken down, crumbling, hidden, closed, concealed, not traversed - that the Tathāgata now made traversable. For that reason he said: 'The Tathāgata, monks, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, is the producer of the unarisen path.'

"Here, great king, with the disappearance of a wheel-turning monarch, the jewel gem hides between mountain peaks; with the right practice of another wheel-turning monarch, it approaches him. Is that jewel gem, great king, made by him?" "No indeed, venerable sir, that jewel gem is just natural; but it was produced by him." "Just so indeed, great king, the natural eightfold safe path practised by the former Tathāgatas, when there was no instructor, broken down, crumbling, hidden, closed, concealed, not traversed - the Blessed One, seeing it with the eye of wisdom, produced it, made it traversable. For that reason he said: 'The Tathāgata, monks, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, is the producer of the unarisen path.'

"Or else, great king, just as a mother, having given birth from the womb to a son who already exists, is called 'the one who gave birth,' just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata, seeing with the eye of wisdom the path that already exists, broken down, crumbling, hidden, closed, concealed, not traversed, produced it, made it traversable. For that reason he said: 'The Tathāgata, monks, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, is the producer of the unarisen path.'

"Or else, great king, when some man sees something that was lost, people say 'that article was produced by him.' Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata, seeing with the eye of wisdom the path that already exists, broken down, crumbling, hidden, closed, concealed, not traversed, produced it, made it traversable. For that reason he said: 'The Tathāgata, monks, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, is the producer of the unarisen path.'

"Or else, great king, when some man, having cleared a forest, brings forth land, people say 'that land is his,' yet that land was not created by him; having made that land the cause, he is called the owner of the land. Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata, seeing with wisdom the path that already exists, broken down, crumbling, hidden, closed, concealed, not traversed, produced it, made it traversable. For that reason he said: 'The Tathāgata, monks, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, is the producer of the unarisen path.'" "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the arising of the path is the fourth.

5.

The Question on the Buddha Not Harassing

5. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Formerly, when I was a human being, I was one who did not harass beings.' And again it was said: 'The sage named Lomasakassapa, having killed many hundreds of living beings, performed the vājapeyya, the great sacrifice.' If, Venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Formerly, when I was a human being, I was one who did not harass beings,' then the statement 'The sage Lomasakassapa, having killed many hundreds of living beings, performed the vājapeyya, the great sacrifice' is wrong. If 'The sage Lomasakassapa, having killed many hundreds of living beings, performed the vājapeyya, the great sacrifice,' then the statement 'Formerly, when I was a human being, I was one who did not harass beings' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'Formerly, when I was a human being, I was one who did not harass beings'; 'The sage Lomasakassapa, having killed many hundreds of living beings, performed the vājapeyya, the great sacrifice' - but that was by one unconscious through the influence of lust, not by one with intention."

"There are these eight persons, Venerable Nāgasena, who kill living beings. What are the eight? One lustful kills living beings through the influence of lust; one corrupt kills living beings through the influence of hate; one deluded kills living beings through the influence of delusion; one conceited kills living beings through the influence of conceit; one greedy kills living beings through the influence of greed; one who owns nothing kills living beings for the sake of livelihood; a fool kills living beings through the influence of jest; a king kills living beings through the influence of discipline. These, Venerable Nāgasena, are the eight persons who kill living beings. It was just natural, Venerable Nāgasena, what was done by the Bodhisatta." "No, great king, it was not natural what was done by the Bodhisatta. If, great king, the Bodhisatta in his natural state would bend down to perform the great sacrifice, he would not have spoken this verse:

"Speaking thus, great king, the Bodhisatta, together with seeing the princess Candavatī, became unconscious, mentally deranged, lustful, become unconscious, confused and bewildered, very quickly; with that distracted, swaying, agitated mind, he performed the vājapeyya, the great sacrifice, with a great accumulation of blood from the throats of many slaughtered animals.

"Just as, great king, a mad man, mentally deranged, treads upon blazing fire, grasps an angry venomous snake, approaches an intoxicated elephant, plunges into the ocean where no shore is seen, tramples upon a bathing tank and a cesspool, climbs upon a thorny hedge, falls into a precipice, eats impure things, walks naked on the road, and does various other improper things. Just so indeed, great king, the Bodhisatta, together with seeing the princess Candavatī, became unconscious, mentally deranged, lustful, become unconscious, confused and bewildered, very quickly; with that distracted, swaying, agitated mind, he performed the vājapeyya, the great sacrifice, with a great accumulation of blood from the throats of many slaughtered animals.

"Evil done by one mentally deranged, great king, is not greatly blameworthy even in this present life, nor so in the future state by way of result. Here, great king, suppose some mad man were to commit a capital offence, what punishment would you impose on him?" "What punishment, venerable sir, would there be for a mad man? We would have him beaten and expelled; that itself is his punishment." "Thus indeed, great king, for the offence of a mad man there is not even punishment; therefore for what is done by a mad man there is no fault, it is curable. Just so indeed, great king, the sage Lomasakassapa, together with seeing the princess Candavatī, became unconscious, mentally deranged, lustful, become unconscious, with effort spread out, confused and bewildered, very quickly; with that distracted, swaying, agitated mind, he performed the vājapeyya, the great sacrifice, with a great accumulation of blood from the throats of many slaughtered animals. But when he became of normal mind, having regained mindfulness, then having gone forth again, having developed the five direct knowledges, he became one destined for the Brahma world." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the Buddha not harassing is the fifth.

6.

The Question Concerning Chaddanta and Jotipāla

6. "Venerable Nāgasena, this was spoken by the Blessed One about Chaddanta the king of elephants -

"And again it was said: 'The young man Jotipāla, being such, reviled and abused the Blessed One Kassapa, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, with the term "shaveling," with the term "little ascetic," with vulgar and harsh speech.' If, Venerable Nāgasena, the Bodhisatta, being an animal, venerated the ochre robe, then the statement 'The Blessed One Kassapa, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, was reviled and abused by the young man Jotipāla with the term "shaveling," with the term "little ascetic," with vulgar and harsh speech' is wrong. If the Blessed One Kassapa, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, was reviled and abused by the young man Jotipāla with the term "shaveling," with the term "little ascetic," with vulgar and harsh speech, then the statement 'The ochre robe was venerated by Chaddanta the king of elephants' is also wrong. If the ochre robe worn by the hunter was venerated by the Bodhisatta who was an animal, experiencing hard, rough, and sharp painful feeling, why did he, having become a human being, with mature knowledge, with mature enlightenment, having seen the Blessed One Kassapa, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, the one of ten powers, the leader of the world, risen and exalted, blazing with the radiance of a fathom, the noble and excellent one, wrapped in the noble, beautiful Kāsi ochre robe, not venerate him? This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One about Chaddanta the king of elephants: 'Thinking "I shall kill him"' etc. 'not to be harmed by the virtuous.'" And the Blessed One Kassapa, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, was reviled and abused by the young man Jotipāla with the term "shaveling," with the term "little ascetic," with vulgar and harsh speech; but that was by reason of birth, by reason of family. The young man Jotipāla, great king, was reborn in a faithless, unbelieving family; his mother and father, sisters and brothers, female and male slaves, servants, attendants and people had Brahmā as their deity, had Brahmā as their authority. They, thinking 'Brahmins alone are the highest, the noble,' censure and despise the rest who have gone forth. Having heard that word of theirs, the young man Jotipāla, when called by Ghaṭikāra the potter to see the Teacher, said thus: 'What is the use of seeing that bald-headed little ascetic?'

"Just as, great king, the deathless, having come into contact with poison, becomes bitter, and just as cool water, having come into contact with fire, becomes hot, even so, great king, the young man Jotipāla, having been reborn in a faithless, unbelieving family, being blind by reason of family, reviled and abused the Tathāgata.

"Just as, great king, a great mass of fire, burning and blazing, radiant, having come into contact with water, becomes one whose radiance and heat are destroyed, cool and black, like a ripe vitex negundo fruit, even so, great king, the young man Jotipāla, meritorious, faithful, radiant with vast knowledge, having been reborn in a faithless, unbelieving family, being blind by reason of family, reviled and abused the Tathāgata; but having approached and having understood the virtues of the Buddha, he became like a servant, and having gone forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation, having developed the direct knowledges and the attainments, he became one destined for the Brahma world." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question concerning Chaddanta and Jotipāla is the sixth.

7.

The Question on Ghaṭikāra

7. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'The entire workshop of the potter Ghaṭikāra stood with the sky as its roof for three months, and the rain did not fall upon it.' And again it was said: 'The hut of the Tathāgata Kassapa is being rained upon.' But why, Venerable Nāgasena, is the hut of the Tathāgata, one with such abundant wholesome roots, rained upon? Should not that be the power of the Tathāgata? If, Venerable Nāgasena, the workshop of the potter Ghaṭikāra was sheltered from the rain with the sky as its roof, then the statement 'the hut of the Tathāgata is being rained upon' is wrong. If the hut of the Tathāgata is being rained upon, then the statement 'the workshop of the potter Ghaṭikāra was sheltered from the rain with the sky as its roof' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'The entire workshop of the potter Ghaṭikāra stood with the sky as its roof for three months, and the rain did not fall upon it.' And it was said: 'The hut of the Tathāgata Kassapa is being rained upon.' The potter Ghaṭikāra, great king, was moral, of good character, with abundant wholesome roots, and he supported his blind and aged mother and father. Without his presence, without asking his permission, they took grass from his house and covered the hut of the Blessed One. He, by that taking of grass, obtained unshaken, unwavering, well-established, vast, incomparable rapture, and he produced even more immeasurable pleasure, thinking 'Oh indeed, the Blessed One is supramundane, well trusted by me!' By that, a result pertaining to the present life arose for him. Indeed, great king, the Tathāgata does not waver by such a change.

"Just as, great king, Sineru, the king of mountains, does not tremble or waver even by many hundreds of thousands of wind blows, and the great ocean, the excellent and supreme sea, is not filled and does not undergo change even by many hundreds of thousands of great Ganges rivers, just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata does not waver by such a change.

"But, great king, that the hut of the Tathāgata is being rained upon is out of compassion for the great crowd of people. Seeing these two reasons, great king, Tathāgatas do not use requisites created by themselves: 'This Teacher is the foremost worthy of offerings' - having given requisites to the Blessed One, gods and humans will be released from all unfortunate realms; and showing that they seek livelihood, 'lest others should blame them.' Seeing these two reasons, Tathāgatas do not use requisites created by themselves. If, great king, Sakka or Brahmā or he himself were to make that hut sheltered from the rain, that very action would be blameworthy, faulty, with refutation, thinking 'these, having made it manifest, delude the world, making it excessive'; therefore that action is to be avoided. Tathāgatas, great king, do not request material things; by that non-requesting of material things, they become beyond reproach." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on Ghaṭikāra is the seventh.

8.

The Question on the Brahmin-King Statement

8. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'I am, monks, a brahmin, accessible to requests.' And again it was said: 'I am a king, Sela.' If, Venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One: 'I am, monks, a brahmin, accessible to requests,' then the statement 'I am a king, Sela' is wrong. If it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'I am a king, Sela,' then the statement 'I am, monks, a brahmin, accessible to requests' is also wrong. For one would be either a warrior or a brahmin; there are not two castes in one birth. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'I am, monks, a brahmin, accessible to requests,' and again it was said: 'I am a king, Sela.' There is a reason here, by which reason the Tathāgata is both a brahmin and a king."

"But what, Venerable Nāgasena, is that reason, by which reason the Tathāgata is both a brahmin and a king?" "All evil unwholesome mental states, great king, have been warded off, abandoned, departed, gone away, cut off, eliminated, reached destruction, quenched, and calmed by the Tathāgata; therefore the Tathāgata is called 'a brahmin.'

"A brahmin is one who has passed beyond doubt, uncertainty, and the path of perplexity; the Blessed One too, great king, has passed beyond doubt, uncertainty, and the path of perplexity; for that reason the Tathāgata is called 'a brahmin.'

"A brahmin is one who has escaped from all existences, destinations, and modes of generation, who is freed from the stain and dust of defilements, who is without companion; the Blessed One too, great king, has escaped from all existences, destinations, and modes of generation, is freed from the stain and dust of defilements, is without companion; for that reason the Tathāgata is called 'a brahmin.'

"A brahmin is one who abounds in the highest, best, excellent, supreme divine abidings; the Blessed One too, great king, abounds in the highest, best, excellent, supreme divine abidings; for that reason too the Tathāgata is called 'a brahmin.'

"A brahmin is one who upholds the tradition and lineage of the instruction of former times regarding study, teaching, giving and receiving, self-control, restraint, and observance; the Blessed One too, great king, upholds the tradition and lineage of the instruction practised by former Conquerors regarding study, teaching, giving and receiving, self-control, restraint, and observance; for that reason too the Tathāgata is called 'a brahmin.'

"A brahmin is a meditator on the meditative absorption of the sublime pleasant abiding; the Blessed One too, great king, is a meditator on the meditative absorption of the sublime pleasant abiding; for that reason too the Tathāgata is called 'a brahmin.'

"A brahmin knows the conduct and behaviour of noble birth in all existences, non-existences, and destinations; the Blessed One too, great king, knows the conduct and behaviour of noble birth in all existences, non-existences, and destinations; for that reason too the Tathāgata is called 'a brahmin.'

"'Brahmin,' great king, this name of the Blessed One was not made by his mother, not made by his father, not made by his brother, not made by his sister, not made by friends and colleagues, not made by relatives and blood-relations, not made by ascetics and brahmins, not made by deities; this is a designation at the end of liberation for the Buddhas, the Blessed Ones, a designation realised at the very root of the Bodhi tree, having scattered Māra's army, having expelled evil unwholesome mental states of the past, future, and present, together with the attainment of omniscient knowledge, at the very moment of obtaining, manifesting, and arising, that is to say 'brahmin'; for that reason the Tathāgata is called 'a brahmin.'"

"But for what reason, Venerable Nāgasena, is the Tathāgata called 'a king'?" "A king, great king, is whoever exercises kingship and governs the world; the Blessed One too, great king, exercises kingship by righteousness in the ten-thousand-fold world system, and instructs the world with its gods, with its Māras, with its Brahmās, the generation with its ascetics and brahmins, with its gods and humans; for that reason too the Tathāgata is called 'a king.'

"A king, great king, having overcome all people, delighting the congregation of kinsmen, causing grief to the congregation of enemies, raises the white, spotless, pure parasol with a pole of great fame, glory, and splendour, firm and substantial, decorated with a hundred complete ribs; the Blessed One too, great king, causing grief to Māra's army that is wrongly practising, delighting gods and humans who are rightly practising, raises in the ten-thousand-fold world system the white, spotless, pure parasol of the highest, excellent liberation, with a pole of great fame, glory, and splendour, firm and substantial with patience, decorated with a hundred ribs of excellent knowledge; for that reason too the Tathāgata is called 'a king.'

"A king is one to be venerated by many people who have attained prosperity; the Blessed One too, great king, is to be venerated by many gods and humans who have attained prosperity; for that reason too the Tathāgata is called 'a king.'

"A king, having been pleased with whoever pleases him, having given the boon that was requested, satisfies him with sensual pleasures; the Blessed One too, great king, having been pleased with whoever pleases him by body, speech, and mind, having given the unsurpassed boon that was requested, the complete release from all suffering, satisfies him with the complete boon of sensual pleasures; for that reason too the Tathāgata is called 'a king.'

"A king censures, burns, and destroys one who transgresses his command; in the excellent Dispensation of the Blessed One too, great king, one who is shameless and transgresses the command, having become looked down upon, scorned, and blamed with a state of dejection, is expelled from the excellent Dispensation of the Conqueror; for that reason too the Tathāgata is called 'a king.'

"A king, having illuminated what is righteous and unrighteous according to the traditional instruction of former righteous kings, exercising kingship by righteousness, becomes desired, dear, and wished for by people; he establishes the royal family lineage for a long time by the power of the virtue of righteousness; the Blessed One too, great king, having illuminated what is righteous and unrighteous according to the traditional instruction of former Self-awakened Ones, governing the world by righteousness, becomes desired, dear, and wished for by gods and humans; he keeps the Dispensation going for a long time by the power of the virtue of righteousness; for that reason too the Tathāgata is called 'a king.' Thus manifold, great king, is the reason, by which reason the Tathāgata would be both a brahmin and a king; even a very subtle monk could not accomplish it in a cosmic cycle. Why say too much? It should be accepted in brief." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the brahmin-king statement is the eighth.

9.

The Question on the Discussion of Food Gained by Reciting Verses

9. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One -

"And further, the Blessed One, teaching and speaking the Teaching to an assembly, giving a progressive discourse, first speaks a talk on giving, afterwards a talk on morality; having heard what was spoken by that Blessed One, the lord of all the world, gods and humans, having prepared, give gifts; his disciples consume that gift which was urged. If, venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Blessed One 'What is gained by reciting verses is not to be eaten by me,' then the statement 'The Blessed One first speaks a talk on giving' is wrong. If he first speaks a talk on giving, then the statement 'What is gained by reciting verses is not to be eaten by me' is also wrong. What is the reason? That one, venerable sir, who is worthy of offerings, who speaks of the result of giving almsfood to householders - having heard his talk on the Teaching, with confident minds they give gifts again and again; whoever consumes that gift, all of them consume what is gained by reciting verses. This too is a question with two points, subtle, profound, reached by austere asceticism; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'What is gained by reciting verses is not to be eaten by me, brahmin, this is not the principle for those who see clearly. The Buddhas reject what is gained by reciting verses, brahmin, when the Teaching exists, this is the way of living,' and the Blessed One first speaks a talk on giving; and this is the practice of all Tathāgatas - first by a talk on giving, having caused the mind to delight therein, afterwards they urge towards morality. Just as, great king, people first give toys to young children. As follows: toy ploughs, stick games, toy windmills, toy measures, toy chariots, toy bows; afterwards they urge them in their own respective work. Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata, having first caused the mind to delight by a talk on giving, afterwards urges towards morality.

"Or else, great king, a physician first gives oil to the sick for four or five days for strengthening and softening, afterwards he administers a purgative. Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata, having first caused the mind to delight by a talk on giving, afterwards urges towards morality. The mind of donors, great king, of masters of giving, is soft, gentle, smooth; by that, by the bridge of giving, by the boat of giving, they go to the far shore of the ocean of the round of rebirths; therefore he first instructs them in the field of action, and does not commit any intimation."

"Venerable Nāgasena, as for what you say 'intimation', how many are those intimations?" "There are these two, great king, intimations: bodily intimation and verbal intimation. Therein there is bodily intimation that is blameworthy, there is blameless. There is verbal intimation that is blameworthy, there is blameless.

"Which is blameworthy bodily intimation? Here a certain monk, having approached families, standing in an unsuitable place, breaks his standing position; this is blameworthy bodily intimation. And what is intimated by that, the noble ones do not consume; and that person, in the time of the noble ones, is looked down upon, scorned, mocked, blamed, despised, disrespected, and is reckoned as one of broken livelihood.

"Furthermore, great king, here a certain monk, having approached families, standing in an unsuitable place, having stretched out his neck, looks with a peacock's gaze, thinking 'thus these will see me,' and by that they see him. This too is blameworthy bodily intimation. And what is intimated by that, the noble ones do not consume; and that person, in the time of the noble ones, is looked down upon, scorned, mocked, blamed, despised, disrespected, and is reckoned as one of broken livelihood.

"Furthermore, great king, here a certain monk intimates by the jaw or by the eyebrow or by the thumb; this too is blameworthy bodily intimation; and what is intimated by that, the noble ones do not consume; and that person, in the time of the noble ones, is looked down upon, scorned, mocked, blamed, despised, disrespected, and is reckoned as one of broken livelihood.

"Which is blameless bodily intimation? Here a monk, having approached families, mindful, concentrated, fully aware, whether in a suitable place or an unsuitable place, having gone according to instruction, stands in a suitable place; he stands among those wishing to give, he departs from those not wishing to give. This is blameless bodily intimation; and what is intimated by that, the noble ones consume; and that person, in the time of the noble ones, is praised, extolled, commended, of austere conduct, and is reckoned as one of pure livelihood. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One, the god above gods -

"What is blameworthy verbal intimation? Here, great king, a monk by speech asks for in many ways the requisites of robes, almsfood, lodging and medicine for the sick; this is blameworthy verbal intimation, and what is obtained by that intimation noble ones do not consume, and that person at the time of the noble ones is looked down upon, scorned, mocked, blamed, despised, disregarded, and is reckoned as one of broken livelihood.

"Furthermore, great king, here a certain monk, making others hear, speaks thus: 'I have need of this,' and by that speech made heard by others, gain arises for him; this too is blameworthy verbal intimation, and what is obtained by that intimation noble ones do not consume, and that person at the time of the noble ones is looked down upon, scorned, mocked, blamed, despised, disregarded, and is reckoned as one of broken livelihood.

"Furthermore, great king, here a certain monk by verbal expression makes the assembly hear: 'Such and such should be given to the monks,' and they, having heard that word, bring what was proclaimed; this too is blameworthy verbal intimation, and what is obtained by that intimation noble ones do not consume, and that person at the time of the noble ones is looked down upon, scorned, mocked, blamed, despised, disregarded, and is reckoned as one of broken livelihood.

"Is it not, great king, that the Elder Sāriputta too, when the sun had set, in the night-time, being ill, when asked about medicine by the Elder Mahāmoggallāna, broke into speech, and by that verbal expression medicine arose for him. Then the Elder Sāriputta, thinking 'This medicine has arisen for me by verbal expression, may my livelihood not be broken,' out of fear of breaking his livelihood, abandoned that medicine and did not live on it. Thus too verbal intimation is blameworthy, and what is obtained by that intimation noble ones do not consume. And that person at the time of the noble ones is looked down upon, scorned, mocked, blamed, despised, disregarded, and is reckoned as one of broken livelihood.

"What is blameless verbal intimation? Here, great king, a monk, when there is a reason, asks for medicine from families who are relatives or who have invited him; this is blameless verbal intimation, and what is obtained by that intimation noble ones consume, and that person at the time of the noble ones is praised, extolled, commended, and is reckoned as one of pure livelihood, approved by the Tathāgatas, the Worthy Ones, the perfectly Self-awakened Ones.

"But that, great king, which the Tathāgata abandoned - the food of the brahmin Kasibhāradvāja - that arose through winding, unwinding, pulling, refutation, and counter-action; therefore the Tathāgata rejected that almsfood and did not live on it."

"At all times, Venerable Nāgasena, when the Tathāgata was eating, did the deities sprinkle divine nutriment in the bowl, or did they sprinkle it only in the two almsfoods of the pig's delight and the milk-rice?" "At all times, great king, when the Tathāgata was eating, the deities, having taken divine nutriment, standing close, sprinkled it on each and every morsel that was lifted up.

"Just as, great king, a king's cook, having taken curry, standing close to the king while he is eating, sprinkles curry on each and every mouthful, just so, great king, at all times when the Tathāgata was eating, the deities, having taken divine nutriment, standing close, sprinkled divine nutriment on each and every morsel that was lifted up. Even at Verañjā, great king, when the Tathāgata was eating dried barley grains, the deities, having moistened them again and again with divine nutriment, brought them near; thereby the Tathāgata's body was nourished." "It is a gain indeed, Venerable Nāgasena, for those deities who were constantly and continuously engaged in zeal for attending to the Tathāgata's body. Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the discussion of food gained by reciting verses is the ninth.

10.

The Question on Living at Ease Regarding Teaching the Teaching

10. "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'the knowledge of omniscience was developed by the Tathāgata during four incalculable periods and a hundred thousand cosmic cycles in between, for the salvation of a great crowd of people.' And again 'the mind of one who had attained omniscience inclined to living at ease, not to teaching the Teaching.'

Just as, venerable Nāgasena, an archer or an archer's pupil, having trained in archery for many days for the purpose of battle, might draw back when a great war has arrived, just so indeed, venerable Nāgasena, having developed the knowledge of omniscience during four incalculable periods and a hundred thousand cosmic cycles in between for the salvation of a great crowd of people, by one who had attained omniscience there was drawing back from teaching the Teaching.

Or else, venerable Nāgasena, just as a wrestler or a wrestler's pupil, having trained in wrestling for many days, might draw back when a wrestling contest has arrived, just so indeed, venerable Nāgasena, having developed the knowledge of omniscience during four incalculable periods and a hundred thousand cosmic cycles in between for the salvation of a great crowd of people, by one who had attained omniscience there was drawing back from teaching the Teaching.

What indeed, venerable Nāgasena, did the Tathāgata draw back out of fear, or did he draw back out of obscurity, or did he draw back out of weakness, or did he draw back out of non-omniscience? What is the reason there? Come now, tell me the reason for overcoming uncertainty. If, venerable Nāgasena, the knowledge of omniscience was developed by the Tathāgata during four incalculable periods and a hundred thousand cosmic cycles in between for the salvation of a great crowd of people, then the statement 'the mind of one who had attained omniscience inclined to living at ease, not to teaching the Teaching' is wrong. If the mind of one who had attained omniscience inclined to living at ease, not to teaching the Teaching, then the statement 'the knowledge of omniscience was developed by the Tathāgata during four incalculable periods and a hundred thousand cosmic cycles in between for the salvation of a great crowd of people' is also wrong. This too is a question with two points, profound, hard to unravel, that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"The knowledge of omniscience was developed, great king, by the Tathāgata during four incalculable periods and a hundred thousand cosmic cycles in between for the salvation of a great crowd of people, and the mind of one who had attained omniscience inclined to living at ease, not to teaching the Teaching. But having seen the profundity, subtlety, difficulty to see, difficulty to understand, subtleness, and difficulty to penetrate of the Teaching, and the attachment and delight of beings, and their being firmly grasped by identity view, thinking 'how indeed, in what way indeed,' the mind inclined to living at ease, not to teaching the Teaching; this was just the mental reflection on the penetration of beings.

Just as, great king, a physician, a surgeon, having approached a man afflicted by many diseases, thinks thus: 'By what method indeed, or by which medicine, might this disease be appeased,' just so indeed, great king, having seen the people afflicted by the disease of all mental defilements, and the profundity, subtlety, difficulty to see, difficulty to understand, subtleness, and difficulty to penetrate of the Teaching, the Tathāgata's mind, thinking 'how indeed, in what way indeed,' inclined to living at ease, not to teaching the Teaching; this was just the mental reflection on the penetration of beings.

Just as, great king, for a king of the warrior caste anointed on the head, having seen people who are doorkeepers, military officers, councillors, townsmen, soldiers, troops, ministers, nobles, and those dependent on the king, this thought might arise: 'How indeed, in what way indeed, shall I treat these kindly,' just so indeed, great king, having seen the profundity, subtlety, difficulty to see, difficulty to understand, subtleness, and difficulty to penetrate of the Teaching, and the attachment and delight of beings, and their being firmly grasped by identity view, the Tathāgata's mind, thinking 'how indeed, in what way indeed,' inclined to living at ease, not to teaching the Teaching; this was just the mental reflection on the penetration of beings.

But moreover, great king, this is the nature of all Tathāgatas, that being requested by Brahmā, they teach the Teaching. But what is the reason there? Those who at that time were humans, hermits, wandering ascetics, ascetics and brahmins, all of them had Brahmā as their deity, had Brahmā as their authority, had Brahmā as their goal; therefore, by the bowing down of that powerful, famous, known, renowned, higher, very exalted one, the world with its gods will bow down, will be convinced, will be resolved - by this reason too, great king, the Tathāgatas, being requested by Brahmā, teach the Teaching.

Just as, great king, whoever, whether a king or a king's chief minister, bows down to someone, shows esteem, by the bowing down of that more powerful one, the remaining populace bows down, shows esteem, just so indeed, great king, when Brahmā has bowed down, the world with its gods will bow down to the Tathāgatas. The world, great king, venerates one who is venerated; therefore that Brahmā requests all Tathāgatas for the teaching of the Teaching, and by that reason the Tathāgatas, being requested by Brahmā, teach the Teaching." "Excellent, venerable Nāgasena, the question has been well unravelled, the explanation is very good; thus I accept this as true."

The question on living at ease regarding teaching the Teaching is the tenth.

11.

The Question on Teacher and Non-Teacher

11. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One -

"And again it was said: 'Thus indeed, monks, Āḷāra Kālāma, being my teacher, placed me, being his pupil, on an equal footing with himself, and honoured me with the highest honour.' If, Venerable Nāgasena, it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'I have no teacher, no one equal to me is found. In the world including the gods, there is no one who is my match,' then the statement 'Thus indeed, monks, Āḷāra Kālāma, being my teacher, placed me, being his pupil, on an equal footing with himself' is wrong. If it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'Thus indeed, monks, Āḷāra Kālāma, being my teacher, placed me, being his pupil, on an equal footing with himself,' then 'I have no teacher, no one equal to me is found. In the world including the gods, there is no one who is my match' - that statement too is wrong. This too is a question with two points that has come to you; it should be resolved by you."

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Tathāgata: 'I have no teacher, no one equal to me is found. In the world including the gods, there is no one who is my match,' and it was said: 'Thus indeed, monks, Āḷāra Kālāma, being my teacher, placed me, being his pupil, on an equal footing with himself, and honoured me with the highest honour.'

"But that statement was spoken with reference to the state of having a teacher, before the enlightenment, while still unenlightened, being just a Bodhisatta.

"There are, great king, these five teachers of the Bodhisatta before the enlightenment, while still unenlightened, being mindful, by whom instructed the Bodhisatta spent the day here and there. Which five? Those eight brahmins, great king, who examined the characteristics of the Bodhisatta when he was just born, as follows: Rāma, Dhaja, Lakkhaṇa, Mantī, Yañña, Suyāma, Subhoja, and Sudatta. They, having declared his welfare, performed a protective ceremony, and they were the first teachers.

"Furthermore, great king, the Bodhisatta's father, King Suddhodana, having brought a brahmin named Sabbamittā, who at that time was well-born, of northern birth with mantras, versed in terms, grammar, and the six factors, having poured water with a golden pitcher, gave him saying 'Train this boy' - this was the second teacher.

"Furthermore, great king, that deity who stirred the Bodhisatta, having heard whose word the Bodhisatta, stirred and agitated, at that very moment went forth into renunciation and became a monk - this was the third teacher.

"Furthermore, great king, Āḷāra Kālāma taught the preliminary work for the plane of nothingness - this was the fourth teacher.

"Furthermore, great king, Udaka Rāmaputta taught the preliminary work for the plane of neither-perception-nor-non-perception - this was the fifth teacher. These indeed, great king, are the five teachers of the Bodhisatta before the enlightenment, while still unenlightened, being mindful. But those teachers were in mundane states. But in this supramundane state, great king, for the penetration of omniscient knowledge, there is no unsurpassed instructor for the Tathāgata. The Tathāgata, great king, is self-become, without a teacher. Therefore, for this reason, it was spoken by the Tathāgata: 'I have no teacher, no one equal to me is found. In the world including the gods, there is no one who is my match.' "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on teacher and non-teacher is the eleventh.

The Chapter on Intimacy is the fifth.

In this chapter there are eleven questions.

The Meṇḍaka Questions are concluded.

5.

The Question of Inference

1.

The Chapter on the Buddhas

1.

The Question on Two Buddhas Not Arising

1. "Venerable Nāgasena, this was spoken by the Blessed One: 'This is impossible, monks, there is no chance that two Worthy Ones, perfectly Self-awakened Ones, should arise simultaneously in one world system - this is impossible.' And when teaching, venerable Nāgasena, all Tathāgatas teach the thirty-seven qualities conducive to enlightenment; when speaking, they speak of the four noble truths; when training, they train in the three trainings; when instructing, they instruct in the practice of diligence. If, venerable Nāgasena, all Tathāgatas have one teaching, one talk, one training, one instruction, for what reason do two Tathāgatas not arise at one moment? Even by the arising of one Buddha this world has become radiant; if there were a second Buddha, by the radiance of two this world would become radiant to an even greater degree; and two Tathāgatas exhorting would exhort easily, and instructing would instruct easily. Tell me the reason for this, so that I may be free from doubt."

"This ten-thousand-fold world system, great king, can bear only one Buddha; it bears the virtue of only one Tathāgata. If a second Buddha were to arise, this ten-thousand-fold world system would not bear it; it would shake, tremble, bend, bend down, twist, scatter, be destroyed, be demolished, and would not remain in place.

Just as, great king, a boat might be able to carry one person; when one person has boarded, that boat would be fully loaded. Then a second person might come, similar in life span, beauty, age, size, thinness and stoutness, and in all major and minor limbs; he might board that boat. Would that boat, great king, bear both of them?" "No indeed, venerable sir, it would shake, tremble, bend, bend down, twist, scatter, be destroyed, be demolished, would not remain in place, and would sink in the water." "Just so indeed, great king, this ten-thousand-fold world system can bear only one Buddha; it bears the virtue of only one Tathāgata. If a second Buddha were to arise, this ten-thousand-fold world system would not bear it; it would shake, tremble, bend, bend down, twist, scatter, be destroyed, be demolished, and would not remain in place.

Or else, great king, suppose a man were to eat as much food as he likes, satisfying himself, filling up to the throat; he, satisfied, gratified, complete, without interval, drowsy, become stiff as an unbent stick, were to eat again that much food. Would that man, great king, be happy?" "No indeed, venerable sir, having eaten once he would die." "Just so indeed, great king, this ten-thousand-fold world system can bear only one Buddha; it bears the virtue of only one Tathāgata. If a second Buddha were to arise, this ten-thousand-fold world system would not bear it; it would shake, tremble, bend, bend down, twist, scatter, be destroyed, be demolished, and would not remain in place."

"Is it then, venerable Nāgasena, that the earth shakes because of the excessive burden of the Teaching?" "Here, great king, suppose there were two carts filled with jewels up to the brim; having taken jewels from one cart, they were to heap them onto one cart. Would that cart, great king, bear the jewels of both carts?" "No indeed, venerable sir, its hub would split, its spokes would break, its rim would fall off, its axle would break." "Is it then, great king, that the cart breaks because of the excessive burden of jewels?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, the earth shakes because of the excessive burden of the Teaching.

But moreover, great king, this reason has been brought forward for the elucidation of the power of a Buddha. Listen to another fitting reason for this, by which reason two perfectly Self-awakened Ones do not arise at one moment. If, great king, two perfectly Self-awakened Ones were to arise at one moment, a dispute would arise among their followers: 'Your Buddha, our Buddha,' and they would become divided into two factions. Just as, great king, a dispute might arise among the followers of two powerful ministers: 'Your minister, our minister,' and they become divided into two factions, just so indeed, great king, if two perfectly Self-awakened Ones were to arise at one moment, a dispute would arise among their followers: 'Your Buddha, our Buddha,' and they would become divided into two factions. This, for now, great king, is one reason by which reason two perfectly Self-awakened Ones do not arise at one moment.

Furthermore, great king, listen to a further reason by which reason two perfectly Self-awakened Ones do not arise at one moment. If, great king, two perfectly Self-awakened Ones were to arise at one moment, the statement 'the foremost Buddha' would be wrong, the statement 'the eldest Buddha' would be wrong, 'the best Buddha,' 'the distinguished Buddha,' 'the highest Buddha,' 'the most excellent Buddha,' 'the matchless Buddha,' 'the equal to the matchless Buddha,' 'the incomparable Buddha,' 'the one without counterpart Buddha,' 'the matchless person Buddha' - this statement would be wrong. Accept this reason too, great king, according to its meaning, by which reason two perfectly Self-awakened Ones do not arise at one moment.

But moreover, great king, this is the intrinsic nature of the Buddhas, the Blessed Ones: only one Buddha arises in the world. For what reason? Because of the greatness of the qualities of the omniscient Buddha. Whatever else, great king, is great in the world, that is only one. The earth, great king, is great; it is only one. The ocean is great; it is only one. Sineru, the king of mountains, is great; it is only one. Space is great; it is only one. Sakka is great; he is only one. Māra is great; he is only one. The Great Brahmā is great; he is only one. The Tathāgata, the Worthy One, the perfectly Self-awakened One, is great; he is only one in the world. Wherever they arise, there is no opportunity for another; therefore, great king, the Tathāgata, the Worthy One, the perfectly Self-awakened One, arises only one in the world."

"Well explained, Venerable Nāgasena, is the question with similes and reasons. Even one who is not clever, having heard this, would be delighted, how much more one of great wisdom like me. Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on two Buddhas not arising is the first.

2.

The Question on Gotamī's Gift of Cloth

2. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One when his maternal aunt Mahāpajāpati Gotamī was offering a cloth for the rains: 'Give it to the monastic community, Gotamī. When you have given it to the monastic community, both I shall be venerated and the monastic community as well.' Is it indeed, venerable Nāgasena, that the Tathāgata is not weighty, not heavy, not worthy of offerings compared to the jewel of the monastic community, that the Tathāgata had his own maternal aunt give to the monastic community the cloth for the rains that was being given to himself, which she herself had carded, herself had plucked, herself had beaten, herself had spun, herself had woven? If, venerable Nāgasena, the Tathāgata were higher than the jewel of the monastic community, or superior, or distinguished, thinking 'When given to me, there will be great fruit,' the Tathāgata would not have had his maternal aunt give to the monastic community the cloth for the rains that she herself had carded, herself had plucked, herself had beaten. But because, venerable Nāgasena, the Tathāgata does not desire himself, does not rely on himself, therefore the Tathāgata had his maternal aunt give that cloth for the rains to the monastic community."

"This was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One when his maternal aunt Mahāpajāpati Gotamī was offering a cloth for the rains: 'Give it to the monastic community, Gotamī. When you have given it to the monastic community, both I shall be venerated and the monastic community as well.' But that was not because of his own honour being without result, nor because of being unworthy of offerings. But rather, great king, for the sake of welfare, out of compassion, thinking 'In the future time, after my passing, the monastic community will be honoured,' while proclaiming the virtue that exists, he said thus: 'Give it to the monastic community, Gotamī. When you have given it to the monastic community, both I shall be venerated and the monastic community as well.'

Just as, great king, a father while still living, in the midst of ministers, soldiers, troops, doorkeepers, military officers, and attendants, in the presence of the king, proclaims the virtue that exists of his son, thinking 'Placed here, in the future time, he will be venerated in the midst of people.' Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata, for the sake of welfare, out of compassion, thinking 'In the future time, after my passing, the monastic community will be honoured,' while proclaiming the virtue that exists, said thus: 'Give it to the monastic community, Gotamī. When you have given it to the monastic community, both I shall be venerated and the monastic community as well.'

Indeed, great king, by that mere giving of a cloth for the rains, the monastic community does not become superior to the Tathāgata or distinguished. Just as, great king, mother and father anoint their sons, massage them, bathe them, shampoo them - does indeed, great king, by that mere anointing, massaging, bathing, and shampooing, 'a son become superior to mother and father or distinguished'?" "No indeed, venerable sir. Sons, venerable sir, are those for whom mother and father must do what they do not wish to do; therefore mother and father do the anointing, massaging, bathing, and shampooing for their sons." "Just so indeed, great king, by that mere giving of a cloth for the rains, the monastic community does not become superior to the Tathāgata or distinguished. But rather, the Tathāgata, doing what need not be done, had his maternal aunt give that cloth for the rains to the monastic community.

Or else, great king, if some man were to bring a tribute to a king, and the king were to give that tribute to a certain soldier or trooper or general or chaplain. Would that man, great king, by that mere receipt of the tribute, become superior to the king or distinguished?" "No indeed, venerable sir. That man, venerable sir, is maintained by the king, dependent on the king; placing him in that position, the king gives the tribute." "Just so indeed, great king, by that mere giving of a cloth for the rains, the monastic community does not become superior to the Tathāgata or distinguished; but rather it is maintained by the Tathāgata, dependent on the Tathāgata. Placing it in that position, the Tathāgata had the cloth for the rains given to the monastic community.

Moreover, great king, this occurred to the Tathāgata: 'The monastic community is by nature worthy of honour; I shall honour the monastic community with what belongs to me' - thus he had the cloth for the rains given to the monastic community. The Tathāgata, great king, does not praise only the honouring of himself; but those in the world who are worthy of honour, the Tathāgata praises the honouring of them too.

This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One, the god above gods, in the Dhammadāyāda discourse, the excellent seal of the Middle Collection, while praising the practice of fewness of wishes: 'That former monk is more worthy of respect and more praiseworthy to me.' There is not, great king, in the realms of existence any being worthy of offerings or higher or superior or distinguished compared to the Tathāgata; the Tathāgata alone is higher, superior, distinguished.

This too was spoken, great king, in the excellent Connected Collection, by the young god Māṇavagāmika, standing before the Blessed One, in the midst of gods and humans:

Now these verses, great king, were well sung by the young god Māṇavagāmika, not badly sung, well spoken, not badly spoken, and approved by the Blessed One. Was it not, great king, spoken also by the elder Sāriputta, the General of the Teaching:

"And it was spoken by the Blessed One, the god above gods: 'One person, monks, arising in the world arises for the welfare of many people, for the happiness of many people, out of compassion for the world, for the good, welfare, and happiness of gods and humans. Which one person? The Tathāgata, the Worthy One, the Perfectly Self-awakened One, etc. of gods and humans.'" "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on Gotamī's gift of cloth is the second.

3.

The Question on the Right Practice of Householders and Those Gone Forth

3. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'I praise right practice, monks, whether of a householder or of one gone forth. Whether a householder, monks, or one gone forth, one who has practised rightly, because of right practice, is one who fulfils the true method, the wholesome teaching.' If, Venerable Nāgasena, a householder clad in white, enjoying sensual pleasures, dwelling in the confinement of wife and children, enjoying Kāsi sandalwood, wearing garlands, scents, and cosmetics, accepting gold and silver, bound with jewelled earrings and a variegated topknot, practising rightly, is one who fulfils the true method, the wholesome teaching, and one gone forth also, shaven-headed and clothed in ochre robes, gone to the midst of others' almsfood, one who fulfils completely the four aggregates of morality, living having undertaken one hundred and fifty training rules, living completely in the thirteen virtues of ascetic practice, practising rightly, is one who fulfils the true method, the wholesome teaching. Therein, venerable sir, what is the distinction between a householder or one gone forth? Ascetic practice is fruitless, going forth is useless. Guarding the training rules is barren, undertaking the virtues of ascetic practice is empty; what is the use of practising suffering there? Is not happiness to be attained through happiness alone?"

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One: 'I praise right practice, monks, whether of a householder or of one gone forth. Whether a householder, monks, or one gone forth, one who has practised rightly, because of right practice, is one who fulfils the true method, the wholesome teaching.' Thus, great king, one who has practised rightly is indeed foremost. Even one gone forth, great king, if he should not practise rightly thinking 'I have gone forth,' then he is far from asceticism, far from commitment to holy life, how much more a householder clad in white. A householder also, great king, practising rightly, is one who fulfils the true method, the wholesome teaching; one gone forth also, great king, practising rightly, is one who fulfils the true method, the wholesome teaching.

"But moreover, great king, one gone forth alone is the lord and master of asceticism; going forth, great king, has many virtues, numerous virtues, immeasurable virtues; it is not possible to measure the virtue of going forth.

"Just as, great king, it is not possible to measure by wealth the value of a wish-fulfilling jewel gem, saying 'This much is the price of the jewel gem,' just so indeed, great king, going forth has many virtues, numerous virtues, immeasurable virtues; it is not possible to measure the virtue of going forth.

"Or just as, great king, it is not possible to measure the waves in the great ocean, saying 'There are this many waves in the great ocean,' just so indeed, great king, going forth has many virtues, numerous virtues, immeasurable virtues; it is not possible to measure the virtue of going forth.

"For one gone forth, great king, whatever is to be done, all that succeeds quickly, not after a long time. Why? One gone forth, great king, is of few wishes, content, secluded, not in company, putting forth strenuous energy, free from attachment, without abode, of complete morality, of austere conduct, skilled in the practice of ascetic practices; for that reason, for one gone forth, whatever is to be done, all that succeeds quickly, not after a long time. Just as, great king, an iron bar without knots, even, well-washed, straight, spotless, well-prepared, goes rightly, just so indeed, great king, for one gone forth, whatever is to be done, all that succeeds quickly, not after a long time." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the right practice of householders and those gone forth is the third.

4.

The Question on the Fault of Practice

4. "Venerable Nāgasena, when the Bodhisatta performed the performance of austerities, there was no such beginning elsewhere, no exertion, no warfare against defilements, no destruction of the army of Death, no discernment of food, no performance of austerities; in such an endeavour, not having obtained any gratification, having neglected that very mind, he spoke thus: 'Yet I do not by this bitter performance of austerities attain any super-human achievement, any distinction of knowledge and vision worthy of the noble ones; could there be another path to enlightenment?' Having become disenchanted with that, having attained omniscience by another path, he again instructs and instigates disciples in that very practice.

For what reason, Venerable Nāgasena, does the Tathāgata instruct and instigate disciples in that very practice from which he himself became disenchanted and dispassionate?"

"Even then, great king, even now, that is the very practice; having proceeded in that very practice, the Bodhisatta attained omniscience. But moreover, great king, the Bodhisatta, making excessive effort, completely stopped food. By that stopping of food, weakness of mind arose for him. He, by that weakness, was not able to attain omniscience; he, partaking of just a little edible food, by that very practice, before long attained omniscience. That indeed, great king, is the practice for the attainment of omniscient knowledge for all Tathāgatas.

"Just as, great king, food is the support for all beings, and all beings dependent on food experience happiness, just so indeed, great king, that very practice is for the attainment of omniscient knowledge for all Tathāgatas. This, great king, is not the fault of the beginning, nor of exertion, nor of warfare against defilements, by which the Tathāgata at that time did not attain omniscient knowledge; rather this is the fault of the stopping of food; that practice is always prepared.

"Just as, great king, a man might travel a journey with excessive speed, and by that he might become paralysed or a cripple, unable to move on the surface of the earth. Is there indeed, great king, any fault of the great earth, by which that man became paralysed?" "No indeed, venerable sir; the great earth is always prepared, venerable sir; from where would there be fault in it? This is the fault of effort, by which that man became paralysed." "Just so indeed, great king, this is not the fault of the beginning, nor of exertion, nor of warfare against defilements, by which the Tathāgata at that time did not attain omniscient knowledge; rather this is the fault of the stopping of food; that practice is always prepared.

"Or else, great king, if a man were to wear a soiled cloth and he would not have it washed, this is not the fault of water; water is always prepared. This is the fault of the man. Just so indeed, great king, this is not the fault of the beginning, nor of exertion, nor of warfare against defilements, by which the Tathāgata at that time did not attain omniscient knowledge; rather this is the fault of the stopping of food; that practice is always prepared. Therefore the Tathāgata instructs and instigates disciples in that very practice. Thus indeed, great king, that practice is always prepared and blameless." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the fault of practice is the fourth.

5.

The Question on Returning to the Low Life

5. "Venerable Nāgasena, this Dispensation of the Tathāgata is great, essential, excellent, foremost, noble, incomparable, pure, spotless, white, and blameless; it is not proper to give the going forth to a householder just like that. Having trained a householder in one fruition, when he becomes a non-returner, then he should be given the going forth. Why? These wicked people, having gone forth in that pure Dispensation, having turned back, return to the lower life; by their coming back, this great multitude thinks thus: 'Surely, friends, this Dispensation of the ascetic Gotama must be hollow, since these turn back.' This is the reason here."

"Just as, great king, there might be a lake full of pure, spotless, cool water, and then whoever, being defiled, covered with dirt and mud, having gone to that lake, without bathing, might turn back still defiled - there, great king, which would people censure, the defiled one or the lake?" "The defiled one, venerable sir, people would censure: 'This one, having gone to the lake, without bathing, turned back still defiled. Will the lake itself bathe this one who does not wish to bathe? What is the fault of the lake?' Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata created the excellent lake of the Good Teaching, full of the excellent water of liberation: 'Whoever are defiled by the stain of mental defilements, conscious, intelligent beings, they, having bathed here, will wash away all mental defilements.' If anyone, having gone to that excellent lake of the Good Teaching, without bathing, still with defilements, having turned back, returns to the lower life, people will censure that very one: 'This one, having gone forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation, not having obtained support there, has returned to the lower life. Will the Conqueror's Dispensation itself awaken this one who does not practise? What is the fault of the Conqueror's Dispensation?'

Or else, great king, suppose a man, extremely ill, having seen a physician, a surgeon, skilled in the origin of diseases, whose work is unfailing and always successful, having not been treated, might turn back still with his illness - there, which would people censure, the sick one or the physician?" "The sick one, venerable sir, people would censure: 'This one, having seen a physician, a surgeon, skilled in the origin of diseases, whose work is unfailing and always successful, having not been treated, turned back still with his illness. Will the physician himself treat this one who does not get treated? What is the fault of the physician?'" "Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata placed inside the casket of the Dispensation the deathless medicine capable of appeasing the entire disease of all mental defilements: 'Whoever are afflicted by the disease of mental defilements, conscious, intelligent beings, they, having drunk this deathless medicine, will appease all disease of mental defilements.' If anyone, not having drunk that deathless medicine, still with defilements, having turned back, returns to the lower life, people will censure that very one: 'This one, having gone forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation, not having obtained support there, has returned to the lower life. Will the Conqueror's Dispensation itself awaken this one who does not practise? What is the fault of the Conqueror's Dispensation?'

Or else, great king, suppose a hungry man, having gone to a great, great meritorious food distribution, not having eaten that food, might turn back still hungry - there, which would people censure, the hungry one or the meritorious food?" "The hungry one, venerable sir, people would censure: 'This one, afflicted by hunger, having received meritorious food, not having eaten, turned back still hungry. Will the food itself enter the mouth of this one who does not eat? What is the fault of the food?'" "Just so indeed, great king, the Tathāgata placed inside the casket of the Dispensation the supremely noble, peaceful, safe, sublime, deathless, supremely sweet food of mindfulness of the body: 'Whoever are internally hungry with the hunger of mental defilements, with minds overcome by craving, conscious, intelligent beings, they, having eaten this food, will remove all craving in the existences of sensual pleasure, fine-material, and immaterial realms.' If anyone, not having eaten that food, still attached to craving, having turned back, returns to the lower life, people will censure that very one: 'This one, having gone forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation, not having obtained support there, has returned to the lower life. Will the Conqueror's Dispensation itself awaken this one who does not practise? What is the fault of the Conqueror's Dispensation?'

If, great king, the Tathāgata were to give the going forth to a householder trained in just one fruition, then this going forth would not be for the abandoning of mental defilements or for purification; there would be nothing to be done by the going forth. Just as, great king, a man, having had a lake dug with many hundreds of labours, might proclaim to an assembly thus: 'Let none of you who are defiled, sirs, enter this lake; let those who have washed away dust and dirt, who are pure, spotlessly clean, enter this lake.' Would there be anything to be done with that lake, great king, for those who have washed away dust and dirt, who are pure, spotlessly clean?" "No indeed, venerable sir; for whatever purpose they would approach that lake, that task has already been done elsewhere for them. What use is that lake to them?" "Just so indeed, great king, if the Tathāgata were to give the going forth to a householder trained in just one fruition, that task has already been done right there for them. What use is the going forth to them?

"Or else, great king, suppose a physician, a surgeon, who is devoted to sages by nature, who retains what he has heard of the sacred texts and their meanings, who is not a mere rationalist, who is skilled in the origin of diseases, whose work is unfailing and always successful, having gathered together medicine for the pacification of all diseases, were to proclaim to the assembly thus: 'Do not, sirs, let any who are sick approach me; let those who are free from sickness, who are healthy, approach me.' Would there, great king, be anything to be done by that physician for those who are free from sickness, who are healthy, who are complete, who are elated?" "No indeed, venerable sir, for the purpose for which they would approach that physician, that surgeon, that has already been done for them elsewhere; what have they to do with that physician?" "Just so indeed, great king, if the Tathāgata were to give the going forth to a householder who has already been disciplined in one fruit, that which was to be done for them has already been done right there; what have they to do with the going forth?

"Or else, great king, suppose some man, having had food prepared consisting of many hundreds of pots of cooked rice, were to proclaim to the assembly thus: 'Do not, sirs, let any who are hungry approach this food distribution; let those who have eaten well, who are satisfied, who are content, who are nourished, who are pleased, who are complete, approach this food distribution.' Would there, great king, be anything to be done with that food for those who have eaten, who are satisfied, who are content, who are nourished, who are pleased, who are complete?" "No indeed, venerable sir, for the purpose for which they would approach that food distribution, that has already been done for them elsewhere; what have they to do with that food distribution?" "Just so indeed, great king, if the Tathāgata were to give the going forth to a householder who has already been disciplined in one fruit, that which was to be done for them has already been done right there; what have they to do with the going forth?

"Moreover, great king, those who return to the lower life, they show five incomparable qualities of the Conqueror's Dispensation. Which five? They show the greatness of the plane, they show the state of being pure and spotless, they show the state of not associating with the evil, they show the state of being difficult to penetrate, they show the state of being protected by manifold restraint.

"How do they show the greatness of the plane? Just as, great king, a man who is poor, of low birth, showing no difference, declined in higher intelligence, having obtained a great kingdom, before long falls down, falls away, declines from fame, and is not able to hold the supremacy. What is the reason? Because of the greatness of the supremacy. Just so, great king, whoever, showing no difference, having not made merit, declined in higher intelligence, go forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation, they, being unable to maintain that noble and excellent going forth, before long, having fallen down, having fallen away, having declined from the Conqueror's Dispensation, return to the lower life; they are not able to maintain the Conqueror's Dispensation. What is the reason? Because of the greatness of the plane of the Conqueror's Dispensation. Thus they show the greatness of the plane.

"How do they show the state of being pure and spotless? Just as, great king, water scatters, disperses, and is destroyed on a lotus leaf, does not stay in place, and does not adhere. What is the reason? Because of the purity and spotlessness of the lotus. Just so, great king, whoever are fraudulent, deceitful, crooked, bent, and of wrong view go forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation, they, before long, having scattered, having dispersed, having been destroyed, not having remained, not having adhered, return to the lower life from the pure, spotless, thornless, white, noble, and excellent Dispensation. What is the reason? Because of the purity and spotlessness of the Conqueror's Dispensation. Thus they show the state of being pure and spotless.

"How do they show the state of not associating with the evil? Just as, great king, the great ocean does not associate with a dead corpse; whatever dead corpse there is in the great ocean, it quickly brings it to the shore or pushes it onto dry land. What is the reason? Because the great ocean is the abode of great beings. Just so, great king, whoever are evil, unrestrained, shameless, non-doers, with sunken energy, lazy, defiled, wicked people go forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation, they, before long, having departed from the Conqueror's Dispensation, from the abode of the great beings who are Worthy Ones, spotless, with mental corruptions eliminated, not having associated, return to the lower life. What is the reason? Because of the Conqueror's Dispensation not associating with the evil. Thus they show the state of not associating with the evil.

"How do they show the state of being difficult to penetrate? Just as, great king, whoever archers are unskilled, untrained, without craft, devoid of intelligence, being unable to pierce the tip of a hair, fall away and depart. What is the reason? Because of the smooth, subtle, and difficult-to-penetrate nature of the tip of a hair. Just so, great king, whoever people lacking wisdom, stupid, idiots, confused, and slow in progress go forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation, they, being unable to penetrate that supremely smooth and subtle penetration of the four truths, having fallen away and departed from the Conqueror's Dispensation, before long return to the lower life. What is the reason? Because of the supremely smooth, subtle, and difficult-to-penetrate nature of the truths. Thus they show the state of being difficult to penetrate.

"How do they show the state of being protected by manifold restraint? Just as, great king, some man, having gone to a great battlefield, surrounded on all sides by an enemy army from all directions, having seen people approaching with weapons in hand, frightened, draws back, turns back, and flees. What is the reason? Because of fear of guarding against many kinds of battle fronts. Just so indeed, great king, whatever evil ones, unrestrained, shameless, non-doers, impatient, fickle, wavering, insignificant, foolish people go forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation, they, being unable to protect the manifold training rules, having drawn back, having turned back, having fled, before long return to the lower life. What is the reason? Because of the state of being protected by manifold restraint of the Conqueror's Dispensation. Thus they show the state of being protected by manifold restraint.

"Also, great king, on a jasmine bush, the best of land-born plants, there are worm-eaten flowers; those buds, shrivelled, fall off right in between, and when those have fallen off, the jasmine bush is not called despised. Whatever flowers remain there, they properly pervade all directions with their fragrance. Just so indeed, great king, those who, having gone forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation, return to the lower life, they, like worm-eaten jasmine flowers in the Conqueror's Dispensation, devoid of beauty and fragrance, of colourless appearance and morality, are incapable of expansion; and by their returning to the lower life, the Conqueror's Dispensation is not called despised. Whatever monks remain there, they pervade the world with its gods with the fragrance of excellent morality.

"Also, great king, among healthy red rice, a rice variety called karumbhaka, having arisen, perishes right in between, and because of its perishing, the red rice is not called despised. Whatever rice remains there, that becomes fit for royal enjoyment. Just so indeed, great king, those who, having gone forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation, return to the lower life, they, like karumbhaka among red rice, not having grown in the Conqueror's Dispensation, not having attained full expansion, return to the lower life right in between; and by their returning to the lower life, the Conqueror's Dispensation is not called despised. Whatever monks remain there, they are suitable for arahantship.

"Also, great king, in a wish-fulfilling jewel gem, a rough portion arises, and because of that rough portion having arisen there, the jewel gem is not called despised. Whatever is pure of the jewel gem there, that brings delight to people. Just so indeed, great king, those who, having gone forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation, return to the lower life, they are rough outer bark in the Conqueror's Dispensation; and by their returning to the lower life, the Conqueror's Dispensation is not called despised. Whatever monks remain there, they are producers of delight for gods and humans.

"Also, great king, of red sandalwood of excellent birth, a portion becomes rotten and of little fragrance. By that, the red sandalwood is not called despised. Whatever is not rotten there, fragrant, that spreads and pervades all around. Just so indeed, great king, those who, having gone forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation, return to the lower life, they, like a rotten portion in the core of red sandalwood, are to be discarded in the Conqueror's Dispensation; and by their returning to the lower life, the Conqueror's Dispensation is not called despised. Whatever monks remain there, they anoint the world with its gods with the fragrance of excellent morality and sandalwood."

"Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, by this and that suitable, by this and that similar reason, the Conqueror's Dispensation has been brought to a faultless state and illuminated as supreme; even those returning to the lower life illuminate the supreme state of the Conqueror's Dispensation."

The question on returning to the low life is the fifth.

6.

The Question on the Worthy One Experiencing Feeling

6. "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'a Worthy One feels one feeling, bodily, not mental.' Is it then, venerable Nāgasena, that the Worthy One's mind, which proceeds in dependence on the body, there the Worthy One is without power, without mastery, not wielding control?" "Yes, great king." "That is not proper, venerable Nāgasena, that he is without power, without mastery, not wielding control over the body in which his own mind proceeds; even a bird, venerable sir, in whatever nest it dwells, there it is the lord, the master, wielding power."

"There are, great king, these ten states accompanying the body that pursue the body and revolve around the body from existence to existence. What are the ten? Cold, heat, hunger, thirst, defecation, urination, torpor, ageing, illness, death. These, great king, are the ten states accompanying the body that pursue the body and revolve around the body from existence to existence; there the Worthy One is without power, without mastery, not wielding control."

"Venerable Nāgasena, for what reason does command or supremacy not proceed over the body of a Worthy One? Tell me the reason for this." "Just as, great king, whatever beings are dependent on the earth, all of them, in dependence on the earth, walk, dwell, and make a livelihood; do they, great king, have command or supremacy over the earth?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, the mind of a Worthy One proceeds in dependence on the body, but command or supremacy does not proceed over the body of a Worthy One."

"Venerable Nāgasena, for what reason does a worldling feel both bodily and mental feeling?" "Because of undevelopment of mind, great king, a worldling feels both bodily and mental feeling. Just as, great king, a hungry, frightened bull might be tied to weak, feeble, small grass or a creeper; when that bull becomes agitated, then it departs together with the binding. Just so indeed, great king, for one with undeveloped mind, when feeling arises, it agitates the mind; the agitated mind bends the body, unbends it, makes it roll about. Then that one with undeveloped mind trembles, cries out, utters a fearful cry. This, great king, is the reason here, by which reason a worldling feels both bodily and mental feeling."

"But what is that reason, by which reason a Worthy One feels one feeling, bodily, not mental?" "The mind of a Worthy One, great king, is developed, well-developed, tamed, well-tamed, obedient, doing what is told. He, being touched by unpleasant feeling, firmly grasps 'impermanent,' he ties the mind to the pillar of concentration. That mind of his, tied to the pillar of concentration, does not tremble, does not waver, remains steady, undistracted. By the change and diffusion of feeling, his body bends, unbends, rolls about. This, great king, is the reason here, by which reason a Worthy One feels one feeling, bodily, not mental."

"Venerable Nāgasena, this indeed is a marvel in the world, that when the body is moving, the mind does not move. Tell me the reason for this." "Just as, great king, in a great, large tree endowed with trunk, branches and leaves, struck by the force of the wind, the branches move; does the trunk also move?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, a Worthy One, being touched by unpleasant feeling, firmly grasps 'impermanent,' he ties the mind to the pillar of concentration. That mind of his, tied to the pillar of concentration, does not tremble, does not waver, remains steady, undistracted. By the change and diffusion of feeling, his body bends, unbends, rolls about. But his mind does not tremble, does not waver, like the trunk of a great tree." "Wonderful, venerable Nāgasena, marvellous, venerable Nāgasena, such a lamp of the Teaching for all time has not been seen by me before."

The question on the Worthy One experiencing feeling is the sixth.

7.

The Question on Making Obstacles to Full Realization

7. "Venerable Nāgasena, here if any householder were to have committed an offence involving expulsion, and he at a later time were to go forth, and he himself would not know 'I have committed a householder's offence involving expulsion,' nor would anyone else tell him 'You have committed a householder's offence involving expulsion.' And if he were to proceed towards the truth, would there be full realization of the teaching for him?" "No indeed, great king." "For what reason, venerable sir?" "That which is the cause for his full realization of the teaching, that has been cut off for him; therefore there is no full realization of the teaching."

"Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'For one who knows there is remorse, when there is remorse there is obstruction, when the mind is obstructed there is no full realization of the teaching.' But for this one who does not know, in whom remorse has not arisen, who dwells with a peaceful mind, for what reason is there no full realization of the teaching? This question goes unevenly with unevenness; having considered, answer it."

"Does a seed, great king, grow in well-tilled, good soil, in a cleared field, in autumn, when well placed?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Would that same seed, great king, grow on the surface of a compact rock?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But why, great king, does that same seed grow in soil, why does it not grow on a compact rock?" "There is not, venerable sir, a cause for that seed's growing on a compact rock; without cause the seed does not grow." "Just so indeed, great king, that cause by which there would be full realization of the teaching for him, that cause has been cut off for him; without cause there is no full realization of the teaching.

"Or else, great king, sticks, clods, clubs, and mallets find a place on the earth; do those same sticks, clods, clubs, and mallets, great king, find a place in the sky?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But what, great king, is the reason here, by what reason do those same sticks, clods, clubs, and mallets find a place on the earth, by what reason do they not remain in the sky?" "There is not, venerable sir, a cause for those sticks, clods, clubs, and mallets to be established in space; without cause they do not remain." "Just so indeed, great king, the cause for full realization has been cut off for him by that fault; when the cause is uprooted, without cause there is no full realization.

"Or else, great king, fire burns on dry ground; does that same fire, great king, burn in water?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But what, great king, is the reason here, by what reason does that same fire burn on dry ground, by what reason does it not burn in water?" "There is not, venerable sir, a cause for fire's burning in water; without cause it does not burn." "Just so indeed, great king, the cause for full realization has been cut off for him by that fault; when the cause is uprooted, without cause there is no full realization of the teaching."

"Venerable Nāgasena, consider this matter again; there is no conviction of mind for me in this, that for one not knowing, when there is no remorse, there is obstruction; convince me by a reason." "Does deadly poison, great king, eaten by one not knowing, take away life?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, evil done even by one not knowing is an obstacle to full realization.

"Does fire, great king, burn one stepping on it not knowing?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, evil done even by one not knowing is an obstacle to full realization.

"Does a venomous snake, great king, having bitten one who does not know, take away life?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, evil done even by one not knowing is an obstacle to full realization.

"Is it not, great king, that the king of Kāliṅga, the ascetic Kolañña, surrounded by the seven treasures, having mounted the elephant treasure, going to visit families, even not knowing was not able to go above the seat of enlightenment? This, great king, is the reason here, by which reason evil done even by one not knowing is an obstacle to full realization." "What was spoken by the Conqueror, Venerable Nāgasena, the reason cannot be protested against; this is indeed its meaning, thus I accept it."

The question on making obstacles to full realization is the seventh.

8.

The Question on Immorality

8. "Venerable Nāgasena, what is the distinction between an immoral layman and an immoral ascetic, what is the difference? Do both of these have the same destination, is the result the same for both, or is there some difference?"

"There are, great king, these ten virtues by which an immoral ascetic exceeds an immoral layman by distinction, and by ten reasons he further purifies the offering.

"What are the ten virtues by which an immoral ascetic exceeds an immoral layman by distinction? Here, great king, an immoral ascetic is respectful towards the Buddha, is respectful towards the Teaching, is respectful towards the Community, is respectful towards his fellows in the holy life, he strives in recitation and questioning, he is one who hears much; even one with broken morality, great king, an immoral one who has gone to an assembly, sets up deportment, through fear of blame he guards bodily and verbal conduct, and his mind is directed towards striving, he has attained the state of a monk. Even when doing evil, great king, an immoral ascetic practises it concealed. Just as, great king, a married woman, having hidden, practises evil only in secret; just so indeed, great king, even when doing evil, an immoral ascetic practises it concealed. These, great king, are the ten virtues by which an immoral ascetic exceeds an immoral layman by distinction.

"By which ten reasons does he further purify the offering? By wearing the blameless armour he purifies the offering, by wearing the shaven mark of the sages' state he purifies the offering, by having entered the convention of the Community he purifies the offering, by having gone for refuge to the Buddha, the Teaching, and the Community he purifies the offering, by dwelling in the abode of striving he purifies the offering, by seeking one who bears the Conqueror's Dispensation he purifies the offering, by teaching the excellent Teaching he purifies the offering, by having the Teaching as island, destination, and final goal he purifies the offering, by having absolutely upright view that 'the Buddha is foremost' he purifies the offering, by undertaking the Observance he purifies the offering. By these ten reasons, great king, he further purifies the offering.

"For even one who has completely failed, great king, an immoral ascetic purifies the offering of donors. Just as, great king, water, even very thick, removes mud, mire, dust, and dirt; just so indeed, great king, even one who has completely failed, an immoral ascetic purifies the offering of donors.

"Or else, great king, just as hot water, even very little, extinguishes a blazing great mass of fire, just so indeed, great king, even one who has completely failed, an immoral ascetic purifies the offering of donors.

"Or else, great king, just as food, even tasteless, removes hunger and weakness, just so indeed, great king, even one who has completely failed, an immoral ascetic purifies the offering of donors.

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Tathāgata, the god above gods, in the explanation of the Analysis of Offerings, the excellent seal of the Middle Collection:

"Wonderful, Venerable Nāgasena, marvellous, Venerable Nāgasena, we asked just so much a question, and you, making it clear with similes and reasons, made it sweet as the Deathless, fit for hearing. Just as, venerable sir, a cook or a cook's pupil, having obtained just so much meat, having prepared it with various ingredients, makes it fit for the king's enjoyment; just so indeed, Venerable Nāgasena, we asked just so much a question, and you, having made it clear with similes and reasons, made it sweet as the Deathless, fit for hearing."

The question on immorality is the eighth.

9.

The Question on Beings and Souls in Water

9. "Venerable Nāgasena, this water being heated in fire hisses, sizzles, makes a noise in manifold ways. What indeed, venerable Nāgasena, does the water live? Does it make a noise while playing, or does it make a noise being oppressed by something else?" "No indeed, great king, water does not live; there is no soul or being in water. But, great king, due to the greatness of the force of the heat of fire, water hisses, sizzles, makes a noise in manifold ways."

"Venerable Nāgasena, here some sectarians, thinking 'water lives,' having rejected cold water, having heated water, consume it bit by bit. They censure and despise you, saying 'The ascetics, disciples of the Sakyan, are harming a living being with one faculty.' Dispel, remove, clear away that censure and contempt of theirs." "No indeed, great king, water does not live; there is not, great king, a soul or being in water. But, great king, due to the greatness of the force of the heat of fire, water hisses, sizzles, makes a noise in manifold ways.

"Just as, great king, water that has gone into pools, lakes, rivers, reservoirs, tanks, caves, crevices, wells, low-lying areas, and ponds is exhausted and goes to utter elimination due to the greatness of the force of wind and heat, does the water there hiss, sizzle, make a noise in manifold ways?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "If, great king, water were to live, there too water would make a noise. By this reason too, great king, know that 'there is no soul or being in water; due to the greatness of the force of the heat of fire, water hisses, sizzles, makes a noise in manifold ways.'

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a further reason that 'there is no soul or being in water; due to the greatness of the force of the heat of fire, water makes a noise.' But when, great king, water mixed with rice grains, having gone into a vessel, is covered and placed on a fireplace, does the water there make a noise?" "No indeed, venerable sir, it is still, very peaceful." "But that same water, great king, having gone into a vessel, when fire is kindled and it is placed on a fireplace, is the water there still, very peaceful?" "No indeed, venerable sir, it moves, is agitated, stirs, becomes turbid, becomes full of waves, goes up and down, in all directions, rises up, falls down, becomes covered with foam." Why then, great king, does that natural water not move and is very peaceful, but why does that which has gone to fire move, become agitated, stir, become turbid, become full of waves, go up and down, in all directions, rise up, fall down, become covered with foam?" "Natural water, venerable sir, does not move, but water that has been heated by fire, due to the greatness of the force of the heat of fire, hisses, sizzles, makes a noise in manifold ways." "By this reason too, great king, know that 'there is no soul or being in water; due to the greatness of the force of the heat of fire, water makes a noise.'

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a further reason: there is no soul or being in water; due to the greatness of the force of the heat of fire, water makes a noise. Is there, great king, water in house after house, having gone into water jars, covered?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Does that water, great king, move, become agitated, stir, become turbid, become full of waves, go up and down, in all directions, rise up, fall down, become covered with foam?" "No indeed, venerable sir, that natural water having gone into a water jar is still."

"But have you heard before, great king, that 'in the great ocean water moves, becomes agitated, stirs, becomes turbid, becomes full of waves, goes up and down, in all directions, rises up, falls down, becomes covered with foam, having surged forward and having receded, strikes the shore, makes a noise in manifold ways'?" "Yes, venerable sir, I have heard this before and have seen it before: 'in the great ocean water rises up into the sky even a hundred cubits, even two hundred cubits.'" "Why, great king, does water having gone into a water jar not move and not make a noise, but why does water in the great ocean move and make a noise?" "Due to the greatness of the force of the wind, venerable sir, water in the great ocean moves and makes a noise; water having gone into a water jar, not struck by anything, does not move and does not make a noise." "Just as, great king, due to the greatness of the force of the wind, water in the great ocean moves and makes a noise, just so due to the greatness of the force of the heat of fire, water makes a noise."

"Is it not, great king, that they cover a dry drum-head with dry cow-hide?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Is there, great king, a soul or being in the drum?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But why, great king, does the drum make a noise?" "By the appropriate effort of a woman or a man, venerable sir." "Just as, great king, by the appropriate effort of a woman or a man the drum makes a noise, just so due to the greatness of the force of the heat of fire, water makes a noise. By this reason too, great king, know that 'there is no soul or being in water; due to the greatness of the force of the heat of fire, water makes a noise.'"

"First, great king, I have a question to ask you, thus this question will be well determined. Does water, great king, make a noise when being heated in all vessels, or does it make a noise when being heated only in some vessels?" "No indeed, venerable sir, water does not make a noise when being heated in all vessels; water makes a noise when being heated only in some vessels." "If so, great king, you have abandoned your own doctrine, you have come back to my domain; there is no soul or being in water. If, great king, water were to make a noise when being heated in all vessels, it would be proper to say 'water is alive.' For water, great king, is not twofold - that which makes a noise is alive, that which does not make a noise is not alive. If, great king, water were alive, when great noble elephants with massive bodies, in rut, having drawn up water with their trunks, having put it in their mouths, making it enter their bellies, that water too, being squeezed between their teeth, would make a noise. Even great ships of a hundred cubits, heavy, laden, filled with many hundreds of thousands of loads, travel in the great ocean; the water being squeezed by them too would make a noise. Even very great fish with bodies of many hundreds of yojanas - timi, timiṅgala, timirapiṅgala - submerged inside, dwelling in the great ocean as their place of residence, drink and blow out great streams of water; that water too, being squeezed between their teeth and in their bellies, would make a noise. But because, great king, water oppressed by such and such great oppressions does not make a noise, therefore too there is no soul or being in water; thus, great king, remember this."

"Excellent, venerable Nāgasena, the question that came with a fault has been analysed with a fitting analysis. Just as, venerable Nāgasena, a very costly jewel gem, having reached a clever teacher, a skilled, trained gem-cutter, would obtain fame, praise, and commendation; or a pearl gem reaching a pearl-worker, or a cloth gem reaching a cloth-worker, or red sandalwood reaching a perfumer, would obtain fame, praise, and commendation. Just so indeed, venerable Nāgasena, the question that came with a fault has been analysed with a fitting analysis; thus I accept this as true."

The question on beings and souls in water is the ninth.

The Chapter on the Buddha is first.

In this chapter there are nine questions.

2.

The Chapter on the Absence of Obsession

1.

The Question on Absence of Obsession

1. "Venerable Nāgasena, this too was spoken by the Blessed One: 'Monks, dwell delighting in the absence of obsession, taking pleasure in the absence of obsession.' What is that absence of obsession?" "The fruition of stream-entry, great king, is absence of obsession; the fruition of once-returning is absence of obsession; the fruition of non-returning is absence of obsession; the fruition of arahantship is absence of obsession."

"If, venerable Nāgasena, the fruition of stream-entry is absence of obsession, the fruition of once-returning, non-returning, and arahantship is absence of obsession, then why do these monks recite and interrogate discourse, mixed prose and verse, explanation, verse, inspired utterance, thus-it-is-said, birth story, wonderful phenomena, catechism, are occupied with new construction work and with giving and with veneration - are they not doing action rejected by the Conqueror?"

"Those monks, great king, who recite and interrogate discourse, mixed prose and verse, explanation, verse, inspired utterance, thus-it-is-said, birth story, wonderful phenomena, catechism, are occupied with new construction work and with giving and with veneration - all of them do so for the attainment of absence of obsession. Those, great king, who are pure by intrinsic nature, who have formerly cultivated mastery, they become without obsession in a single moment of consciousness. But those monks who have great defilement, they become without obsession by these practices.

"Just as, great king, one man, having planted seed in a field, according to his own strength and energy, without a fence and wall, might harvest the grain; another man, having planted seed in a field, having entered the forest, having cut sticks and branches, having made a fence and wall, might harvest the grain. Whatever search for a fence and wall there is for him there, that is for the sake of grain. Just so indeed, great king, those who are pure by intrinsic nature, who have formerly cultivated mastery, they become without obsession in a single moment of consciousness, like a man harvesting grain without a fence and wall. But those monks who have great defilement, they become without obsession by these practices, like a man harvesting grain having made a fence and wall.

"Or else, great king, suppose there were a cluster of fruit at the top of a very great mango tree, then whoever possessing supernormal power, having come there, might take its fruit; but whoever there without supernormal power, he, having cut sticks and creepers, having tied a ladder, having climbed that tree by it, might take the fruit. Whatever search for a ladder there is for him there, that is for the sake of fruit. Just so indeed, great king, those who are pure by intrinsic nature, who have formerly cultivated mastery, they become without obsession in a single moment of consciousness, like one possessing supernormal power taking tree fruit. But those monks who have great defilement, they fully realise the truths by this practice, like a man taking tree fruit by a ladder.

"Or else, great king, one man having a legal case, going alone to the master, accomplishes his purpose. One wealthy man, by the power of wealth, having increased his following, accomplishes his purpose by the following. Whatever search for a following there is for him there, that is for the sake of purpose. Just so indeed, great king, those who are pure by intrinsic nature, who have formerly cultivated mastery, they attain mastery in the six direct knowledges in a single moment of consciousness, like a man alone accomplishing success of purpose. But those monks who have great defilement, they accomplish the goal of asceticism by these practices, like a man accomplishing success of purpose by a following.

"Recitation too, great king, is of great service; interrogation too is of great service; new construction work too is of great service; giving too is of great service; veneration too is of great service in those various duties. Just as, great king, a man serving the king, having done favours with ministers, soldiers, troops, doorkeepers, bodyguards, and members of the assembly - when his duty arrives, all of them are helpful. Just so indeed, great king, recitation too is of great service; interrogation too is of great service; new construction work too is of great service; giving too is of great service; veneration too is of great service in those various duties. If, great king, all were pure by birth, there would be nothing to be done by instruction. But because, great king, there is something to be done by hearing, the Elder Sāriputta, great king, having accumulated wholesome roots from an immeasurable incalculable aeon onwards, having gone to the summit of wisdom, even he, without hearing, was not able to attain the elimination of mental corruptions. Therefore, great king, hearing is of great service, likewise recitation and interrogation too. Therefore recitation and interrogation too are reckoned as absence of obsession." "The question has been well elucidated, venerable Nāgasena; thus I accept this as true."

The question on absence of obsession is the first.

2.

The Question on the State of One Who Eliminated the Mental Corruptions

2. "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'whoever is a layman who has attained arahantship, there are only two destinations for him, no other: on that very day he either goes forth or attains final nibbāna. That day cannot be passed beyond.' If, venerable Nāgasena, on that day he should not obtain a teacher or a preceptor or bowl and robes, would that Worthy One go forth by himself or would he pass beyond the day, or would some other Worthy One possessing supernormal power, having come, give him the going forth or would he attain final nibbāna?" "That Worthy One, great king, would not go forth by himself; going forth by himself, he commits theft; nor would he pass beyond the day; whether or not another Worthy One's coming might occur, on that very day he would attain final nibbāna." "If so, venerable Nāgasena, the peaceful state of arahantship is abandoned, by which there is the taking away of life for one who has attained it."

"Abnormal, great king, is the layman's outward sign; in the abnormal outward sign, due to the weakness of the outward sign, a layman who has attained arahantship on that very day either goes forth or attains final nibbāna. This, great king, is not the fault of arahantship; this is indeed the fault of the layman's outward sign, that is to say, the weakness of the outward sign.

"Just as, great king, food, which protects the life span and guards the life of all beings, for one with an abnormal stomach, with slow and weak digestion, through non-digestion takes away life. This, great king, is not the fault of the food; this is indeed the fault of the stomach, that is to say, the weakness of the digestive fire. Just so indeed, great king, in the abnormal outward sign, due to the weakness of the outward sign, a layman who has attained arahantship on that very day either goes forth or attains final nibbāna. This, great king, is not the fault of arahantship; this is indeed the fault of the layman's outward sign, that is to say, the weakness of the outward sign.

"Or else, great king, just as a small blade of grass, when a heavy stone is placed upon it, due to weakness, having broken, falls. Just so indeed, great king, a layman who has attained arahantship, being unable to maintain arahantship with that outward sign, on that very day either goes forth or attains final nibbāna.

"Or else, great king, just as a man who is powerless, weak, of low birth, of little merit, having obtained a very great kingdom, in a moment falls down, falls away, draws back, and is not able to maintain the sovereignty; just so indeed, great king, a layman who has attained arahantship is not able to maintain arahantship with that outward sign; for that reason, on that very day he either goes forth or attains final nibbāna." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the state of one who eliminated the mental corruptions is the second.

3.

The Question on the Forgetfulness of One Who Eliminated the Mental Corruptions

3. "Venerable Nāgasena, is there forgetfulness for a Worthy One?" "Worthy Ones, great king, are free from forgetfulness; there is no forgetfulness for Worthy Ones." "But, venerable sir, would a Worthy One commit an offence?" "Yes, great king." "In what case?" "In building a hut, great king, in matchmaking, at the improper time with the perception of proper time, when invited to admonish with the perception of not being invited to admonish, when it is not leftover with the perception of leftover."

"Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'those who commit an offence, they commit it for two reasons: either through disrespect or through not knowing.' But indeed, venerable sir, is there disrespect for a Worthy One, that a Worthy One commits an offence?" "No indeed, great king."

"If, Venerable Nāgasena, a Worthy One commits an offence, and there is no disrespect for a Worthy One, then there is forgetfulness for a Worthy One?" "There is not, great king, forgetfulness for a Worthy One, yet a Worthy One commits an offence."

"If so, venerable sir, convince me by a reason; what is the reason there?" "There are these two, great king, mental defilements: worldly fault and fault by regulation. What, great king, is worldly fault? The ten unwholesome courses of action - this is called worldly fault. What is fault by regulation? That which in the world is unsuitable and not becoming for ascetics, but blameless for householders. Therein the Blessed One lays down a training rule for disciples: 'not to be transgressed for life.' Eating at the improper time, great king, is blameless for the world, but that is a fault in the Conqueror's Dispensation. Damaging growing plants, great king, is blameless for the world, but that is a fault in the Conqueror's Dispensation. Joking in water, great king, is blameless for the world, but that is a fault in the Conqueror's Dispensation. Thus such and such things, great king, are faults in the Conqueror's Dispensation - this is called fault by regulation.

"One who has eliminated the mental corruptions is incapable of transgressing a worldly fault; that which is a mental defilement, a fault by regulation, that he might commit through not knowing. It is not within the domain, great king, of a certain Worthy One to know everything; for he does not have the power to know everything. Unknown, great king, to a Worthy One are the names and clans of women and men; the path too on the earth is unknown to him; only liberation, great king, would a certain Worthy One know; a Worthy One possessing the six higher knowledges would know his own domain; the omniscient one, great king, only the Tathāgata knows everything." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the forgetfulness of one who eliminated the mental corruptions is the third.

4.

The Question on Absence in the World

4. "Venerable Nāgasena, in the world Buddhas are seen, Individually Enlightened Ones are seen, disciples of the Tathāgata are seen, universal monarchs are seen, sub-kings are seen, gods and humans are seen, the wealthy are seen, the poor are seen, the fortunate are seen, the ill-fated are seen, the female organ become manifest in a man is seen, the male organ become manifest in a woman is seen, well-done and wrongly-done action is seen, beings who experience the results of good and evil actions are seen, there are in the world beings born in eggs, born in wombs, born in moisture, spontaneously born, there are beings footless, two-footed, four-footed, many-footed, there are in the world demons, goblins, kumbhaṇḍas, titans, dānavas, gandhabbas, ghosts, sprites, there are kinnaras, great serpents, nāgas, supaṇṇas, accomplished ones, sorcerers, there are elephants, horses, cattle, buffaloes, camels, donkeys, goats, wild goats, deer, pigs, lions, tigers, panthers, bears, wolves, hyenas, dogs, jackals, there are birds of many kinds, there is gold, silver, pearls, gems, conch shells, stones, coral, rubies, cat's eye gems, lapis lazuli, diamonds, crystal, black metal, copper, lead, bronze, there is linen, silk, cotton, hempen, hemp, woollen blanket, there is rice, paddy, barley, millet, kudrūsa, varaka, wheat, mung beans, black beans, sesame, horse gram, there is the odour of roots, the odour of heartwood, the odour of softwood, the odour of bark, the odour of leaves, the odour of flowers, the odour of fruits, the odour of all things, there are grass, creepers, shrubs, trees, medicinal plants, large trees, rivers, mountains, oceans, fish and turtles - everything exists in the world. What, venerable sir, does not exist in the world, tell me that."

"There are, great king, these three things that do not exist in the world. What three? Whether conscious or unconscious, there is nothing free from ageing and death in the world, there is no permanence of activities, there is no finding of a being in the ultimate reality - these, great king, are the three things that do not exist in the world." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on absence in the world is the fourth.

5.

The Question on What is Not Born of Action and so on

5. "Venerable Nāgasena, in the world things produced by kamma are seen, things produced by cause are seen, things produced by season are seen; tell me what in the world is not born of kamma, not born of cause, not born of season." "There are, great king, two things in the world not born of kamma, not born of cause, not born of season. Which two? Space, great king, is not born of kamma, not born of cause, not born of season; Nibbāna, great king, is not born of kamma, not born of cause, not born of season. These, great king, are the two not born of kamma, not born of cause, not born of season."

"Do not, Venerable Nāgasena, treat the Conqueror's word with contempt, do not answer the question without knowing." "What indeed, great king, do I say, that you speak to me thus: 'Do not, Venerable Nāgasena, treat the Conqueror's word with contempt, do not answer the question without knowing'?" "Venerable Nāgasena, it is proper to say this much: 'Space is not born of kamma, not born of cause, not born of season.' But, Venerable Nāgasena, by many hundreds of reasons the path for the realisation of Nibbāna has been declared by the Blessed One for disciples, and yet you say thus: 'Nibbāna is not born of cause.'" "True, great king, by many hundreds of reasons the path for the realisation of Nibbāna has been declared by the Blessed One for disciples, but no cause for the arising of Nibbāna has been declared."

"Here, Venerable Nāgasena, we are entering from darkness into greater darkness, from forest into denser forest, from thicket into denser thicket, inasmuch as there is a cause for the realisation of Nibbāna, but there is no cause for the arising of that state. If, Venerable Nāgasena, there is a cause for the realisation of Nibbāna, then a cause for the arising of Nibbāna should also be expected.

"Just as, Venerable Nāgasena, a son has a father, by that reason a father of the father should also be expected. Just as a pupil has a teacher, by that reason a teacher of the teacher should also be expected. Just as a sprout has a seed, by that reason a seed of the seed should also be expected. Just so indeed, Venerable Nāgasena, if there is a cause for the realisation of Nibbāna, by that reason a cause for the arising of Nibbāna should also be expected.

"Just as when there is a top of a tree or a creeper, by that reason there is also a middle and also a root. Just so indeed, Venerable Nāgasena, if there is a cause for the realisation of Nibbāna, by that reason a cause for the arising of Nibbāna should also be expected."

"Nibbāna, great king, is not to be produced, therefore no cause for the arising of Nibbāna has been declared." "Come now, Venerable Nāgasena, having shown a reason, convince me by a reason, so that I may know: there is a cause for the realisation of Nibbāna, there is no cause for the arising of Nibbāna."

"If so, great king, apply your ear attentively, listen well, I will tell the reason there. Could, great king, a man by his natural power go from here to the Himalaya, the king of mountains?" "Yes, venerable sir." "But could that man, great king, by his natural power bring the Himalaya, the king of mountains, here?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, it is possible to declare the path for the realisation of Nibbāna, it is not possible to show a cause for the arising of Nibbāna.

"Could, great king, a man by his natural power, having crossed the great ocean by boat, go to the farther shore?" "Yes, venerable sir." "But could that man, great king, by his natural power bring the farther shore of the great ocean here?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, it is possible to declare the path for the realisation of Nibbāna, it is not possible to show a cause for the arising of Nibbāna. Why? Because of the unconditioned nature of that state."

"Is Nibbāna unconditioned, Venerable Nāgasena?" "Yes, great king, Nibbāna is unconditioned, not made by anyone. Nibbāna, great king, is not to be said to be arisen or unarisen or to be produced or past or future or present or cognizable by eye or cognizable by ear or cognizable by nose or cognizable by tongue or cognizable by body." "If, Venerable Nāgasena, Nibbāna is not arisen, not unarisen, not to be produced, not past, not future, not present, not cognizable by eye, not cognizable by ear, not cognizable by nose, not cognizable by tongue, not cognizable by body, then, Venerable Nāgasena, you point to Nibbāna as a non-existent phenomenon: 'There is no Nibbāna.' "There is, great king, Nibbāna; Nibbāna is cognizable by mind. A noble disciple rightly practising, with a pure mind, sublime, straight, unobstructed, spiritual, sees Nibbāna."

"But what kind is that Nibbāna, venerable sir? Convince me by reasons that can be illuminated by similes, just as an existing phenomenon can be illuminated by similes." "Is there, great king, what is called wind?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Come now, great king, show the wind by colour or by shape, whether subtle or gross or long or short." "It is not possible, Venerable Nāgasena, to show the wind; the wind does not lend itself to being held in the hand or to being crushed; but yet there is wind." "If, great king, it is not possible to show the wind, then there is no wind?" "I know, Venerable Nāgasena, that wind exists; it has entered my heart, but I am not able to show the wind." "Just so indeed, great king, there is Nibbāna, but it is not possible to show Nibbāna by colour or by shape." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, the simile has been well shown, the reason well explained; thus I accept this as true: 'There is Nibbāna.'"

The question on what is not born of action and so on is the fifth.

6.

The Question on What is Born of Action and so on

6. "Venerable Nāgasena, which of these are born of kamma, which are born of cause, which are born of season, which are not born of kamma, not born of cause, not born of season?" "Whatever beings, great king, are conscious, all of them are born of kamma; fire and all species of seed are born of cause; earth and mountains and water and wind, all of them are born of season; space and Nibbāna, these two are not born of kamma, not born of cause, not born of season. But Nibbāna, great king, is not to be said to be born of kamma or born of cause or born of season or arisen or unarisen or to be produced or past or future or present or cognizable by eye or cognizable by ear or cognizable by nose or cognizable by tongue or cognizable by body; but moreover, great king, Nibbāna is cognizable by mind, which the noble disciple rightly practising sees with purified knowledge." "Delightful, Venerable Nāgasena, the question has been well determined, free from doubt, gone to the ultimate, doubt has been cut off; you have approached the most excellent of the excellent leaders of groups."

The question on what is born of action and so on is the sixth.

7.

The Question on the Demon

7. "Venerable Nāgasena, are there in the world beings called demons?" "Yes, great king, there are in the world beings called demons." "But do those demons, venerable sir, pass away from that realm?" "Yes, great king, those demons pass away from that realm." "But why, Venerable Nāgasena, is the body of those dead demons not seen, and the smell of a corpse does not blow?" "It is seen, great king, the body of dead demons, and the smell of a corpse blows from them. The body of dead demons, great king, is seen in the form of an insect, or is seen in the form of a worm, or is seen in the form of an ant, or is seen in the form of a grasshopper, or is seen in the form of a snake, or is seen in the form of a scorpion, or is seen in the form of a centipede, or is seen in the form of a bird, or is seen in the form of a beast." "Who indeed, Venerable Nāgasena, another being asked this question could answer it except by one wise like you?"

The question on the demon is the seventh.

8.

The Question on the Complete Training Rules

8. "Venerable Nāgasena, those who were the ancient teachers of physicians, as follows: Nārada, Dhammantarī, Aṅgīrasa, Kapila, Kaṇḍarāggi, Sāma, Atula, Pubbakaccāyana - all these teachers, having known once only the arising of diseases, the source, the intrinsic nature, the origination, the medical treatment, the function, and the success and failure, all that without remainder, thinking 'this many diseases will arise in this body,' all at once making a comprehensive grasp, composed a treatise. All these were not omniscient. Why then did the Tathāgata, being omniscient, having known future action by the Buddha's knowledge, having determined 'in such and such a case such and such a training rule will have to be laid down,' not lay down the training rule completely, but laid down the training rule for disciples on each occasion as it arose, when there was disgrace, when the fault was obvious, when it was widespread, when it had gone far and wide, when people were grumbling, at each and every time?"

"This was known, great king, to the Tathāgata: 'At this time, for these human beings, more than one hundred and fifty training rules will have to be laid down.' But this occurred to the Tathāgata: 'If I were to lay down more than one hundred and fifty training rules all at once, the great multitude would fall into fear, thinking "Much is to be guarded here; difficult indeed, friend, is it to go forth in the Dispensation of the ascetic Gotama." Even those wishing to go forth would not go forth, and they would not believe my word; those human beings not believing would become ones going to realms of misery.' Thus, 'On each occasion as it arises, having informed them through the teaching of the Teaching, when the fault is obvious, I shall lay down the training rule.'" "Wonderful, Venerable Nāgasena, of the Buddhas! Marvellous, Venerable Nāgasena, of the Buddhas! How great is the Tathāgata's omniscient knowledge! Thus it is, Venerable Nāgasena, this meaning was well shown by the Tathāgata. Having heard 'much is to be trained in here,' fear would arise in beings; not even one would go forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation. Thus I accept this as true."

The question on the complete training rules is the eighth.

9.

The Question on the Sun's Heat

9. "Venerable Nāgasena, does this sun shine intensely at all times, or does it shine weakly at some times?" "At all times, great king, the sun shines intensely; it does not shine weakly at any time." "If, venerable Nāgasena, the sun shines intensely at all times, why then does the sun sometimes shine intensely and sometimes shine weakly?" "There are, great king, these four diseases of the sun, oppressed by one or other of which diseases the sun shines weakly. Which four? Cloud, great king, is a disease of the sun; oppressed by that disease the sun shines weakly. Frost, great king, is a disease of the sun; oppressed by that disease the sun shines weakly. Rain-cloud, great king, is a disease of the sun; oppressed by that disease the sun shines weakly. Rāhu, great king, is a disease of the sun; oppressed by that disease the sun shines weakly. These, great king, are the four diseases of the sun, oppressed by one or other of which diseases the sun shines weakly." "Wonderful, venerable Nāgasena, marvellous, venerable Nāgasena, that even for the sun, so endowed with radiance, disease will arise; how much more then for other beings. There is not, venerable sir, this classification by another except by one wise like you."

The question on the sun's heat is the ninth.

10.

The Question on the Kathina Heat

10. "Venerable Nāgasena, why does the sun shine intensely in winter, but not so in summer?" "In summer, great king, the muddy dirt is undisturbed, dust particles stirred by the wind rise up into the sky, clouds in the sky are very thick, and a great wind blows excessively; all these various elements combined together obstruct the sun's rays; therefore in summer the sun shines weakly.

"In winter, however, great king, the earth below is cooled, a great rain cloud is present above, the muddy dirt is calmed, dust moves very gently in the sky, the sky is free from clouds, and the wind blows very gently; with the cessation of these, the sun's rays become pure, and the heat of the sun freed from obstruction shines as if exceedingly. This, great king, is the reason here, by which reason the sun shines intensely in winter, but not so in summer." "Freed from all calamities, venerable sir, the sun shines intensely; accompanied by clouds and so on, it does not shine intensely."

The question on the kathina heat is the tenth.

The Chapter on Absence of Obsession is the second.

In this chapter there are ten questions.

3.

The Chapter about Vessantara

1.

The Question on Vessantara

1. "Venerable Nāgasena, do all Bodhisattas give away their children and wife, or was children and wife given only by King Vessantara?" "All Bodhisattas, great king, give away their children and wife, not only by King Vessantara was children and wife given." "And yet, venerable Nāgasena, do they give with their consent?" "The wife, great king, consented, but the children lamented due to their childishness; if they had known the meaning, they too would have rejoiced, they would not have lamented."

"A difficult thing, venerable Nāgasena, was done by the Bodhisatta, in that he gave his own legitimate dear sons to the brahmin for the purpose of slavery.

"This second thing too is more difficult than the difficult, in that he, having bound his own legitimate dear sons, young children, tender ones, with a creeper, looked on with equanimity seeing them being stroked with the creeper by that brahmin.

"This third thing too is more difficult than the difficult, in that he, when the children having freed themselves from the bonds by their own strength came back filled with fear, again bound them with a creeper and gave them away.

"This fourth thing too is more difficult than the difficult, in that he did not console the children lamenting 'This demon, dear father, is taking us away to eat' with 'Do not be afraid.'

"This fifth thing too is more difficult than the difficult, in that he did not accept thus the entreaty of the prince Jālī who, weeping, having fallen at his feet, was begging 'Enough, dear father, turn back Kaṇhājinā, I myself will go with the demon, let the demon eat me.'

"This sixth thing too is more difficult than the difficult, in that he did not show compassion to the prince Jālī who was lamenting 'Surely your heart, dear father, is like a stone, in that you, looking at us suffering, being led away by a demon in the great forest devoid of humans, did not prevent him.'

"This seventh thing too is more difficult than the difficult, in that when the children were led away by that terrifying, dreadful one and had gone out of sight, his heart did not split into a hundred or a thousand pieces. What has a human being desiring merit to do with causing suffering to others? Should not one's own gift be given?"

"Because of doing the difficult, great king, the fame of the Bodhisatta has risen up in the ten-thousand-fold world system among gods and humans; the gods proclaim it in the heavenly abode, the titans proclaim it in the titan abode, the garuḷas proclaim it in the garuḷa abode, the serpents proclaim it in the serpent abode, the demons proclaim it in the demon abode; gradually that fame has reached in succession from then until now here to our time. Are we, sitting here praising and examining that gift, discussing whether it was well-given or badly given? And this fame, great king, shows ten qualities of the subtle, wise, learned, intelligent Bodhisattas. What are the ten? Freedom from greed, freedom from attachment, generosity, abandoning, non-returning, subtlety, greatness, difficulty of understanding, rarity, and incomparability of the Buddha's Teaching - this fame, great king, shows these ten qualities of the subtle, wise, learned, intelligent Bodhisattas."

"Venerable Nāgasena, one who gives a gift having caused suffering to another, does that gift have pleasant results and lead to heaven?" "Yes, great king, what is there to say?" "Come now, venerable Nāgasena, show me a reason." "Here, great king, suppose some ascetic or brahmin is moral, of good character, and he might be paralysed or a cripple or afflicted with some disease; whoever desiring merit, having placed him on a vehicle, might convey him to the place he wished for - would any happiness arise for that man on that account, would that action lead to heaven?" "Yes, venerable sir, what is there to say? That man, venerable sir, might obtain an elephant vehicle or a horse vehicle or a chariot vehicle, on land a land vehicle, in water a water vehicle, among gods a divine vehicle, among humans a human vehicle; he would be reborn in existence after existence with what is suitable and appropriate; suitable and appropriate happinesses would arise for him; from a fortunate world he would go to a fortunate world; by that very outflow of action, having ascended the vehicle of supernormal power, he would reach the wished-for city of Nibbāna." "If so, great king, a gift given by causing suffering to another has pleasant results and leads to heaven, in that that man, having caused suffering to oxen, experiences such happiness.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a reason how a gift given through causing suffering to others results in happiness and leads to heaven. Here, great king, suppose any king, having collected righteous taxes from the country, were to give a gift by the exercise of authority, would that king, great king, on that account experience any happiness, that gift leading to heaven?" "Yes, venerable sir, what need is there to say? On that account, venerable sir, that king would obtain many hundreds of thousands of times more. He would become a king above kings, a god above gods, a Brahmā above Brahmās, an ascetic above ascetics, a brahmin above brahmins, a Worthy One above Worthy Ones." "If so, great king, a gift given through causing suffering to others results in happiness and leads to heaven, since that king, having oppressed the people with taxes, by the gift given, experiences such further happiness and fame."

"Excessive giving, venerable Nāgasena, was given by King Vessantara, in that he gave his own wife to another for the purpose of being his wife, he gave his own legitimate sons to a brahmin for the purpose of being slaves. Excessive giving, venerable Nāgasena, is blamed and censured by the wise in the world. Just as, venerable Nāgasena, by an excessive load the axle of a cart breaks, by an excessive load a boat sinks, by excessive eating food is digested abnormally, by excessive rain grain perishes, by excessive giving one comes to the destruction of wealth, by excessive heat the earth is scorched, by excessive lust one becomes mad, by excessive hate one becomes fit to be killed, by excessive delusion one falls into calamity, by excessive greed one undergoes seizure as a thief, by excessive fear one is obstructed, by excessive fullness a river overflows, by excessive wind a thunderbolt falls, by excessive fire cooked rice boils over, by excessive wandering one does not live long. Just so indeed, venerable Nāgasena, excessive giving is blamed and censured by the wise in the world; excessive giving, venerable Nāgasena, was given by King Vessantara; no fruit should be expected from that."

"Excessive giving, great king, is praised, extolled, and commended by the wise in the world; whoever gives whatever kind of gift, the giver of excessive gifts attains fame in the world. Just as, great king, a divine forest root, due to its extreme excellence, even when grasped does not show itself to other people standing within arm's reach; a medicine, due to its extreme potency, is an uprooter of affliction, a destroyer of diseases; fire, due to its extreme brightness, burns; water, due to its extreme coolness, extinguishes; a lotus, due to its purity, is not tainted by water and mud; a gem, due to its extreme quality, grants desires; a diamond, due to its extreme sharpness, pierces gems, pearls, and crystal; the earth, due to its extreme greatness, supports humans, serpents, beasts, birds, water, rocks, mountains, and trees; the ocean, due to its extreme greatness, is unfillable; Sineru, due to its extreme weight, is immovable; space, due to its extreme vastness, is endless; the sun, due to its extreme radiance, destroys darkness; a lion, due to its extreme birth, is without fear; a wrestler, due to his extreme strength, quickly throws down his opponent; a king, due to his extreme merit, is a ruler; a monk, due to his extreme morality, is worthy of homage by serpents, demons, humans, and gods; the Buddha, due to his extreme supremacy, is incomparable. Just so indeed, great king, excessive giving is praised, extolled, and commended by the wise in the world; whoever gives whatever kind of gift, the giver of excessive gifts attains fame in the world; through excessive giving, King Vessantara was praised, extolled, commended, honoured, and celebrated in the ten-thousand-fold world system; by that very excessive giving, King Vessantara has now today become the Buddha, the foremost in the world with its gods.

"But is there, great king, in the world a gift that should be withheld, which should not be given when one worthy of offerings has not arrived?" "There are indeed, venerable Nāgasena, these ten gifts which are considered not-gifts in the world; whoever gives those gifts, he goes to a realm of misery. What are the ten? The gift of intoxicants, venerable Nāgasena, is considered a not-gift in the world; whoever gives that gift, he goes to a realm of misery. The gift of entertainment, etc. The gift of women, etc. The gift of a bull, etc. The gift of paintings, etc. The gift of weapons, etc. The gift of poison, etc. The gift of fetters, etc. The gift of fowl and pigs, etc. The gift of false scales and false measures, venerable Nāgasena, is considered a not-gift in the world; whoever gives that gift, he goes to a realm of misery. These, venerable Nāgasena, are the ten gifts considered not-gifts in the world; whoever gives those gifts, he goes to a realm of misery."

"I am not asking you, great king, about what is considered a not-gift; this is what I ask you, great king: 'Is there, great king, in the world a gift that should be withheld, which should not be given when one worthy of offerings has not arrived?'" "There is not, venerable Nāgasena, in the world a gift that should be withheld. Which should not be given when one worthy of offerings has not arrived - when confidence of mind has arisen, some give food to those worthy of offerings, some give clothing, some give beds, some give public rest-houses, some give spreads and cloaks, some give female and male slaves, some give fields and sites, some give two-footed and four-footed animals, some give a hundred, a thousand, a hundred thousand, some give a great kingdom, some even give their lives." "If, great king, some even give their lives, why do you excessively criticise Vessantara, the master of giving, when his children and wife were well given?

"Is there, great king, a worldly custom, a worldly practice, that a father may pledge or sell his child when oppressed by debt or driven by livelihood?" "Yes, venerable sir, a father may pledge or sell his child when oppressed by debt or driven by livelihood." "If, great king, a father may pledge or sell his child when oppressed by debt or driven by livelihood, King Vessantara too, great king, not obtaining the knowledge of omniscience, troubled and afflicted, for the attainment of that wealth of the Teaching, pledged and sold his children and wife. Thus, great king, what was given by King Vessantara to others was indeed given, what was done was indeed done. Why then do you, great king, excessively disparage Vessantara, the master of giving, because of that gift?"

"I do not, venerable Nāgasena, censure the gift of Vessantara, the master of giving; but when children and wife are requested, one should give oneself in exchange." "This indeed, great king, is an unreasonable argument, that when children and wife are requested, one should give oneself; for whatever is requested, that very thing should be given; this is the action of good persons. Just as, great king, if some man were to have drinking water brought, and someone were to give him food, would that man, great king, be doing what should be done for him?" "No indeed, venerable sir; giving him that very thing which he has brought, one would be doing what should be done." "Just so indeed, great king, when the brahmin requested children and wife, King Vessantara gave just the children and wife. If, great king, the brahmin were to request Vessantara's body, he, great king, would not protect himself, would not tremble, would not be attached; his body would be given and relinquished. If, great king, anyone were to approach Vessantara, the master of giving, and request 'Become a slave for me,' his body would be given and relinquished; he would not regret having given; the body of King Vessantara, great king, was common to many.

"Just as, great king, a cooked piece of flesh is common to many, even so, great king, the body of King Vessantara was common to many. Or else, great king, just as a tree bearing fruit is common to various groups of birds, even so, great king, the body of King Vessantara was common to many. Why? 'Thus practising, I shall attain perfect enlightenment.'

"Just as, great king, a man who is poor, desiring wealth, wandering in search of wealth, goes along the goat-path, the stake-path, the cane-path, engages in trade by water and land, strives for wealth by body, speech, and mind, endeavours for the acquisition of wealth. Even so, great king, Vessantara, the master of giving, poor in the Buddha's wealth, for the acquisition of the jewel of omniscient knowledge, having given up to beggars wealth and grain, female and male slaves, vehicles and conveyances, all his property, his own children and wife, and himself, seeks only perfect enlightenment.

"Or else, great king, a minister desiring a seal, for the sake of the seal, whatever wealth and grain, gold and silver there is in the house, having given all that, strives for the acquisition of the seal. Even so, great king, Vessantara, the master of giving, having given all that external and internal wealth, having given even his life to others, seeks only perfect enlightenment.

"Moreover, great king, this occurred to Vessantara, the master of giving: 'Whatever that brahmin requests, giving just that to him, I am called one who does what should be done,' thus he gave his children and wife to him. Indeed, great king, Vessantara, the master of giving, did not give his children and wife to the brahmin out of hatred, did not give his children and wife out of desire not to see them, did not give his children and wife thinking 'my children and wife are too many, I am not able to support them,' did not give his children and wife out of discontent, out of desire to remove them thinking 'they are not dear to me.' But because of the dearness of the jewel of omniscient knowledge, for the sake of omniscient knowledge, King Vessantara gave to the brahmin such an incomparable, vast, unsurpassed, dear, agreeable, beloved, dear as life, excellent gift of children and wife.

"This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One, the god above gods, in the Conduct Collection:

"Therefore, great king, King Vessantara, having given the gift of his children, having entered the leaf-hut, lay down. For him, distressed by excessive love, powerful grief arose, his heart-base became hot. His nose not being sufficient, he released hot in-breaths and out-breaths through his mouth; his tears, having turned, becoming drops of blood, came out from his eyes. Even so, great king, with suffering King Vessantara gave his children and wife to the brahmin, thinking 'may my path of giving not decline.'

"Moreover, great king, King Vessantara gave the two children to the brahmin dependent on two reasons. Which two? 'My path of giving will not decline, and from here my grandfather will release my distressed little children from forest roots and fruits.' For King Vessantara knows, great king: 'My children cannot be enjoyed by anyone as slaves; my grandfather will redeem these children, thus there will be a going for us too.' These, great king, are the two reasons dependent on which he gave the two children to the brahmin.

"Moreover, great king, King Vessantara knows: 'This brahmin is old, aged, elderly, weak, broken, dependent on a staff, with exhausted life span, of little merit; he is not capable of enjoying these children as slaves.' But could, great king, a man by his natural power, having taken these moon and sun, so mighty, so powerful, having put them in a box or a casket, having made them without radiance, enjoy them for use as a plate?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Even so, great king, in this world, the children of Vessantara, who is comparable to the moon and sun, cannot be enjoyed by anyone as slaves.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a reason by which reason the children of Vessantara cannot be enjoyed by anyone as slaves. Just as, great king, the jewel gem of a wheel-turning monarch, beautiful, of good birth, octagonal, well-polished, four cubits in length, with the circumference of a cart-hub, cannot be wrapped by anyone in a rag, put in a box, and enjoyed for use as a knife and whetstone, even so, great king, in the world, the children of Vessantara, who is comparable to the jewel gem of a wheel-turning monarch, cannot be enjoyed by anyone as slaves.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a reason by which reason the children of Vessantara cannot be enjoyed by anyone as slaves. Just as, great king, Uposatha the king of elephants, in three-fold rut, all white, standing on seven supports, eight ratanas in height, nine ratanas in length and circumference, pleasing, handsome, cannot be covered by anyone with a winnowing basket or a saucer, or put in a calf-shed like a cow's calf and looked after, even so, great king, in the world, the children of Vessantara, who is comparable to Uposatha the king of elephants, cannot be enjoyed by anyone as slaves.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a reason by which reason the children of Vessantara cannot be enjoyed by anyone as slaves. Just as, great king, the great ocean, long, broad, extended, deep, immeasurable, hard to cross, unfathomable, uncovered, cannot be covered everywhere by anyone and made for use at a single landing place, even so indeed, great king, the children of Vessantara, who is comparable to the great ocean in the world, could not be enjoyed by anyone as slaves.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a reason by which reason the children of Vessantara cannot be enjoyed by anyone as slaves. Just as, great king, the Himalaya, the king of mountains, five hundred yojanas high, three thousand yojanas in length and breadth in the sky, adorned with eighty-four thousand peaks, the source of five hundred great rivers, a dwelling place for hosts of great beings, bearing various kinds of odours, decorated with hundreds of divine medicines, appears risen high in the sky like a rain cloud, even so indeed, great king, the children of Vessantara, who is comparable to the Himalaya, the king of mountains, in the world, could not be enjoyed by anyone as slaves.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a reason by which reason the children of Vessantara cannot be enjoyed by anyone as slaves. Just as, great king, in the darkness of the night, a great mass of fire burning on a mountain peak is discerned even from very far away, even so indeed, great king, King Vessantara, like a great mass of fire burning on a mountain peak, is well-known and discerned even from very far away; his children could not be enjoyed by anyone as slaves.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a reason by which reason the children of Vessantara cannot be enjoyed by anyone as slaves. Just as, great king, on the Himalaya mountain, at the time of the ironwood tree flowers, when a straight wind blows, the odour of flowers blows for ten or twelve yojanas, even so indeed, great king, for King Vessantara, even for thousands of yojanas, up to the Akaniṭṭha realm, in between here, in the abodes of gods, titans, garuḷas, gandhabbas, demons, rakkhasas, great serpents, kinnaras, and Indra, a sound of fame has arisen, and the odour of his excellent morality blows forth; therefore his children could not be enjoyed by anyone as slaves. Great king, the prince Jālī was instructed by his father King Vessantara: 'Your grandfather, dear son, redeeming you by giving wealth to the brahmin, let him redeem by giving that thousand gold coins; redeeming Kaṇhājinā, let him redeem by giving a hundred of each - a hundred male slaves, a hundred female slaves, a hundred elephants, a hundred horses, a hundred cows, a hundred bulls, a hundred gold coins. If, dear son, your grandfather takes you from the brahmin's hand by command, by force, for nothing, do not do your grandfather's word; be followers of the brahmin only.' Having thus instructed, he sent his sons. Then Prince Jālī, having gone, when asked by his grandfather, said:

"Well unravelled, Venerable Nāgasena, is the question; the net of wrong views has been well broken; the opposing doctrines have been well crushed; one's own doctrine has been well illuminated; the phrasing has been well purified; the meaning has been well analysed; thus I accept this as true."

The question on Vessantara is the first.

2.

The Question on the Performance of Austerities

2. "Venerable Nāgasena, do all Bodhisattas perform the performance of austerities, or was the performance of austerities done only by the Bodhisatta Gotama?" "There is not, great king, a performance of austerities for all Bodhisattas; the performance of austerities was done only by the Bodhisatta Gotama."

"Venerable Nāgasena, if so, it is inappropriate that there is distinction among Bodhisattas." "There is distinction among Bodhisattas, great king, in four respects. Which four? Distinction in family, distinction in striving, distinction in lifespan, distinction in measure. By these four respects, great king, there is distinction among Bodhisattas. For all Buddhas, great king, in form, in morality, in concentration, in wisdom, in liberation, in knowledge and vision of liberation, in the four grounds of self-confidence, in the ten powers of the Tathāgata, in the six kinds of knowledge not shared with others, in the fourteen kinds of Buddha-knowledge, in the eighteen qualities of a Buddha, and in the entire virtues of a Buddha, there is no distinction; all Buddhas are exactly equal in the qualities of a Buddha."

"If, Venerable Nāgasena, all Buddhas are exactly equal in the qualities of a Buddha, for what reason was the performance of austerities done only by the Bodhisatta Gotama?" "When knowledge was not fully matured, great king, when enlightenment was not fully matured, the Bodhisatta Gotama went forth into renunciation; the performance of austerities was done by one who was maturing the unmatured knowledge."

"Venerable Nāgasena, for what reason did the Bodhisatta make the great renunciation when knowledge was not fully matured, when enlightenment was not fully matured? Should one not go forth when knowledge is fully matured, having matured the knowledge?"

"The Bodhisatta, great king, having seen the women's quarters in disarray, became remorseful; for him who was remorseful, discontent arose. Having seen the mind of discontent arisen, a certain young god of Māra's retinue, thinking 'This is the time for dispelling the mind of discontent,' standing in the sky, spoke these words:

'Dear sir, do not be dissatisfied. On the seventh day from now, the divine wheel treasure will appear for you, with a thousand spokes, with rim, with nave, complete in every respect; and treasures on earth and in the sky will come to you of their own accord. In the four great continents with their two thousand surrounding small islands, command will proceed with one voice. And you will have more than a thousand sons, brave, heroic in form, crushers of enemy armies. Surrounded by those sons, possessed of the seven treasures, you will rule over the four continents.'

Just as an iron stake heated all day, burning everywhere, might enter the ear-hole, even so, great king, that word entered the ear-hole of the Bodhisatta. Thus he, already dissatisfied by nature, by the word of that deity became even more alarmed, agitated, and stirred.

Just as, great king, a great mass of fire burning, when fuelled with other wood, would burn even more, even so, great king, the Bodhisatta, already dissatisfied by nature, by the word of that deity became even more alarmed, agitated, and stirred.

Or just as, great king, the great earth, naturally moist, with green grass sprouted, sprinkled with water, become muddy, when a great rain cloud has rained upon it, would become even muddier, even so, great king, the Bodhisatta, already dissatisfied by nature, by the word of that deity became even more alarmed, agitated, and stirred."

"But indeed, Venerable Nāgasena, if the divine wheel treasure were to arise for the Bodhisatta on the seventh day, would the Bodhisatta turn back when the divine wheel treasure had arisen?" "No indeed, great king, the divine wheel treasure would not arise for the Bodhisatta on the seventh day; but it was spoken falsely by that deity for the purpose of enticement. Even if, great king, the divine wheel treasure were to arise on the seventh day, the Bodhisatta would not turn back. What is the reason? 'Impermanent' - the Bodhisatta, great king, firmly grasped this; 'suffering, non-self' - he firmly grasped this; he had reached the destruction of clinging.

Just as, great king, water from Lake Anotatta enters the river Ganges, from the river Ganges enters the great ocean, from the great ocean enters the mouth of the abyss - would that water, great king, having gone to the mouth of the abyss, having turned back, enter the great ocean, from the great ocean enter the river Ganges, from the river Ganges enter Anotatta again?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, wholesome merit was matured by the Bodhisatta during a hundred thousand cosmic cycles and four incalculable periods for the sake of this existence; having reached this final existence, with enlightenment-knowledge fully matured, in six years he will become a Buddha, omniscient, the foremost person in the world. Would the Bodhisatta, great king, turn back for the sake of the wheel treasure?" "No indeed, venerable sir."

"But moreover, great king, the great earth with its forests and mountains might overturn, yet the Bodhisatta would not turn back without attaining perfect enlightenment. Even if, great king, the water of the Ganges were to flow upstream, yet the Bodhisatta would not turn back without attaining perfect enlightenment; Even if, great king, the great ocean holding immeasurable water were to dry up like water in a cow's hoofprint, yet the Bodhisatta would not turn back without attaining perfect enlightenment; Even if, great king, Mount Sineru, the king of mountains, were to split into a hundred or a thousand pieces, yet the Bodhisatta would not turn back without attaining perfect enlightenment; Even if, great king, the moon and sun with their stars were to fall to the ground like clods of earth, yet the Bodhisatta would not turn back without attaining perfect enlightenment; Even if, great king, space were to roll up like a mat, yet the Bodhisatta would not turn back without attaining perfect enlightenment. Why? Because all bonds had been burst asunder."

"Venerable Nāgasena, how many bondages are there in the world?" "There are indeed, great king, these ten bondages in the world, by which bondages bound beings do not go forth, and even having gone forth, they turn back. What are the ten? Mother, great king, is a bondage in the world; father, great king, is a bondage in the world; wife, great king, is a bondage in the world; sons, great king, are a bondage in the world; relatives, great king, are a bondage in the world; friends, great king, are a bondage in the world; wealth, great king, is a bondage in the world; material gain and honour, great king, are a bondage in the world; supremacy, great king, is a bondage in the world; the five types of sensual pleasure, great king, are a bondage in the world. These, great king, are the ten bondages in the world, by which bondages bound beings do not go forth, and even having gone forth, they turn back. Those ten bondages of the Bodhisatta were cut and burst apart; therefore, great king, the Bodhisatta does not turn back."

"Venerable Nāgasena, if the Bodhisatta, when discontent had arisen in his mind, by the word of the deity, with knowledge not yet matured, with enlightenment not yet matured, went forth into renunciation, what was the purpose of his performance of austerities? Should not one who is waiting for the maturing of knowledge be an eater of everything?"

"There are indeed, great king, these ten persons in the world who are looked down upon, despised, scorned, mocked, blamed, treated with contempt, and disrespected. What are the ten? A widow, great king, is looked down upon, despised, scorned, mocked, blamed, treated with contempt, and disrespected in the world. A weak person, great king, etc. One without relatives, great king, is a person, etc. A gluttonous person, great king, etc. One not dwelling in a respected family, great king, is a person, etc. One with evil friends, great king, is a person, etc. One lacking wealth, great king, is a person, etc. One lacking good conduct, great king, is a person, etc. One lacking action, great king, is a person, etc. One lacking exertion, great king, is a person looked down upon, despised, scorned, mocked, blamed, treated with contempt, and disrespected in the world. These, great king, are the ten persons in the world who are looked down upon, despised, scorned, mocked, blamed, treated with contempt, and disrespected. Recollecting these ten states, great king, this perception arose in the Bodhisatta: 'May I not be one lacking action, lacking exertion, blamed by gods and humans; what if I were to be a master of action, respecting action, having action as authority, having action as habit, bearing the yoke of action, having action as my abode, dwelling diligently.' Thus indeed, great king, the Bodhisatta, while maturing knowledge, performed austerities."

"Venerable Nāgasena, the Bodhisatta, while performing austerities, said thus: 'Yet I do not by this bitter performance of austerities attain any super-human achievement, any distinction of knowledge and vision worthy of the noble ones; could there be another path to enlightenment?' Was there then at that time forgetfulness regarding the path for the Bodhisatta?"

"There are indeed, great king, these twenty-five mental states that weaken the mind, by which a weakened mind does not rightly become concentrated for the elimination of mental corruptions. What are the twenty-five? Wrath, great king, is a mental state that weakens the mind, by which a weakened mind does not rightly become concentrated for the elimination of mental corruptions; hostility, etc. Contempt, etc. Insolence, etc. Envy, etc. Stinginess, etc. Deceit, etc. Fraudulence, etc. Obstinacy, etc. Impetuosity, etc. Conceit... etc. Arrogance, etc. Vanity, etc. Negligence, etc. Sloth and torpor, etc. Weariness, etc. Laziness, etc. Evil friendship, etc. Forms, etc. Sounds, etc. Odours, etc. Flavours, etc. Tangible objects, etc. Hunger and thirst, etc. Discontent, great king, is a mental state that weakens the mind, by which a weakened mind does not rightly become concentrated for the elimination of mental corruptions. These, great king, are the twenty-five mental states that weaken the mind, by which a weakened mind does not rightly become concentrated for the elimination of mental corruptions.

For the Bodhisatta, great king, hunger and thirst overpowered the body; when the body was overpowered, the mind does not rightly become concentrated for the elimination of mental corruptions. For a hundred thousand cosmic cycles, great king, and four incalculable cosmic cycles, the Bodhisatta sought the full realisation of just the four noble truths in those various births; how then could there be forgetfulness concerning the path in his final existence, in the birth of full realisation? But, great king, a mere perception arose for the Bodhisatta: 'Could there be another path to enlightenment?' Formerly indeed, great king, the Bodhisatta, being one month old, while his father the Sakyan was working, seated on a royal couch in the cool shade of a rose-apple tree, folding his legs crosswise, quite secluded from sensual pleasures, secluded from unwholesome mental states, having attained, dwelt in the first meditative absorption, which is accompanied by applied thought and sustained thought, with rapture and happiness born of seclusion, etc. having attained, he dwelt in the fourth meditative absorption." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true: the Bodhisatta performed austerities while ripening his knowledge."

The question on the performance of austerities is the second.

3.

The Question on the Greater Power of Wholesome and Unwholesome

3. "Venerable Nāgasena, which is exceeding, more powerful - wholesome or unwholesome?" "Wholesome, great king, is exceeding, more powerful, not so unwholesome." "I do not accept that statement, venerable Nāgasena, 'wholesome is exceeding, more powerful, not so unwholesome.' Here, venerable Nāgasena, killers of living beings, takers of what is not given, those who engage in sexual misconduct, liars, village destroyers, road corrupters, cheats, deceivers are seen - all of them by that much evil obtain cutting off of hands, cutting off of feet, cutting off of hands and feet, cutting off of ears, cutting off of nose, cutting off of ears and nose, the gruel-pot torture, the shell-tonsure torture, the Rāhu's mouth torture, the fire-garland torture, the hand-torch torture, the grass-strip torture, the bark-dress torture, the antelope torture, the flesh-hook torture, the coin-cutting torture, the lye-pickling torture, the pivot-turning torture, the straw-chair torture, being sprinkled with boiling oil, being made to be eaten by dogs, impalement alive, beheading with a sword. Some, having done evil at night, experience the result at night itself; some, having done it at night, experience it by day itself; some, having done it by day, experience it by day itself; some, having done it by day, experience it at night itself; some experience it after two or three days have passed - all of them experience the result in this very life. But is there, venerable Nāgasena, anyone who, having given a gift with retinue to one or two or three or four or five or ten or a hundred or a thousand or a hundred thousand, experienced wealth or fame or happiness pertaining to the present life through morality or through the Observance practice?"

"There are, great king, four men who, having given gifts, having taken upon themselves morality, having performed the Observance practice, in this very life, with that very bodily form, reached the city of the devas." "Who and who, venerable sir?" "King Mandhātā, great king, King Nimi, King Sādhīna, and the gandhabba Guttila."

"Venerable Nāgasena, that is separated by many thousands of existences; that is beyond the sight of both of us. If you are able, tell of the present existence, during the time when the Blessed One was living." "Even in the present existence, great king, the slave Puṇṇaka, having given food to the Elder Sāriputta, on that very day attained the position of treasurer; he is now known as Puṇṇaka the treasurer. Queen Gopālamātā, having sold her own hair, with the eight coins obtained, having given almsfood to the Elder Mahākaccāyana together with seven others, on that very day attained the position of chief queen of King Candapajjota. The female lay follower Suppiyā, having given food for convalescence made from the flesh of her own thigh to a certain sick monk, on the very second day became one with healed wound, with restored skin, healthy. Queen Mallikā, having given a lump of barley-gruel from the previous evening to the Blessed One, on that very day became the chief queen of the King of Kosala. Sumana the garland-maker, having venerated the Blessed One with eight handfuls of jasmine flowers, on that very day attained great success. The brahmin with one cloth, having venerated the Blessed One with his upper cloth, on that very day obtained everything eightfold. All these, great king, experienced wealth and fame pertaining to the present life."

"Venerable Nāgasena, having searched and sought, you saw only six people." "Yes, great king." "If so, venerable Nāgasena, unwholesome alone is exceeding, more powerful, not so wholesome. For I, venerable Nāgasena, in a single day see even ten men being impaled on stakes as the result of evil action; I see twenty, thirty, forty, fifty, a hundred men, a thousand men being impaled on stakes as the result of evil action. Of the Nanda family, venerable Nāgasena, there was a general's son named Bhaddasāla. And with King Candagutta a battle was fully engaged. In that battle, venerable Nāgasena, on both sides of the army there were eighty headless-body forms; when one head-and-trunk fell, one headless-body form arose. All these fell into calamity and disaster as the result of evil action alone. By this reason too, venerable Nāgasena, I say unwholesome alone is exceeding, more powerful, not so wholesome."

"Is it heard, venerable Nāgasena, that in this Buddha's Dispensation an incomparable gift was given by the King of Kosala?" "Yes, great king, it is heard." "But indeed, venerable Nāgasena, did the King of Kosala, having given that incomparable gift, obtain on that account any wealth or fame or happiness pertaining to the present life?" "No indeed, great king." "If, venerable Nāgasena, the King of Kosala, even having given such an unsurpassed gift, did not obtain on that account any wealth or fame or happiness pertaining to the present life, then, venerable Nāgasena, unwholesome alone is exceeding, more powerful, not so wholesome."

"Because of its smallness, great king, unwholesome ripens quickly; because of its extensiveness, wholesome ripens over a long time. This, great king, should be examined even by simile. Just as, great king, in the western country there is a grain type called kumudabhaṇḍikā which is reaped in a month and brought inside the house, while rice ripens in five or six months - what then, great king, is the difference, what is the distinction between kumudabhaṇḍikā and rice?" "Because of its smallness, venerable sir, of kumudabhaṇḍikā, and because of the extensiveness of rice. Rice, venerable Nāgasena, is worthy of kings, food for kings; kumudabhaṇḍikā is food for slaves and workers." "Just so indeed, great king, because of its smallness, unwholesome ripens quickly; because of its extensiveness, wholesome ripens over a long time."

"Whatever therein, venerable Nāgasena, matures quickly, that indeed in the world is exceeding, more powerful; therefore unwholesome is more powerful, not so wholesome. Just as, venerable Nāgasena, whatever warrior, having entered a great battle, having seized the enemy by the armpit, having dragged him, might bring him very quickly to his master, that warrior in the world is called able and heroic. And whatever physician quickly extracts a dart and removes the disease, that physician is called skilled. Whatever accountant, having calculated very quickly, quickly shows the result, that accountant is called skilled. Whatever wrestler quickly lifts up his opponent and throws him down on his back, that wrestler is called able and heroic. Just so indeed, venerable Nāgasena, whatever matures quickly, whether wholesome or unwholesome, that in the world is exceeding, more powerful."

"Both of those, great king, are actions to be experienced in a future state; but unwholesome, because of its blameworthiness, is experienced in the present life in a moment. By the warriors of old, great king, this procedure was established: 'Whoever kills a living being, he is worthy of punishment, etc. whoever takes what is not given, etc. whoever goes to another's wife, etc. whoever speaks falsely, etc. whoever sacks a village, etc. whoever spoils the road, etc. whoever commits fraud, etc. whoever commits deception, he is worthy of punishment, should be killed, should be cut, should be broken, should be slain.' Taking that as basis, having investigated and investigated, they punish, they kill, they cut, they break, and they slay. But is there, great king, any procedure established by anyone: 'Whoever gives a gift, or guards morality, or performs the Observance practice, to him wealth or fame should be given'? Do they, having investigated and investigated, give wealth or fame, like the killing and imprisonment for a thief who has committed a deed?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "If, great king, having investigated and investigated, they would give wealth or fame to donors, wholesome too would be experienced in the present life. But because, great king, they do not investigate donors thinking 'We shall give wealth or fame,' therefore wholesome is not experienced in the present life. By this reason, great king, unwholesome is experienced in the present life; in the future state indeed he experiences exceeding, more powerful feeling." "Excellent, venerable Nāgasena, without one wise like you this question could not be well unravelled; the mundane, venerable Nāgasena, has been made known by the supramundane."

The question on the greater power of wholesome and unwholesome is the third.

4.

The Question on the Deceased Spirits of the Past and so on

4. "Venerable Nāgasena, these donors, having given a gift, dedicate it to deceased spirits: 'May this reach them.' Do they obtain any result on that account?" "Some, great king, obtain, some do not obtain." "Who, venerable sir, obtain, who do not obtain?" "Those reborn in hell, great king, do not obtain; those gone to heaven do not obtain; those gone to the animal realm do not obtain; of four kinds of ghosts, three kinds of ghosts do not obtain - those who feed on vomit, those afflicted by hunger and thirst, those consumed by craving; ghosts who live on what is given by others obtain; and they too obtain only when remembering."

"If so, venerable Nāgasena, the gift of the donors is dried up, fruitless, if those for whom it was made do not obtain it?" "No indeed, great king, that gift is not fruitless, not without result; the donors themselves experience its fruit." "If so, venerable Nāgasena, convince me by a reason." "Here, great king, some people, having prepared fish, meat, liquor, food and sweets, go to their relatives' family. If those relatives were not to accept that tribute, would that tribute go dried up or perish?" "No indeed, venerable sir, it would belong just to the owners." "Just so indeed, great king, the donors themselves experience its fruit. But, great king, if a man who has entered an inner room, when there is no exit in front, by what would he exit?" "By the way he entered, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, the donors themselves experience its fruit." "Let it be, venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true: the donors themselves experience its fruit; we do not dispute that reason.

Venerable Nāgasena, if the gift given by these donors reaches the deceased spirits, and they experience its result, then if one who kills living beings, cruel, with bloody hands, with corrupted mental intention, having killed people, having done a cruel deed, were to dedicate to deceased spirits: 'May the result of this action of mine reach the deceased spirits,' would its result reach the deceased spirits?" "No indeed, great king."

"Venerable Nāgasena, what is the cause there, what is the reason, by which the wholesome reaches but the unwholesome does not reach?" "This, great king, is not a question to be asked. And do not, great king, thinking 'there is one who can answer,' ask what should not be asked. 'Why is space unsupported, why does the Ganges not flow upwards, why are these humans and birds two-footed and deer four-footed?' - you will ask me that too." "I do not ask that, venerable Nāgasena, seeking to trouble, but I ask for the purpose of removing doubt. Many people in the world are going the wrong way, without vision. 'How might they not gain access?' - thus I ask that." "It is not possible, great king, to share evil action together with one who has not done it, who has not consented.

Just as, great king, people carry water even very far by means of a water channel, is it possible, great king, to carry a compact great rock mountain by a channel wherever one wishes?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, it is possible to share the wholesome, it is not possible to share the unwholesome. Or else, great king, it is possible to light a lamp with oil; is it possible, great king, to light a lamp with water?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, it is possible to share the wholesome, it is not possible to share the unwholesome. Or else, great king, farmers, having drawn water from a lake, ripen grain; is it possible, great king, having drawn water from the great ocean, to ripen grain?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "Just so indeed, great king, it is possible to share the wholesome, it is not possible to share the unwholesome."

"Venerable Nāgasena, for what reason is it possible to share wholesome, but not possible to share unwholesome? Convince me by a reason; I am not blind, without light - having heard I will know." "Unwholesome, great king, is little; wholesome is much. Because of its littleness, unwholesome is exhausted by the doer alone; because of its muchness, wholesome spreads over the world with its gods." "Give a simile."

"Just as, great king, if a small single drop of water were to fall on the earth, would that drop of water, great king, spread over ten or twelve yojanas?" "No indeed, venerable sir; where that drop of water fell, right there it is exhausted." "For what reason, great king?" "Because of the smallness, venerable sir, of the drop of water." "Just so indeed, great king, unwholesome being small, because of its smallness, is exhausted by the doer alone; it is not possible to share.

"Or just as, great king, a great rain cloud might pour down, satisfying the surface of the earth, would that great rain cloud, great king, spread over all around?" "Yes, venerable sir, having filled pools, lakes, rivers, channels, grottoes, crevices, reservoirs, tanks, wells and ponds, that great rain cloud would spread over ten or twelve yojanas." "For what reason, great king?" "Because of the greatness, venerable sir, of the rain cloud." "Just so indeed, great king, wholesome is much; because of its muchness, it is possible to share even with gods and humans."

"Venerable Nāgasena, for what reason is unwholesome little and wholesome more?" "Here, great king, whoever gives a gift, takes upon himself morality, performs the Observance practice, he is glad, delighted, smiling, greatly pleased, with a gladdened mind, filled with joy; for him rapture arises again and again; for one whose mind is filled with rapture, wholesome grows more and more.

"Just as, great king, in a well full of much water, water might enter from one direction and exit from another; even as it exits, it arises again and again; it is not possible to bring it to exhaustion. Just so indeed, great king, wholesome grows more and more. Even if for a hundred years, great king, a man were to reflect upon wholesome done, with each reflection, wholesome grows more and more. That wholesome of his is possible to share with whomever he wishes; this, great king, is the reason here, by which reason wholesome is more.

"But one doing unwholesome, great king, afterwards becomes remorseful; the mind of one who is remorseful shrinks back, contracts, turns away, does not expand, grieves, is tormented, diminishes, is exhausted, does not grow, and is exhausted right there. Just as, great king, in a dry river with a great sandbank, with elevations and depressions, with bends and curves, a small amount of water coming from above diminishes, is exhausted, does not grow, and is exhausted right there. Just so indeed, great king, the mind of one doing unwholesome shrinks back, contracts, turns away, does not expand, grieves, is tormented, diminishes, is exhausted, does not grow, and is exhausted right there; this, great king, is the reason here, by which reason unwholesome is little." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the deceased spirits of the past and so on is the fourth.

5.

The Question on Dreams

5. "Venerable Nāgasena, in this world men and women see dreams, both good and evil, both seen before and not seen before, both done before and not done before, both secure and fearful, both far and near, and manifold thousands of various kinds are seen. What is this thing called a dream, and who sees it?" "This, great king, is a sign called a dream, which comes into the range of consciousness. There are these six, great king, who see dreams: one of wind humour sees a dream, one of bile humour sees a dream, one of phlegm humour sees a dream, one sees a dream through divine intervention, one sees a dream through habitual practice, one sees a dream through an advanced sign. Therein, great king, whatever dream one sees through an advanced sign, that alone is true, the rest is false."

"Venerable Nāgasena, one who sees a dream through an advanced sign, does his consciousness itself go and select that sign, or does that sign come into the range of consciousness, or does another come and inform him?" "No, great king, his consciousness does not itself go and select that sign, nor does anyone else come and inform him, but rather that very sign comes into the range of consciousness. Just as, great king, a mirror does not itself go anywhere and select a reflection, nor does anyone else bring a reflection and place it on the mirror, but rather a reflection comes from somewhere and comes into the range of the mirror, just so indeed, great king, his consciousness does not itself go and select that sign, nor does anyone else come and inform him, but rather a sign comes from somewhere and comes into the range of consciousness."

"Venerable Nāgasena, that consciousness which sees a dream, does that consciousness know 'such will be the result, whether security or danger'?" "No indeed, great king, that consciousness does not know 'such will be the result, whether security or danger', but when the sign has arisen, one tells others, and then they explain the meaning."

"Come now, venerable Nāgasena, show me a reason." "Just as, great king, moles, boils, and skin eruptions arise on the body for gain or loss, for fame or disrepute, for blame or praise, for happiness or suffering, do those boils, great king, arise knowing 'we shall produce this particular result'?" "No indeed, venerable sir, in whatever place those boils arise, there, having seen those boils, interpreters of signs declare 'such will be the result'." "Just so indeed, great king, that consciousness which sees a dream, that consciousness does not know 'such will be the result, whether security or danger', but when the sign has arisen, one tells others, and then they explain the meaning."

"Venerable Nāgasena, one who sees a dream, does he see it while sleeping or while awake?" "Whoever, great king, sees a dream, he does not see it while sleeping, nor does he see it while awake. But when torpor has descended and the life-continuum has not been reached, in between here one sees a dream. For one who has ascended into torpor, great king, consciousness has gone to the life-continuum; consciousness gone to the life-continuum does not proceed; consciousness that does not proceed does not understand happiness and suffering; for one not understanding there is no dream; when consciousness is proceeding one sees a dream.

Just as, great king, in gloom, in darkness, in dim light, even in a very pure mirror a reflection is not seen, just so indeed, great king, when consciousness has ascended into torpor and gone to the life-continuum, even though the body remains, consciousness does not proceed; when consciousness does not proceed one does not see a dream. Just as, great king, a mirror, so should the body be seen; just as darkness, so should torpor be seen; just as light, so should consciousness be seen.

"Or just as, great king, when the sun is covered by frost, the radiance of the sun is not seen, though the sun's rays exist they do not proceed, and when the sun's rays do not proceed there is no light, just so indeed, great king, for one who has ascended into torpor, the mind has gone to the life-continuum, the mind that has gone to the life-continuum does not proceed, when the mind does not proceed one does not see a dream. Just as, great king, the sun, so should the body be seen; just as the covering of frost, so should torpor be seen; just as the sun's rays, so should the mind be seen.

"For two, great king, even while the body exists, the mind does not proceed: for one who has ascended into torpor and gone to the life-continuum, even while the body exists, the mind does not proceed; for one who has attained cessation, even while the body exists, the mind does not proceed. For one who is awake, great king, the mind is fickle, open, unconcealed, unbound; for one of such nature, a sign does not come within range of the mind. Just as, great king, those desiring secrecy avoid a man who is open, unconcealed, inactive, without secrets, just so indeed, great king, for one who is awake, a divine matter does not come within range; therefore one who is awake does not see a dream. Or just as, great king, for a monk of broken livelihood, of misconduct, of evil friends, immoral, lazy, of inferior energy, wholesome qualities conducive to enlightenment do not come within range, just so indeed, great king, for one who is awake, a divine matter does not come within range; therefore one who is awake does not see a dream."

"Venerable Nāgasena, is there a beginning, middle, and end of torpor?" "Yes, great king, there is a beginning, middle, and end of torpor." "Which is the beginning, which is the middle, which is the end?" "That which, great king, is the covering and enveloping of the body, the weakness, the sluggishness, the unfitness for work of the body, this is the beginning of torpor; that which, great king, is when one overcome by light sleep watches intermittently, this is the middle of torpor; going to the life-continuum is the end. One who has reached the middle, great king, overcome by light sleep, sees a dream. Just as, great king, someone of restrained conduct, with concentrated mind, stable in nature, of unshakeable understanding, having abandoned the sound of curiosity, having plunged into the midst of the forest, reflects on a subtle matter, and he does not fall into torpor there, he, concentrated there with fully focused mind, penetrates the subtle matter, just so indeed, great king, one who is awake, not having attained torpor, having reached the middle, overcome by light sleep, sees a dream. Just as, great king, the sound of curiosity, so should wakefulness be seen; just as a secluded forest, so should one overcome by light sleep be seen; just as he, having abandoned the sound of curiosity, having avoided torpor, having become neutral, penetrates the subtle matter, so one who is awake, not having attained torpor, overcome by light sleep, sees a dream." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on dreams is the fifth.

6.

The Question on Untimely Death

6. "Venerable Nāgasena, those beings who die, do they all die at the proper time, or do some die at an improper time?" "There is, great king, death at the proper time, and there is death at an improper time."

"Venerable Nāgasena, who die at the proper time, who die at an improper time?" "Have you, great king, previously seen mango trees or rose-apple trees, or from another fruit tree, fruits falling, both unripe and ripe?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Those fruits, great king, that fall from the tree, do they all fall at the proper time, or at an improper time?" "Those fruits, venerable Nāgasena, that fall fully ripe and loosened, all those fall at the proper time. But those remaining fruits among them, some fall worm-eaten, some fall struck by a stick, some fall struck by the wind, some fall having become rotten inside, all those fall at an improper time." "Just so, great king, those who die struck by the force of ageing, they indeed die at the proper time; the rest, some die oppressed by action, some die oppressed by destination, some die oppressed by activity."

"Venerable Nāgasena, those who die oppressed by action, those who die oppressed by destination, those who die oppressed by activity, those who die oppressed by the force of ageing, all of them die at the proper time only. Even one who dies in the mother's womb, that is his time, he dies at the proper time. Even one who dies in the birth-house, that is his time, he too dies at the proper time. Even one who dies at a month old, etc. Even one who dies at a hundred years old, that is his time, he dies at the proper time. Therefore, venerable Nāgasena, there is no such thing as untimely death; whoever dies, they all die at the proper time only."

"These seven, great king, die at an improper time even while further life span exists. Which seven? One who is hungry, great king, not obtaining food, with damaged interior, dies at an improper time even while further life span exists; one who is thirsty, great king, not obtaining drinking water, with dried-up heart, dies at an improper time even while further life span exists; one bitten by a snake, great king, overcome by the force of poison, not obtaining a physician, dies at an improper time even while further life span exists; one who has consumed poison, great king, with limbs and minor limbs burning, not obtaining medicine, dies at an improper time even while further life span exists; one who has entered fire, great king, burning, not obtaining extinguishing, dies at an improper time even while further life span exists; one who has entered water, great king, not obtaining a foothold, dies at an improper time even while further life span exists; one struck by a spear, great king, being sick, not obtaining a physician, dies at an improper time even while further life span exists. These, great king, are the seven who die at an improper time even while further life span exists. Therein I, great king, speak definitely.

"In eight ways, great king, death occurs for beings: by wind-originated disorder, by bile-originated disorder, by phlegm-originated disorder, by a combination of these, by change of season, by improper care, by external attack, by the result of action, great king, death occurs for beings. Therein, great king, that which is death by the result of action, that alone is timely death; the rest is untimely death." And there is this:

"Some beings, great king, die by the result of this or that unwholesome action done before. Here, great king, whoever formerly kills others by hunger, he for many hundreds of thousands of years, oppressed by hunger, starving, exhausted, with dried and withered heart, famished, parched, burning, internally scorching, dies by hunger alone, whether young, middle-aged, or old; this too is his timely death.

"Whoever formerly kills others by thirst, he for many hundreds of thousands of years, having become a ghost, being one consumed by thirst, rough, emaciated, with dried-up heart, dies by thirst alone, whether young, middle-aged, or old; this too is his timely death.

"Whoever formerly kills others by having them bitten by a snake, he for many hundreds of thousands of years, having transformed from python-mouth to python-mouth, from black-snake-mouth to black-snake-mouth, repeatedly eaten by them, dies bitten by snakes alone, whether young, middle-aged, or old; this too is his timely death.

"Whoever formerly kills others by giving poison, he for many hundreds of thousands of years, with burning limbs and minor limbs, with body breaking apart, emitting the smell of a corpse, dies by poison alone, whether young, middle-aged, or old; this too is his timely death.

"Whoever formerly kills others by fire, he for many hundreds of thousands of years, having rolled from one mountain of embers to another mountain of embers, from one domain of Yama to another domain of Yama, with body burnt and half-burnt, dies by fire alone, whether young, middle-aged, or old; this too is his timely death.

"Whoever formerly kills others by water, he for many hundreds of thousands of years, with body destroyed, plundered, broken, and weak, with agitated mind, dies by water alone, whether young, middle-aged, or old; this too is his timely death.

"Whoever formerly kills others by a spear, he for many hundreds of thousands of years, cut, split, pounded, and crushed, struck by the point of a spear, dies by a spear alone, whether young, middle-aged, or old; this too is his timely death."

"Venerable Nāgasena, as you say that there is untimely death, come, explain to me the reason for that." "Just as, great king, a great mass of fire, having taken up grass, sticks, branches, and leaves, with its fuel exhausted, is quenched by the extinction of clinging, that fire is called 'quenched at the right time, without harm, without danger'; just so, great king, whoever, having lived for many thousands of days, worn out by old age, dies by the exhaustion of life-span, without harm, without danger, he is called 'one who has reached death at the right time.'

"Or just as, great king, there might be a great mass of fire that has taken up grass, sticks, branches, and leaves, and while that grass, sticks, branches, and leaves are not yet exhausted, a great rain cloud, having rained down, might extinguish it - would that great mass of fire, great king, be called 'quenched at the right time'?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But why, great king, did that latter mass of fire not have the same destination as the former mass of fire?" "Venerable sir, oppressed by a visiting rain cloud, that mass of fire was quenched at the wrong time." Just so, great king, whoever dies at the wrong time, he, oppressed by a visiting disease - whether originating from wind, or originating from bile, or originating from phlegm, or from a combination of humours, or produced by change of season, or produced by improper care, or by external attack, or by hunger, or by thirst, or by snake bite, or by eating poison, or by fire, or by water, or oppressed by the force of a spear - dies at the wrong time. This, great king, is the reason by which there is untimely death.

"Or just as, great king, a great rain cloud, having arisen in the sky, filling both the low ground and the high, rains down, it is called 'the cloud rains without harm, without danger.' Just so, great king, whoever, having lived long, worn out by old age, dies by the exhaustion of life-span, without harm, without danger, he is called 'one who has reached death at the right time.'

"Or just as, great king, a great rain cloud, having arisen in the sky, might right there in between pass away by a great wind - would that great rain cloud, great king, be called 'departed at the right time'?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But why, great king, did that latter rain cloud not have the same destination as the former rain cloud?" "Venerable sir, oppressed by a visiting wind, that rain cloud departed without reaching the right time." "Just so, great king, whoever dies at the wrong time, he, oppressed by a visiting disease - whether originating from wind, etc. or oppressed by the force of a spear - dies at the wrong time. This, great king, is the reason by which there is untimely death.

"Or just as, great king, a powerful venomous snake, angered, might bite some person, and that poison might bring him to death without harm, without danger, that poison is called 'without harm, without danger, having reached its end.' Just so, great king, whoever, having lived long, worn out by old age, dies by the exhaustion of life-span, without harm, without danger, he is called 'without harm, without danger, having reached the end of life, having reached timely death.'

"Or just as, great king, for one bitten by a powerful venomous snake, right there in between a snake charmer, having given medicine, might render it non-poisonous - would that poison, great king, be called 'departed at the right time'?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But why, great king, did that latter poison not have the same destination as the former poison?" "Venerable sir, oppressed by a visiting medicine, that poison departed without reaching its end." "Just so, great king, whoever dies at the wrong time, he, oppressed by a visiting disease - whether originating from wind, etc. or oppressed by the force of a spear - dies at the wrong time. This, great king, is the reason by which there is untimely death.

"Or just as, great king, an archer might shoot an arrow; if that arrow goes to the end of its natural path of travel, that arrow is called 'without harm, without danger, having gone to the end of its natural path of travel.' Just so, great king, whoever, having lived long, worn out by old age, dies by the exhaustion of life-span, without harm, without danger, he is called 'without harm, without danger, having reached death at the right time.'

"Or else, great king, suppose an archer were to shoot an arrow, and someone were to catch that arrow at that very moment, would that arrow, great king, be called one that has gone to the end of its natural path of travel?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But why, great king, did the latter arrow not have the same destination as the former arrow?" "Because, venerable sir, by the visiting act of catching, the going of that arrow was interrupted." "Just so, great king, whoever dies at the wrong time, he, oppressed by a visiting disease - whether originating from wind, etc. or oppressed by the force of a spear - dies at the wrong time. This, great king, is the reason by which there is untimely death.

"Or else, great king, whoever might strike a metal vessel, by that striking a sound having arisen goes to the end of its natural path of travel, that sound is called 'free from harm, free from danger, one that has gone to the end of its natural path of travel.' Just so, great king, whoever having lived for many thousands of days, worn out by old age, dies through the exhaustion of life-span, free from harm, free from danger, he is called 'free from harm, free from danger, one who has reached death at the right time.'

"Or else, great king, whoever might strike a metal vessel, by that striking a sound might arise, and when the sound has arisen, not having gone far, someone might touch it, and together with the touching the sound might cease, would that sound, great king, be called one that has gone to the end of its natural path of travel?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But why, great king, did the latter sound not have the same destination as the former sound?" "Because, venerable sir, by the visiting act of touching, that sound ceased." "Just so, great king, whoever dies at the wrong time, he, oppressed by a visiting disease - whether originating from wind, etc. or oppressed by the force of a spear - dies at the wrong time. This here, great king, is the reason by which there is untimely death.

"Or else, great king, a grain seed well-grown in a field, with rain falling properly, having become spread out, extended, scattered, and abundant in fruit, reaches the time for harvesting the crop, that grain is called 'free from harm, free from danger, one that has reached the right time.' Just so, great king, whoever having lived for many thousands of days, worn out by old age, dies through the exhaustion of life-span, free from harm, free from danger, he is called 'free from harm, free from danger, one who has reached death at the right time.'

"Or else, great king, if a grain seed well-grown in a field were to die, damaged by water, would that grain, great king, be called one that has not reached the right time?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But why, great king, did the latter grain not have the same destination as the former grain?" "Because, venerable sir, that grain died, oppressed by visiting heat." "Just so, great king, whoever dies at the wrong time, he, oppressed by a visiting disease - whether originating from wind, etc. or oppressed by the force of a spear - dies at the wrong time. This, great king, is the reason by which there is untimely death.

"But have you heard before, great king, that 'worms having arisen destroy a flourishing young crop together with its roots'?" "We have both heard that before, venerable sir, and seen it before." "Was that crop, great king, destroyed at the right time, or destroyed at an untimely time?" "At an untimely time, venerable sir, for if, venerable sir, worms had not eaten that crop, it would have reached the time for harvesting the crop." "But, great king, does the crop perish by a visiting destruction, and does the crop without destruction reach the time for harvesting the crop?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Just so, great king, whoever dies at the wrong time, he, oppressed by a visiting disease - whether originating from wind, etc. or oppressed by the force of a spear, dies. This, great king, is the reason by which there is untimely death.

"But have you heard before, great king, 'When the crop is accomplished, bending with the weight of fruit, with leaves spread on the stalks, a type of rain called hail-storm, having fallen down, destroys it and makes it fruitless'?" "We have both heard that before, venerable sir, and seen it before." "Was that crop, great king, destroyed at the proper time, or destroyed at an improper time?" "At an improper time, venerable sir. If, venerable sir, that crop were not rained upon by hail-storm, it would reach the time for harvesting the crop." "But, great king, does the crop perish by a visiting destruction, and does the crop without destruction reach the time for harvesting the crop?" "Yes, venerable sir." "Just so, great king, whoever dies at an improper time, he, oppressed by a visiting disease - whether arising from wind, or arising from bile, or arising from phlegm, or from a combination of humours, or born from change of season, or born from improper care, or from external attack, or from hunger, or from thirst, or from snake-bite, or from having eaten poison, or from fire, or from water, or oppressed by the force of a weapon - dies at an improper time. But if he were not oppressed by a visiting disease, he would reach death at the proper time. This, great king, is the reason here, by which reason there is untimely death."

"Wonderful, venerable Nāgasena, marvellous, venerable Nāgasena, the reason has been well shown, the simile has been well shown for the illustration of untimely death. 'There is untimely death' has been made clear, made obvious, made manifest. Even a person without mental distraction, venerable Nāgasena, would come to the conclusion by even one simile that 'there is untimely death,' how much more a person with consciousness? I was convinced, venerable sir, by the very first simile that 'there is untimely death,' but wishing to hear further explanations, I did not accept it."

The question on untimely death is the sixth.

7.

The Question on the Wonder of the Shrine

7. "Venerable Nāgasena, do miracles occur at the shrines of all those who have attained final Nibbāna, or only of some?" "Of some, great king, they occur, of some they do not occur." "Of which, venerable sir, do they occur, of which do they not occur?" "Great king, by the determination of any one of three, miracles occur at the shrine of one who has attained final Nibbāna. Which three? Here, great king, a Worthy One, out of compassion for gods and humans, while still living, determines: 'May miracles occur at such-and-such a shrine'; by the power of his determination, miracles occur at the shrine. Thus, by the power of a Worthy One's determination, miracles occur at the shrine of one who has attained final Nibbāna.

"Furthermore, great king, deities, out of compassion for humans, display miracles at the shrine of one who has attained final Nibbāna, thinking: 'By this miracle, the Good Teaching will be constantly upheld, and humans, being devoted, will increase in wholesomeness.' Thus, by the power of the deities' determination, miracles occur at the shrine of one who has attained final Nibbāna.

"Furthermore, great king, a woman or a man who is faithful, devoted, wise, experienced, intelligent, endowed with higher intelligence, having wisely considered, having determined upon fragrance or a garland or cloth or something else, offers it at the shrine, thinking: 'May it be thus.' By the power of that one's determination too, miracles occur at the shrine of one who has attained final Nibbāna. Thus, by the power of humans' determination, miracles occur at the shrine of one who has attained final Nibbāna.

"Indeed, great king, by the power of the determination of any one of these three, miracles occur at the shrine of one who has attained final Nibbāna.

"If, great king, there is no determination by them, miracles do not occur at the shrine even of one who has eliminated the mental corruptions, who possesses the six higher knowledges, who has attained mastery of mind. Even when there is no miracle, great king, having seen the completely pure conduct, one should have confidence, one should come to a conclusion, one should believe: 'This son of the Buddha has well attained final Nibbāna.'" "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the wonder of the shrine is the seventh.

8.

The Question on the Full Realization of the Teaching

8. "Venerable Nāgasena, for those who proceed rightly, is there full realization of the teaching for all of them, or is there not for some?" "For some, great king, there is, for some there is not." "For whom, venerable sir, is there, for whom is there not?" "For one gone to the animal realm, great king, even if practising well, there is no full realization of the teaching; for one reborn in the sphere of ghosts, etc. for one holding wrong view, etc. for a cheat, etc. for a matricide, etc. for a patricide, etc. for a killer of an arahant, etc. for a schismatic, etc. for one who wounds, etc. for one who is in communion by theft, etc. for one gone over to other sects, etc. for a seducer of nuns, etc. for one who, having committed any one of the thirteen heavy offences, has not risen from it, etc. for a eunuch, etc. for a hermaphrodite, even if practising well, there is no full realization of the teaching, etc. Also for a young human being less than seven years old, even if practising well, there is no full realization of the teaching. For these sixteen persons, great king, even if practising well, there is no full realization of the teaching."

"Venerable Nāgasena, those fifteen persons are indeed opposed; whether there is or is not full realization of the teaching for them, then for what reason is there no full realization of the teaching for a young human being less than seven years old, even if practising well? Here first there is a question: 'Is it not so that for a young one there is no lust, there is no hate, there is no delusion, there is no conceit, there is no wrong view, there is no discontent, there is no sensual thought, unmixed with mental defilements; that young one, being fit and ready and deserving, should penetrate the four truths with a single penetration?'"

"That itself, great king, is the reason by which reason I say 'for one less than seven years old, even if practising well, there is no full realization of the teaching.' If, great king, one less than seven years old would find pleasure in what is enticing, would become corrupted towards what leads to hate, would become deluded towards what leads to infatuation, would become intoxicated towards what is intoxicating, would cognize view, would cognize delight and discontent, would think about the wholesome and unwholesome, there would be full realization of the teaching for him. But, great king, the mind of one less than seven years old is weak, feeble, limited, small, slight, dull, obscure; the unconditioned element of Nibbāna is heavy, weighty, extensive, great. One less than seven years old, great king, with that feeble, limited, dull, obscure mind, is not able to penetrate the heavy, weighty, extensive, great, unconditioned element of Nibbāna.

"Just as, great king, Sineru, the king of mountains, is heavy, weighty, extensive, great - could, great king, a man by his own natural strength and power and energy lift up Sineru, the king of mountains?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "For what reason, great king?" "Because of the weakness, venerable sir, of the man, because of the greatness of Sineru, the king of mountains." "Just so indeed, great king, the mind of one less than seven years old is weak, feeble, limited, small, slight, dull, obscure; the unconditioned element of Nibbāna is heavy, weighty, extensive, great. One less than seven years old, with that feeble, limited, dull, obscure mind, is not able to penetrate the heavy, weighty, extensive, great, unconditioned element of Nibbāna; for that reason, for one less than seven years old, even if practising well, there is no full realization of the teaching.

"Or else, great king, this great earth is long, extended, broad, spread out, extensive, wide, vast, and great. Is it possible, great king, to make that great earth into watery mud by moistening it with a small drop of water?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "For what reason, great king?" "Because of the smallness, venerable sir, of the drop of water, and because of the greatness of the great earth." Just so indeed, great king, the mind of one less than seven years old is weak, feeble, limited, small, slight, dull, and obscure, while the unconditioned element of Nibbāna is long, extended, broad, spread out, extensive, wide, vast, and great. One less than seven years old, with that feeble mind, limited, dull, and obscure, is not able to penetrate the great unconditioned element of Nibbāna; for that reason, even for one less than seven years old who practises well, there is no full realization of the teaching.

"Or else, great king, if there were a fire that is weak, feeble, limited, small, slight, and dull, would it be possible, great king, with that much dull fire to dispel the darkness in the world with its gods and show light?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "For what reason, great king?" "Because of the dullness, venerable sir, of the fire, and because of the greatness of the world." Just so indeed, great king, the mind of one less than seven years old is weak, feeble, limited, small, slight, dull, and obscure, and is covered by the great darkness of ignorance. Therefore it is difficult to show the light of knowledge; for that reason, even for one less than seven years old who practises well, there is no full realization of the teaching.

"Or else, great king, if a sick, emaciated worm with a minute and limited body, having seen a noble elephant in three-fold rut, nine cubits long, three cubits wide, ten cubits in circumference, eight cubits high, having reached its own place, were to try to swallow it, would that worm, great king, be able to swallow that noble elephant?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "For what reason, great king?" "Because of the smallness, venerable sir, of the worm, and because of the greatness of the noble elephant." Just so indeed, great king, the mind of one less than seven years old is weak, feeble, limited, small, slight, dull, and obscure, while the unconditioned element of Nibbāna is great. He, with that feeble mind, limited, dull, and obscure, is not able to penetrate the great unconditioned element of Nibbāna; for that reason, even for one less than seven years old who practises well, there is no full realization of the teaching." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the full realization of the teaching is the eighth.

9.

The Question on Nibbāna as Exclusively Pleasant

9. "Venerable Nāgasena, is Nibbāna exclusively pleasant, or is it mixed with suffering?" "Nibbāna, great king, is exclusively pleasant, not mixed with suffering."

"We do not believe that statement, venerable Nāgasena, 'Nibbāna is exclusively pleasant'; thus here we, venerable Nāgasena, conclude 'Nibbāna is mixed with suffering', and here we find a reason 'Nibbāna is mixed with suffering'. What is the reason here? Those who, venerable Nāgasena, seek Nibbāna, for them is seen ardour and torment of body and mind, restraint in standing, walking, sitting, lying down and food, and obstruction of torpor, and oppression of the sense bases, and abandoning of wealth, grain, dear ones, relatives and friends. Whoever in the world are happy, devoted to happiness, all of them delight and develop the sense bases with the five types of sensual pleasure; they delight and develop the eye with forms of many kinds of beautiful signs, pleasing and displeasing; they delight and develop the ear with sounds of many kinds of beautiful signs, pleasing and displeasing, of song and music; they delight and develop the nose with odours of many kinds of beautiful signs, pleasing and displeasing, of flowers, fruits, leaves, bark, roots and heartwood; they delight and develop the tongue with flavours of many kinds of beautiful signs, pleasing and displeasing, of hard food, soft food, food to be licked, food to be drunk and food to be tasted; they delight and develop the body with contacts of many kinds of beautiful signs, pleasing and displeasing, smooth, subtle, soft and gentle; they delight and develop the mind with attention of many kinds of applied thought, pleasing and displeasing, good and bad, beautiful and ugly. You strike and injure, cut and cut off, obstruct and block that development of eye, ear, nose, tongue, body and mind. By that the body is tormented, the mind too is tormented; when the body is tormented, one feels bodily painful feeling; when the mind is tormented, one feels mental painful feeling. Did not the wandering ascetic Māgaṇḍiya too, censuring the Blessed One, say thus: 'The ascetic Gotama is a destroyer of growth'? This is the reason here, by which reason I say 'Nibbāna is mixed with suffering.'"

"No indeed, great king, Nibbāna is not mixed with suffering; Nibbāna is exclusively pleasant. But as for what you, great king, say 'Nibbāna is suffering', that suffering is not called Nibbāna; rather this is the preliminary part for the realisation of Nibbāna, this is the quest for Nibbāna; Nibbāna is indeed exclusively pleasant, great king, not mixed with suffering. I will tell the reason here. Is there, great king, for kings something called the happiness of kingship?" "Yes, venerable sir, there is for kings the happiness of kingship." "Is that happiness of kingship, great king, mixed with suffering?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But why then, great king, do kings, when the borderland is agitated, for the restraint of those dwelling in the borderland, surrounded by ministers, leaders, soldiers and army members, having gone abroad, afflicted by gadflies, mosquitoes, wind and heat, run about on even and uneven ground, and make great war, and reach danger to life?" "That, venerable Nāgasena, is not called the happiness of kingship; this is the preliminary part for the quest of the happiness of kingship. With suffering, venerable Nāgasena, kings, having sought kingship, experience the happiness of kingship. Thus, venerable Nāgasena, the happiness of kingship is not mixed with suffering; that happiness of kingship is one thing, suffering is another." "Just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna is exclusively pleasant, not mixed with suffering. But those who seek that Nibbāna, having tormented body and mind, having restrained standing, walking, sitting, lying down and food, having obstructed torpor, having oppressed the sense bases, having abandoned body and life, having sought Nibbāna with suffering, experience Nibbāna which is exclusively pleasant, like kings who experience the happiness of kingship after defeating their enemies. Thus, great king, Nibbāna is exclusively pleasant, not mixed with suffering; Nibbāna is one thing, suffering is another."

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a further reason that Nibbāna is exclusively pleasant, not mixed with suffering; suffering is one thing, Nibbāna is another. Is there, great king, for teachers who possess craft something called the happiness of craft?" "Yes, venerable sir, there is for teachers who possess craft the happiness of craft." "Is that happiness of craft, great king, mixed with suffering?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But why then, great king, do teachers, by paying respect and rising up for teachers, by bringing water, sweeping the house, providing tooth-sticks and water for the mouth, by receiving leftovers, by rubbing, bathing and attending to the feet, having set aside their own mind, by following another's mind, by uncomfortable sleeping, by irregular food, torment the body?" "That, venerable Nāgasena, is not called the happiness of craft; this is the preliminary part for the quest of craft. With suffering, venerable Nāgasena, teachers, having sought craft, experience the happiness of craft. Thus, venerable Nāgasena, the happiness of craft is not mixed with suffering; that happiness of craft is one thing, suffering is another." "Just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna is exclusively pleasant, not mixed with suffering. But those who seek that Nibbāna, having tormented body and mind, having restrained standing, walking, sitting, lying down and food, having obstructed torpor, having oppressed the sense bases, having abandoned body and life, having sought Nibbāna with suffering, experience Nibbāna which is exclusively pleasant, like teachers the happiness of craft. Thus, great king, Nibbāna is exclusively pleasant, not mixed with suffering; suffering is one thing, Nibbāna is another." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on Nibbāna as exclusively pleasant is the ninth.

10.

The Question on the Form and Shape of Nibbāna

10. "Venerable Nāgasena, as for what you say 'Nibbāna, Nibbāna', but is it possible to show the form or shape or passing away or measure of that Nibbāna by simile or by reason or by cause or by method?" "Nibbāna is without counterpart, great king; it is not possible to show the form or shape or passing away or measure of Nibbāna by simile or by reason or by cause or by method." "This I do not accept, Venerable Nāgasena, that there is no declaration of the form or shape or passing away or measure of Nibbāna, which is an existing phenomenon, by simile or by reason or by cause or by method; convince me by a reason." "Let it be so, great king, I will convince you by a reason. Is there, great king, what is called the great ocean?" "Yes, venerable sir, there is that great ocean." "If, great king, someone were to ask you thus: 'How much, great king, is the water in the great ocean, and how many are those beings who dwell in the great ocean?' - thus asked, great king, how would you answer him?" "If, venerable sir, someone were to ask me thus: 'How much, great king, is the water in the great ocean, and how many are those beings who dwell in the great ocean?' - I, venerable sir, would say thus to him: 'You ask me, my good man, what should not be asked; this question should not be asked by anyone; this question should be set aside. The great ocean has not been analysed by those who describe the world; it is not possible to measure the water in the great ocean or the beings who have come to dwell there' - thus, venerable sir, I would give him an answer."

"But why, great king, would you give such an answer about the great ocean, which is an existing phenomenon? Should it not be told to him after calculating: 'This much is the water in the great ocean, and this many beings dwell in the great ocean'?" "It is not possible, venerable sir; this question is outside the domain."

"Just as, great king, in the great ocean, which is indeed an existing phenomenon, it is not possible to calculate the water or the beings who have come to dwell there, just so indeed, great king, it is not possible to show the form or shape or passing away or measure of Nibbāna, which is indeed an existing phenomenon, by simile or by reason or by cause or by method. One possessing supernormal power, having attained mastery of mind, great king, might calculate the water in the great ocean and the beings dwelling there, but even that one possessing supernormal power, having attained mastery of mind, would not be able to show the form or shape or passing away or measure of Nibbāna by simile or by reason or by cause or by method.

"Furthermore, great king, listen to a further reason why it is not possible to show the form or shape or passing away or measure of Nibbāna, which is indeed an existing phenomenon, by simile or by reason or by cause or by method. Are there, great king, among the gods, gods called immaterial-bodied?" "Yes, venerable sir, it is heard: 'There are among the gods, gods called immaterial-bodied.'" "But is it possible, great king, to show the form or shape or passing away or measure of those immaterial-bodied gods by simile or by reason or by cause or by method?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "If so, great king, are there no immaterial-bodied gods?" "There are, venerable sir, immaterial-bodied gods, but it is not possible to show their form or shape or passing away or measure by simile or by reason or by cause or by method." "Just as, great king, it is not possible to show the form or shape or passing away or measure of the immaterial-bodied gods, who are indeed existing beings, by simile or by reason or by cause or by method, just so indeed, great king, it is not possible to show the form or shape or passing away or measure of Nibbāna, which is indeed an existing phenomenon, by simile or by reason or by cause or by method."

"Venerable Nāgasena, let Nibbāna be exclusively happiness, but it is not possible to show its matter or shape or passing away or measure by simile or by reason or by cause or by method. But is there, venerable sir, any simile and comparison whatsoever that has entered into the quality of Nibbāna from other things?" "In terms of its own form, great king, there is not, but in terms of quality it is possible to show some simile and comparison." "Excellent, venerable Nāgasena, in such a way that I may obtain even a partial illustration of the quality of Nibbāna, speak quickly thus, quench the fever of my heart, remove it with the breeze of cool and sweet words."

"One quality of the lotus, great king, has entered into Nibbāna, two qualities of water, three qualities of medicine, four qualities of the great ocean, five qualities of food, ten qualities of space, three qualities of the jewel gem, three qualities of red sandalwood, three qualities of the cream of ghee, five qualities of a mountain peak have entered into Nibbāna."

"Venerable Nāgasena, when you say 'one quality of the lotus has entered into Nibbāna', what is the one quality of the lotus that has entered into Nibbāna?" "Just as, great king, a lotus is untainted by water, even so, great king, Nibbāna is untainted by all mental defilements. This, great king, is the one quality of the lotus that has entered into Nibbāna."

"Venerable Nāgasena, when you say 'two qualities of water have entered into Nibbāna', what are the two qualities of water that have entered into Nibbāna?" "Just as, great king, water is cool and quenches fever, even so, great king, Nibbāna is cool and quenches the fever of all mental defilements. This, great king, is the first quality of water that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, water removes the thirst of people and cattle and offspring who are weary, parched, thirsty, and scorched by heat, even so, great king, Nibbāna removes the thirst of sensual craving, craving for existence, and craving for non-existence. This, great king, is the second quality of water that has entered into Nibbāna. These, great king, are the two qualities of water that have entered into Nibbāna."

"Venerable Nāgasena, when you say 'three qualities of medicine have entered into Nibbāna', what are the three qualities of medicine that have entered into Nibbāna?" "Just as, great king, medicine is a refuge for beings oppressed by poison, even so, great king, Nibbāna is a refuge for beings oppressed by the poison of mental defilements. This, great king, is the first quality of medicine that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, medicine puts an end to diseases, even so, great king, Nibbāna puts an end to all suffering. This, great king, is the second quality of medicine that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, medicine is the Deathless, even so, great king, Nibbāna is the Deathless. This, great king, is the third quality of medicine that has entered into Nibbāna. These, great king, are the three qualities of medicine that have entered into Nibbāna."

"Venerable Nāgasena, when you say 'four qualities of the great ocean have entered into Nibbāna', what are the four qualities of the great ocean that have entered into Nibbāna?" "Just as, great king, the great ocean is empty of all corpses, even so, great king, Nibbāna is empty of all corpses of mental defilements. This, great king, is the first quality of the great ocean that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, the great ocean is great, without a near or far shore, and is not filled by all rivers, even so, great king, Nibbāna is great, without a near or far shore, and is not filled by all beings. This, great king, is the second quality of the great ocean that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, the great ocean is the residence of great beings, even so, great king, Nibbāna is the residence of great Worthy Ones, great beings who are stainless, who have eliminated the mental corruptions, who have attained power, and who have become masters. This, great king, is the third quality of the great ocean that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, the great ocean is bedecked with the flowers of limitless, various, and extensive waves, even so, great king, Nibbāna is bedecked with the flowers of limitless, various, extensive, pure true knowledge and liberation. This, great king, is the fourth quality of the great ocean that has entered into Nibbāna. These, great king, are the four qualities of the great ocean that have entered into Nibbāna."

"Venerable Nāgasena, when you say 'five qualities of food have entered into Nibbāna', what are the five qualities of food that have entered into Nibbāna?" "Just as, great king, food sustains the life of all beings, even so, great king, Nibbāna when realized sustains life through the removal of ageing and death. This, great king, is the first quality of food that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, food increases the strength of all beings, even so, great king, Nibbāna when realized increases the supernormal power of all beings. This, great king, is the second quality of food that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, food produces beauty in all beings, even so, great king, Nibbāna when realized produces the beauty of virtues in all beings. This, great king, is the third quality of food that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, food appeases the disturbance of all beings, even so, great king, Nibbāna when realized appeases the disturbance of all mental defilements in all beings. This, great king, is the fourth quality of food that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, food removes the hunger and weakness of all beings, even so, great king, Nibbāna when realized removes the hunger and weakness of all suffering in all beings. This, great king, is the fifth quality of food that has entered into Nibbāna. These, great king, are the five qualities of food that have entered into Nibbāna."

"Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'ten qualities of space have entered into Nibbāna', what are the ten qualities of space that have entered into Nibbāna?" "Just as, great king, space is not born, does not age, does not die, does not pass away, does not arise, is difficult to overcome, cannot be taken by thieves, is independent, is the path of birds, is unobstructed, is infinite. Just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna is not born, does not age, does not die, does not pass away, does not arise, is difficult to overcome, cannot be taken by thieves, is independent, is the path of the noble ones, is unobstructed, is infinite. These, great king, are the ten qualities of space that have entered into Nibbāna."

"Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'three qualities of the jewel gem have entered into Nibbāna', what are the three qualities of the jewel gem that have entered into Nibbāna?" "Just as, great king, the jewel gem grants desires, just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna grants desires. This, great king, is the first quality of the jewel gem that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, the jewel gem brings delight, just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna brings delight. This, great king, is the second quality of the jewel gem that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, the jewel gem produces radiance, just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna produces radiance. This, great king, is the third quality of the jewel gem that has entered into Nibbāna. These, great king, are the three qualities of the jewel gem that have entered into Nibbāna."

"Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'three qualities of red sandalwood have entered into Nibbāna', what are the three qualities of red sandalwood that have entered into Nibbāna?" "Just as, great king, red sandalwood is rare, just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna is rare. This, great king, is the first quality of red sandalwood that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, red sandalwood has an incomparable fragrance, just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna has an incomparable fragrance. This, great king, is the second quality of red sandalwood that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, red sandalwood is praised by good people, just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna is praised by noble good people. This, great king, is the third quality of red sandalwood that has entered into Nibbāna. These, great king, are the three qualities of red sandalwood that have entered into Nibbāna."

"Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'three qualities of the cream of ghee have entered into Nibbāna', what are the three qualities of the cream of ghee that have entered into Nibbāna?" "Just as, great king, the cream of ghee is endowed with colour, just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna is endowed with the colour of virtues. This, great king, is the first quality of the cream of ghee that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, the cream of ghee is endowed with fragrance, just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna is endowed with the fragrance of morality. This, great king, is the second quality of the cream of ghee that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, the cream of ghee is endowed with flavour, just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna is endowed with flavour. This, great king, is the third quality of the cream of ghee that has entered into Nibbāna. These, great king, are the three qualities of the cream of ghee that have entered into Nibbāna."

"Venerable Nāgasena, as for this that you say 'five qualities of a mountain peak have entered into Nibbāna', what are the five qualities of a mountain peak that have entered into Nibbāna?" "Just as, great king, a mountain peak is very lofty, just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna is very lofty. This, great king, is the first quality of a mountain peak that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, a mountain peak is immovable, just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna is immovable. This, great king, is the second quality of a mountain peak that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, a mountain peak is difficult to climb, just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna is difficult to climb for all defilements. This, great king, is the third quality of a mountain peak that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, a mountain peak is a place where no seeds grow, just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna is a place where no defilements grow. This, great king, is the fourth quality of a mountain peak that has entered into Nibbāna. Furthermore, great king, a mountain peak is free from attachment and aversion, just so indeed, great king, Nibbāna is free from attachment and aversion. This, great king, is the fifth quality of a mountain peak that has entered into Nibbāna. These, great king, are the five qualities of a mountain peak that have entered into Nibbāna." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the form and shape of Nibbāna is the tenth.

11.

The Question on the Realization of Nibbāna

11. "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'Nibbāna is not past, not future, not present, not arisen, not unarisen, not to be produced.' Here, Venerable Nāgasena, whoever is rightly practising realizes Nibbāna, does he realize what is arisen, or does he realize having produced it?" "Whoever, great king, is rightly practising realizes Nibbāna, he does not realize what is arisen, he does not realize having produced it; but moreover, great king, there is this element of Nibbāna, which one rightly practising realizes."

"Do not, Venerable Nāgasena, explain this question having made it concealed; having made it opened and manifest, explain it. I am desirous and eager; whatever has been trained by you, scatter all that right here. Here this person is confused, has become doubtful, has plunged into uncertainty; break this inner dart of fault." "There is, great king, this element of Nibbāna, peaceful, pleasant, sublime; one rightly practising, meditating on activities according to the Conqueror's instruction, realizes it with wisdom. Just as, great king, a pupil realizes true knowledge with wisdom according to the teacher's instruction, just so indeed, great king, one rightly practising realizes Nibbāna with wisdom according to the Conqueror's instruction.

"But how should that Nibbāna be seen?" It should be seen as free from affliction, free from danger, free from fear, as security, as peaceful, as pleasant, as comfortable, as sublime, as pure, as cool.

"Just as, great king, a man being burnt by fire with a large heap of firewood, blazing with burning wood, by effort having freed himself from there, having entered a place free from fire, would obtain the highest happiness there; just so indeed, great king, whoever is rightly practising, by wise attention realizes the highest happiness of Nibbāna, free from the torment of the threefold fire. Just as, great king, fire, so should the threefold fire be seen; just as a man gone into fire, so should one rightly practising be seen; just as a place free from fire, so should Nibbāna be seen.

"Or else, great king, just as a man gone into a heap of portions of bodily secretions of corpses of snakes, dogs, and humans, having entered among the tangled mass of corpses, by effort having freed himself from there, having entered a place free from corpses, would obtain the highest happiness there; just so indeed, great king, whoever is rightly practising, by wise attention realizes the highest happiness of Nibbāna, free from the corpse of mental defilements. Just as, great king, a corpse, so should the five types of sensual pleasure be seen; just as a man gone into corpses, so should one rightly practising be seen; just as a place free from corpses, so should Nibbāna be seen.

"Or else, great king, just as a man frightened, trembling, shaking, with mind perverted and confused, by effort having freed himself from there, having entered a firm, stable, unshakeable, fearless place, would obtain the highest happiness there; just so indeed, great king, whoever is rightly practising, by wise attention realizes the highest happiness of Nibbāna, free from fear and terror. Just as, great king, fear, so should the fear that occurs again and again dependent on birth, ageing, illness, and death be seen; just as a frightened man, so should one rightly practising be seen; just as a fearless place, so should Nibbāna be seen.

"Or else, great king, just as a man fallen in a defiled, dirty, muddy, miry place, by effort having washed away that mud and mire, having gone to a pure, spotless place, would obtain the highest happiness there; just so indeed, great king, whoever is rightly practising, by wise attention realizes the highest happiness of Nibbāna, free from the mire of defilement and stain. Just as, great king, mud, so should material gain, honour, and fame be seen; just as a man gone into mud, so should one rightly practising be seen; just as a pure, spotless place, so should Nibbāna be seen.

"But how does one rightly practising realize that Nibbāna? Whoever, great king, is rightly practising, he meditates on the occurrence of activities. Meditating on the occurrence, therein he sees birth, he sees ageing, he sees illness, he sees death; therein he sees nothing of happiness or comfort, from the beginning, from the middle, or from the end. Therein he sees nothing fit to be grasped. Just as, great king, a man sees no place fit to be grasped from the beginning, from the middle, or from the end in an iron ball heated by the day, blazing, heated, glowing; just so indeed, great king, whoever meditates on the occurrence of activities, meditating on the occurrence, therein he sees birth, he sees ageing, he sees illness, he sees death; therein he sees nothing of happiness or comfort, from the beginning, from the middle, or from the end. Therein he sees nothing fit to be grasped; for him not seeing anything fit to be grasped, discontent becomes established in the mind, burning enters the body; he, without shelter, without refuge, having become without refuge, becomes disenchanted with existences.

"Just as, great king, a man might enter a blazing mass of flames, a great mass of fire, and there, without shelter, without refuge, having become without refuge, he would become disenchanted with the fire, just so indeed, great king, for one not seeing anything fit to be grasped, discontent becomes established in the mind, burning comes upon the body, and he, without shelter, without refuge, having become without refuge, becomes disenchanted with existences.

"For him who sees danger in occurrence, such a thought arises: 'This occurrence is indeed heated, ablaze, with much suffering, with much anguish. If anyone could obtain non-occurrence, this is peaceful, this is sublime, that is to say, the stilling of all activities, the relinquishment of all clinging, the elimination of craving, dispassion, cessation, Nibbāna.' Thus indeed his mind springs forward to non-occurrence, becomes clear, becomes joyful, becomes satisfied: 'I have attained the escape.'

"Just as, great king, a man who has lost his way, having strayed into a foreign land, having seen the way out, springs forward there, becomes clear, becomes joyful, becomes satisfied: 'I have attained the way out,' just so indeed, great king, for one who sees danger in occurrence, the mind springs forward to non-occurrence, becomes clear, becomes joyful, becomes satisfied: 'I have attained the escape.'

"He strives for the path for the purpose of non-occurrence, seeks it, develops it, cultivates it. For him, mindfulness becomes established for that purpose, energy becomes established for that purpose, joy becomes established for that purpose. For him, attending again and again to that mind, having transcended occurrence, he enters non-occurrence. Having attained non-occurrence, great king, one practising rightly is said to 'realize Nibbāna.'" "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, thus I accept this as true."

The question on the realization of Nibbāna is the eleventh.

12.

The Question on the Location of Nibbāna

12. "Venerable Nāgasena, is there that place in the eastern direction or the southern direction or the western direction or the northern direction or above or below or across, where Nibbāna is placed?" "There is not, great king, that place in the eastern direction or the southern direction or the western direction or the northern direction or above or below or across, where Nibbāna is placed."

"If, Venerable Nāgasena, there is no place where Nibbāna is placed, then there is no Nibbāna? And for those by whom that Nibbāna has been realized, their realization too is wrong. I will state the reason there. Just as, Venerable Nāgasena, there is a field on earth as a source of grain, there is a flower as a source of fragrance, there is a bush as a source of flowers, there is a tree as a source of fruit, there is a mine as a source of jewels - whoever there desires whatever, he, having gone there, takes that very thing - just so indeed, Venerable Nāgasena, if there is Nibbāna, a place of origin for that Nibbāna should also be expected. But because, Venerable Nāgasena, there is no place of origin for Nibbāna, therefore I say there is no Nibbāna, and for those by whom Nibbāna has been realized, their realization too is wrong."

"There is not, great king, a place where Nibbāna is placed, yet there is this Nibbāna; one rightly practising by wise attention realizes Nibbāna. Just as, great king, there is what is called fire, there is no place where it is placed, but by rubbing two sticks together one attains fire. Just so indeed, great king, there is Nibbāna, there is no place where it is placed; one rightly practising by wise attention realizes Nibbāna.

"Or else, great king, there are what are called the seven treasures. As follows: the wheel treasure, the elephant treasure, the horse treasure, the jewel treasure, the woman treasure, the householder treasure, and the adviser treasure. And there is no place where those treasures are placed, but by the power of practice they approach a warrior of the warrior caste who is rightly practising. Just so indeed, great king, there is Nibbāna, there is no place where it is placed; one rightly practising by wise attention realizes Nibbāna."

"Venerable Nāgasena, let there not be a place where Nibbāna is placed, but is there that state where one standing, rightly practising, realizes Nibbāna?" "Yes, great king, there is that state where one standing, rightly practising, realizes Nibbāna."

"But what, venerable sir, is that state where one standing, rightly practising, realizes Nibbāna?" "Morality, great king, is the state; one established in morality, wisely attending, standing in the forest of the Sakas or in China or in Alexandria or in Nikumba or in Kāsi-Kosala or in Kashmir or in Gandhāra or on a mountain peak or in the Brahma world or wherever at all, rightly practising, realizes Nibbāna. Just as, great king, whoever is a man with eyes, standing in the forest of the Sakas or in China or in Alexandria or in Nikumba or in Kāsi-Kosala or in Kashmir or in Gandhāra or on a mountain peak or in the Brahma world or wherever at all, sees space; just so indeed, great king, one established in morality, wisely attending, in the forest of the Sakas, etc. standing wherever at all, rightly practising, realizes Nibbāna.

"Or else, great king, in the forest of the Sakas, etc. for one standing wherever at all, there is the eastern direction; just so indeed, great king, for one established in morality, wisely attending, in the forest of the Sakas, etc. for one standing wherever at all, rightly practising, there is the realization of Nibbāna." "Excellent, Venerable Nāgasena, Nibbāna has been taught by you, the realization of Nibbāna has been taught, the virtues of morality have been equipped, right practice has been shown, the banner of the Teaching has been raised, the guideline of the Teaching has been established, the right exertion of those well-applied is not barren; thus I accept this as true, O most excellent of excellent teachers."

The question on the location of Nibbāna is the twelfth.

The Vessantara Chapter is the third.

In this chapter there are twelve questions.

4.

The Chapter on Inference

1.

The Question of Inference

1. Then King Milinda approached the Venerable Nāgasena; having approached, having paid respect to the Venerable Nāgasena, he sat down to one side. Seated to one side, King Milinda, wishing to know, wishing to hear, wishing to retain, wishing to see the light of knowledge, wishing to break through not knowing, wishing to produce the light of knowledge, wishing to remove the darkness of ignorance, having established exceeding courage and endeavour and mindfulness and full awareness, said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "Venerable Nāgasena, has the Buddha been seen by you?" "No indeed, great king." "Then has the Buddha been seen by your teachers?" "No indeed, great king." "Venerable Nāgasena, it seems the Buddha has not been seen by you, nor it seems has the Buddha been seen by your teachers; if so, Venerable Nāgasena, there is no Buddha, for here no Buddha is evident."

"But are there, great king, former warriors who were the forerunners of your warrior lineage?" "Yes, venerable sir. What doubt is there? There are former warriors who were the forerunners of my warrior lineage." "Have the former warriors been previously seen by you, great king?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "But those who instruct you, great king - chaplains, generals, judges, chief ministers - have the former warriors been previously seen by them?" "No indeed, venerable sir." "If, great king, the former warriors have not been seen by you, nor it seems have the former warriors been seen by your instructors, then there are no former warriors, for here no former warriors are evident."

"There are seen, Venerable Nāgasena, articles of use enjoyed by the former warriors. As follows: the white parasol, the turban, the sandals, the yak-tail fan, the sword-jewel, and very costly beds. By which we would know and believe: 'There are former warriors.'" "Just so indeed, great king, we too would know and believe in that Blessed One. There is that reason, by which reason we would know and believe: 'There is that Blessed One.' What is that reason? There are indeed, great king, articles of use enjoyed by that Blessed One, who knows and sees, the Worthy One, the perfectly Self-awakened One. As follows: the four establishments of mindfulness, the four right strivings, the four bases for spiritual power, the five faculties, the five powers, the seven factors of enlightenment, the noble eightfold path - by which the world with its gods knows and believes: 'There is that Blessed One.' By this reason, great king, by this cause, by this method, by this inference, it should be known: 'There is that Blessed One.'

"Venerable Nāgasena, give a simile." "Just as, great king, a city builder, wishing to build a city, first having surveyed a piece of land that is level, neither elevated nor depressed, without gravel and stones, free from danger and faultless, delightful, whatever therein is uneven, having had that made level, having had stumps and thorns cleared away, might build there a city - beautiful, well-divided, measured in sections, with excavated moats and walls, with strong gateways, watchtowers and porches, with many courtyards, crossroads, junctions and intersections, with clean, level, smooth royal highways, with well-divided market places, endowed with parks, pleasure groves, lakes, lotus ponds and wells, adorned with various kinds of shrines, free from all faults - and he, when that city had attained full expansion in every way, might depart to another region; then that city at a later time might become successful, prosperous, with abundant food, secure, flourishing, safe, free from harm, free from danger, crowded with various people - many warriors, brahmins, merchants, workers, elephant riders, horse riders, charioteers, infantry soldiers, archers, swordsmen, standard-bearers, camp marshals, food distributors, fierce warrior princes, charging warriors, great warriors, heroes, armoured warriors, soldiers, sons of slave women, sons of soldiers, wrestlers, accountants, cooks, chefs, barbers, bath attendants, turners, garland-makers, goldsmiths, silversmiths, lead workers, tin workers, copper workers, lathe workers, iron workers, gem-cutters, weavers, potters, bamboo workers, salt makers, tanners, chariot-makers, ivory workers, rope-makers, brush-makers, thread-makers, reed workers, bow-makers, bowstring-makers, arrow-makers, painters, dyers, washermen, loom weavers, tailors, money-changers, cloth dealers, perfumers, grass-carriers, wood-carriers, hired servants, leaf-sellers, fruit-sellers, root-sellers, rice-gruel sellers, cake-sellers, fish-sellers, meat-sellers, liquor-sellers, performers, dancers, acrobats, magicians, vetāla performers, wrestlers, corpse-burners, rubbish removers, basket-makers, hunters, courtesans, dancing girls, water-carrying slave women, Sakas, Greeks, Chinese, Vilātas, Ujjenikas, Bhārukacchakas, Kāsis, Kosalans, Parantakas, Magadhans, Sāketans, Soreyyans, Pāveyyans, Koṭumbarans, Mathurans, Alasandans, Kasmīrans, Gandhārans - people from various regions having come to that city to dwell, having seen that city, new, well-divided, without fault, faultless, delightful, they know by inference: 'Skilled indeed, friend, is that city builder who is the builder of this city.' Just so indeed, great king, that Blessed One is matchless, equal to the matchless, without equal, incomparable, unequalled, incalculable, immeasurable, boundless, of immeasurable virtue, having attained the perfection of virtues, of infinite courage, of infinite radiance, of infinite energy, of infinite power, having gone to the perfection of the Buddha's powers, having defeated Māra with his army, having broken through the net of wrong views, having dispelled ignorance, having produced true knowledge, having held aloft the torch of the Teaching, having attained omniscience, victorious in battle, established the city of the Teaching.

The Blessed One's city of the Teaching, great king, has morality as its wall, shame as its moat, knowledge as its gateway porch, energy as its watchtower, faith as its pillar, mindfulness as its doorkeeper, wisdom as its palace, the discourses as its courtyard, the higher teaching as its crossroads, the discipline as its judgment hall, the establishments of mindfulness as its street. And in that street of the establishments of mindfulness, great king, such shops are spread out. As follows: the flower shop, the perfume shop, the fruit shop, the medicine shop, the herb shop, the deathless shop, the jewel shop, the general shop."

"Venerable Nāgasena, what is the flower shop of the Buddha, the Blessed One?" "There are indeed, great king, classifications of objects declared by that Blessed One, who knows and sees, the Worthy One, the perfectly Self-awakened One. As follows: perception of impermanence, perception of suffering, perception of non-self, perception of foulness, perception of danger, perception of abandoning, perception of dispassion, perception of cessation, perception of non-delight in the entire world, perception of impermanence in all activities, mindfulness of breathing, perception of the bloated, perception of the discoloured, perception of the festering, perception of the full of holes, perception of the gnawed, perception of the scattered, perception of the hacked and scattered, perception of the bloody, perception of worms, perception of a skeleton, perception of friendliness, perception of compassion, perception of altruistic joy, perception of equanimity, recollection of death, mindfulness of the body - these, great king, are the classifications of objects declared by the Buddha, the Blessed One. Therein, whoever wishes to be released from ageing and death, he takes up one of those objects; by that object he becomes liberated from lust, becomes liberated from hate, becomes liberated from delusion, becomes liberated from conceit, becomes liberated from wrong view, crosses over the round of rebirths, prevents the stream of craving, purifies the threefold stain, and having destroyed all defilements, having entered the stainless, dustless, pure, white, birthless, ageless, deathless, happy, cooled, fearless, excellent city, the city of Nibbāna, he liberates the mind in arahantship. This is called, great king, 'the flower shop of the Blessed One.'

"Venerable Nāgasena, what is the perfume shop of the Buddha, the Blessed One?" "There are indeed, great king, classifications of morality declared by that Blessed One, by which fragrance of morality the sons of the Blessed One, anointed, perfume and thoroughly perfume the world with its gods with the fragrance of morality; they blow and blow beyond in the direction and the intermediate direction, with the wind and against the wind, having pervaded, they remain. What are those classifications of morality? The morality of refuge, the five-factored morality, the eight-factored morality, the ten-factored morality, the morality of restraint according to the Pātimokkha included in the five recitations. This is called, great king, 'the perfume shop of the Blessed One.' This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One, the god above gods -

"Venerable Nāgasena, what is the fruit shop of the Buddha, the Blessed One?" "Fruits indeed, great king, have been declared by the Blessed One. As follows: the fruition of stream-entry, the fruition of once-returning, the fruition of non-returning, the fruition of arahantship, the attainment of the fruition of emptiness, the attainment of the fruition of the signless, the attainment of the fruition of the desireless. Therein, whoever desires whatever fruit, he, having given the root of action, buys the wished-for fruit. Whether the fruition of stream-entry, whether the fruition of once-returning, whether the fruition of non-returning, whether the fruition of arahantship, whether the attainment of the fruition of emptiness, whether the attainment of the fruition of the signless, whether the attainment of the fruition of the desireless. Just as, great king, a certain man might have a mango tree bearing fruit constantly; he does not drop fruits from it until buyers come; but when a buyer has arrived, having taken the price, he tells thus: 'My good man, this is indeed a mango tree bearing fruit constantly; from it, whatever you wish, take that much fruit - whether unripe, whether half-ripe, whether fibrous, whether raw, whether ripe.' He, with the price given by himself, if he wishes for unripe, takes unripe; if he wishes for half-ripe, takes half-ripe; if he wishes for fibrous, takes fibrous; if he wishes for raw, takes raw; if he wishes for ripe, takes ripe. Just so indeed, great king, whoever desires whatever fruit, he, having given the root of action, takes the wished-for fruit, whether the fruition of stream-entry, etc. whether the attainment of the fruition of the desireless. This is called, great king, 'the fruit shop of the Blessed One.'

"Venerable Nāgasena, what is the medicine shop of the Buddha, the Blessed One?" "Medicines indeed, great king, have been declared by the Blessed One, by which medicines that Blessed One releases the world with its gods from the poison of defilements. But what are those medicines? These, great king, are the four noble truths declared by the Blessed One. As follows: the noble truth of suffering, the noble truth of the origin of suffering, the noble truth of the cessation of suffering, the noble truth of the practice leading to the cessation of suffering. Therein, whoever expecting final liberating knowledge hears the teaching of the four truths, they are released from birth, they are released from ageing, they are released from death, they are released from sorrow, lamentation, suffering, displeasure, and anguish. This is called, great king, 'the medicine shop of the Blessed One.'"

"Venerable Nāgasena, what is the Blessed One, the Buddha's medicine shop?" "Medicines indeed, great king, have been declared by the Blessed One, with which medicines that Blessed One treats gods and humans. As follows: the four establishments of mindfulness, the four right strivings, the four bases for spiritual power, the five faculties, the five powers, the seven factors of enlightenment, the noble eightfold path; with these medicines the Blessed One purges wrong view, purges wrong thought, purges wrong speech, purges wrong action, purges wrong livelihood, purges wrong effort, purges wrong mindfulness, purges wrong concentration; he causes the vomiting of greed, causes the vomiting of hate, causes the vomiting of delusion, causes the vomiting of conceit, causes the vomiting of views, causes the vomiting of doubt, causes the vomiting of restlessness, causes the vomiting of sloth and torpor, causes the vomiting of shamelessness and moral fearlessness, causes the vomiting of all mental defilements. This is called, great king, 'the Blessed One's medicine shop.'

"Venerable Nāgasena, what is the Blessed One, the Buddha's deathless shop?" "The Deathless indeed, great king, has been declared by the Blessed One, with which Deathless that Blessed One sprinkled the world with its gods; sprinkled with which Deathless, gods and humans were released from birth, ageing, illness, death, sorrow, lamentation, suffering, displeasure, and anguish. What is that Deathless? That is to say, mindfulness of the body. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One, the god above gods: 'Those, monks, consume the Deathless who consume mindfulness of the body.' This is called, great king, 'the Blessed One's deathless shop.'

"Venerable Nāgasena, what is the Blessed One, the Buddha's jewel shop?" "Jewels indeed, great king, have been declared by the Blessed One, adorned with which jewels the Blessed One's sons shine, illuminate, radiate, blaze, and burn forth in the world with its gods, showing light above, below, and across. What are those jewels? The jewel of morality, the jewel of concentration, the jewel of wisdom, the jewel of liberation, the jewel of knowledge and vision of liberation, the jewel of analytical knowledge, the jewel of the factors of enlightenment.

"What, great king, is the Blessed One's jewel of morality? Morality of restraint according to the principal monastic code, morality of sense restraint, morality of purity of livelihood, morality consisting in the wise use of requisites, the lesser morality, the middle morality, the greater morality, path morality, fruition morality. Indeed, great king, the world with its gods, with its Māras, with its Brahmās, this generation with its ascetics and brahmins, desires and aspires to a person adorned with the jewel of morality. Indeed, great king, a monk wearing the jewel of morality shines and outshines in the directions, in the intermediate directions, above, below, and across; from below, taking Avīci, from above, taking the highest existence, in between here, having surpassed, overcome, and submerged all jewels, he stands. Such jewels of morality, great king, have been spread out in the Blessed One's jewel shop. This is called, great king, 'the Blessed One's jewel of morality.'

"What, great king, is the Blessed One's jewel of concentration? Concentration with applied and sustained thought, concentration without applied but with sustained thought only, concentration without applied and sustained thought, emptiness concentration, signless concentration, desireless concentration. Indeed, great king, for a monk wearing the jewel of concentration, whatever thoughts of sensuality, thoughts of anger, thoughts of violence, conceit, restlessness, views, doubt, bases of mental defilements, and various evil thoughts there are, all of them, having encountered concentration, scatter, disperse, and are destroyed; they do not remain, they do not adhere. Just as, great king, water scatters, disperses, and is destroyed on a lotus leaf; it does not remain, it does not adhere. What is the reason for this? Because of the purity of the lotus. Just so indeed, great king, for a monk wearing the jewel of concentration, whatever thoughts of sensuality, thoughts of anger, thoughts of violence, conceit, restlessness, views, doubt, bases of mental defilements, and various evil thoughts there are, all of them, having encountered concentration, scatter, disperse, and are destroyed; they do not remain, they do not adhere. What is the reason for this? Because of the purity of concentration. This is called, great king, 'the Blessed One's jewel of concentration.' Such jewels of concentration, great king, have been spread out in the Blessed One's jewel shop.

"What, great king, is the Blessed One's jewel of wisdom? By which wisdom, great king, a noble disciple understands as it really is 'this is wholesome,' understands as it really is 'this is unwholesome,' understands as it really is 'this is blameworthy, this is blameless, this should be cultivated, this should not be cultivated, this is inferior, this is superior, this is dark, this is bright, this partakes of both dark and bright,' understands as it really is 'this is suffering,' understands as it really is 'this is the origin of suffering,' understands as it really is 'this is the cessation of suffering,' understands as it really is 'this is the practice leading to the cessation of suffering.' This is called, great king, 'the Blessed One's jewel of wisdom.'

"What, great king, is the Blessed One's jewel of liberation?" "The jewel of liberation, great king, is called arahantship; a monk who has attained arahantship, great king, is called 'one adorned with the jewel of liberation.' Just as, great king, a man adorned with ornaments of strings of pearls, strings of gems, and strings of coral, with body anointed with aloe, tagara, talisa, black sandalwood, and red sandalwood, decorated with nāga flowers, punnāga flowers, sāla flowers, salaḷa flowers, campaka flowers, jasmine, atimuttaka flowers, pāṭali flowers, lotuses, vassika flowers, and jasmine, having surpassed the rest of the people, shines, outshines, radiates, illuminates, fully illuminates, blazes, blazes forth, overcomes, and overwhelms with garlands, fragrances, jewels, and ornaments; even so, great king, one who has attained arahantship, one who has eliminated the mental corruptions, adorned with the jewel of liberation, having surpassed and transcended monks liberated again and again, shines, outshines, radiates, illuminates, fully illuminates, blazes, blazes forth, overcomes, and overwhelms by liberation. What is the reason for this? This, great king, is the highest adornment of all adornments, that is to say, the adornment of liberation. This is called, great king, 'the Blessed One's jewel of liberation.'

"What, great king, is the Blessed One's jewel of knowledge and vision of liberation? Reviewing knowledge, great king, is called the Blessed One's jewel of knowledge and vision of liberation, by which knowledge a noble disciple reviews the path, fruition, Nibbāna, the abandoned defilements, and the remaining defilements.

"What, great king, is the Blessed One's jewel of analytical knowledge? There are, great king, four analytical knowledges: analytical knowledge of meaning, analytical knowledge of phenomena, analytical knowledge of language, and analytical knowledge of discernment. A monk adorned with these four jewels of analytical knowledge, great king, whatever assembly he approaches - whether an assembly of warriors, whether an assembly of brahmins, whether an assembly of householders, whether an assembly of ascetics - he approaches confident, unabashed, fearless, not terrified, not fearful, with terror gone, he approaches the assembly.

"Just as, great king, a warrior, a hero in battle, armed with five weapons, enters battle without fear, thinking 'If enemies are far away, I will strike them down with an arrow; if they are nearer than that, I will strike them with a spear; if they are nearer than that, I will strike them with a lance; if one has come close, I will cut him in two with the circular blade; if one has come upon my body, I will pierce him through with a dagger,' even so, great king, a monk adorned with the jewel of the four analytical knowledges approaches the assembly without fear. Whoever asks me a question about analytical knowledge of meaning, to him I will explain meaning by meaning, reason by reason, cause by cause, method by method; I will make it free from doubt, I will dispel uncertainty, I will satisfy him with the answering of questions.

"Whoever asks me a question about analytical knowledge of phenomena, to him I will explain phenomenon by phenomenon, the Deathless by the Deathless, the unconditioned by the unconditioned, Nibbāna by Nibbāna, emptiness by emptiness, the signless by the signless, the desireless by the desireless, the without longing by the without longing; I will make it free from doubt, I will dispel uncertainty, I will satisfy him with the answering of questions.

"Whoever asks me a question about analytical knowledge of language, to him I will explain language by language, term by term, word by word, syllable by syllable, connection by connection, phrase by phrase, feature by feature, letter by letter, vowel by vowel, concept by concept, conventional expression by conventional expression; I will make it free from doubt, I will dispel uncertainty, I will satisfy him with the answering of questions.

"Whoever asks me a question about analytical knowledge of discernment, to him I will explain discernment by discernment, simile by simile, characteristic by characteristic, function by function; I will make it free from doubt, I will dispel uncertainty, I will satisfy him with the answering of questions." This is called, great king, 'the Blessed One's jewel of analytical knowledge.'

"What, great king, is the Blessed One's jewel of the factors of enlightenment? There are these seven factors of enlightenment, great king: the enlightenment factor of mindfulness, the enlightenment factor of investigation of phenomena, the enlightenment factor of energy, the enlightenment factor of rapture, the enlightenment factor of tranquillity, the enlightenment factor of concentration, the enlightenment factor of equanimity. A monk adorned with these seven jewels of the factors of enlightenment, great king, having overcome all darkness, illuminates, radiates, and generates light for the world with its gods. This is called, great king, 'the Blessed One's jewel of the factors of enlightenment.'

"Venerable Nāgasena, what is the Buddha, the Blessed One's general store?" "The general store, great king, is the Blessed One's ninefold word of the Buddha, the bodily relics, the articles of use, the shrines, and the jewel of the Community. In the general store, great king, the Blessed One has displayed success in birth, success in wealth, success in life, success in health, success in beauty, success in wisdom, success in human existence, success in divine existence, success in Nibbāna. Therein, those who wish for this or that success, having given the root of action, buy whatever success they aspire for; some buy by undertaking morality, some buy by the Observance practice; even with a trifling root of action, taking again and again, they obtain successes. Just as, great king, in a shopkeeper's shop, with sesame, mung beans, and beans, even with a small amount of rice, mung beans, and beans, even with a small price, taking again and again, they take; even so, great king, in the Blessed One's general store, even with a trifling root of action, taking again and again, they obtain successes. This is called, great king, 'the Blessed One's general store.'

"In the Blessed One's city of the Teaching, great king, such people dwell: experts in the discourses, experts in the discipline, experts in the Abhidhamma, preachers of the Teaching, reciters of the Jātakas, reciters of the Long Collection, reciters of the Middle Collection, reciters of the Connected Collection, reciters of the Numerical Collection, reciters of the Minor Collection, accomplished in morality, accomplished in concentration, accomplished in wisdom, delighting in the development of enlightenment factors, gifted with introspection, devoted to their own welfare, forest dwellers, tree-root dwellers, open-air dwellers, heap-of-straw dwellers, cemetery dwellers, those who remain in a sitting position, practitioners, those stationed in fruition, trainees, possessors of fruition, stream-enterers, once-returners, non-returners, Worthy Ones, possessors of the threefold true knowledge, possessors of the six higher knowledges, possessing supernormal power, having reached perfection in wisdom, skilled in the establishments of mindfulness, right strivings, bases for spiritual power, faculties, powers, enlightenment factors, path, excellent meditative absorptions, deliverances, matter, and peaceful, happy meditative attainments; with those Worthy Ones, crowded and thronged, filled and overfilled, the city of the Teaching was like a reed forest or a lake forest. Here it is said -

"Those monks, great king, who bear unlimited excellent knowledge, without attachment, of incomparable virtue, of incomparable fame, of incomparable strength, of incomparable radiance, who set rolling the wheel of the Teaching, who have gone to the perfection of wisdom, such monks, great king, in the Blessed One's city of the Teaching are called 'generals of the Teaching'.

"But those monks, great king, who possess supernormal power, who have attained the analytical knowledges and reached self-confidence, who walk in the sky, difficult to approach, difficult to overcome, who walk without support, who shake the earth with its ocean and mountains, who touch the moon and sun, skilled in transformation, determination, and resolution, who have gone to perfection in supernormal power, such monks, great king, in the Blessed One's city of the Teaching are called 'chaplains'.

"But those monks, great king, who follow the ascetic practices, of few wishes, content, disgusted with intimation, mind, and search, who walk for alms successively from house to house, who like bees, having smelled the fragrance, enter the secluded forest, indifferent to body and life, having attained arahantship, placed foremost in the virtues of ascetic practices, such monks, great king, in the Blessed One's city of the Teaching are called 'judges'.

"But those monks, great king, who are pure, spotless, free from mental defilements, skilled in death and rebirth, who have gone to perfection in the divine eye, such monks, great king, in the Blessed One's city of the Teaching are called 'city illuminators'.

"But those monks, great king, who are very learned, who have learnt the collections, bearers of the Teaching, bearers of the monastic discipline, bearers of the matrices, skilled in distinguishing soft and aspirated, long and short, heavy and light syllables, bearers of the ninefold Dispensation, such monks, great king, in the Blessed One's city of the Teaching are called 'guardians of the Teaching'.

"But those monks, great king, who are knowers of the monastic discipline, skilled in the monastic discipline, skilled in what is possible and impossible, skilled in offence and non-offence, heavy and light, curable and incurable, emergence, confession, refutation, atonement, reinstatement, sending away, and reconciliation, who have gone to perfection in the monastic discipline, such monks, great king, in the Blessed One's city of the Teaching are called 'guardians of form'.

"But those monks, great king, who are bound with garlands of excellent flowers of liberation, who have attained the excellent, most excellent, costly, and foremost state, desired and wished for by many people, such monks, great king, in the Blessed One's city of the Teaching are called 'flower merchants'.

"But those monks, great king, who have penetrated the full realization of the four truths, who have seen the truth, who have cognised the teaching, who have crossed over doubt in the four fruits of asceticism, who have obtained the happiness of fruition, who share those fruits with others who are practising, such monks, great king, in the Blessed One's city of the Teaching are called 'fruit merchants'.

"But those monks, great king, who are anointed with the fragrance of restraint in morality, who bear many kinds of numerous virtues, who dispel the stench of the stain of mental defilements, such monks, great king, in the Blessed One's city of the Teaching are called 'perfume merchants'.

"But those monks, great king, who are lovers of the Teaching, of amiable conversation, having great gladness in the higher teaching and higher discipline, who whether gone to the forest, or gone to the root of a tree, or gone to an empty house, drink the excellent flavour of the Teaching, who are immersed in the excellent flavour of the Teaching by body, speech, and mind, of exceeding discernment, practising the search for the Teaching among teachings, from here or from there, wherever there is talk about fewness of wishes, talk about contentment, talk about solitude, talk about aloofness from society, talk about arousal of energy, talk about morality, talk about concentration, talk about wisdom, talk about liberation, talk about knowledge and vision of liberation, having gone there and there, they drink that and that flavour of talk, such monks, great king, in the Blessed One's city of the Teaching are called 'drunkards and thirsty ones'.

"But those monks, great king, who are devoted to the pursuit of wakefulness in the first and last watches of the night, who spend the day and night by sitting, standing, and walking meditation, devoted to the pursuit of meditation, intent on their own welfare for the warding off of mental defilements, such monks, great king, in the Blessed One's city of the Teaching are called 'city guards'.

"But those monks, great king, who recite and teach, speak and expound the ninefold word of the Buddha according to meaning and phrasing, method and reason, cause and example, such monks, great king, in the Blessed One's city of the Teaching are called 'Teaching merchants'.

"But those monks, great king, who are wealthy and rich with the wealth of the jewel of the Teaching, with the wealth of learning the collections and scriptures, who have penetrated the characteristics of indicated sounds and phrases, who are intelligent and pervading, such monks, great king, in the Blessed One's city of the Teaching are called 'Teaching millionaires'.

"But those monks, great king, who have penetrated the lofty teaching, who have practised the classification of objects and exposition, who have attained perfection in the virtues of training, such monks, great king, in the Blessed One's city of the Teaching are called 'famous righteous ones'.

"Thus well-arranged indeed, great king, is the Blessed One's city of the Teaching, thus well-built, thus well-provided, thus well-filled, thus well-established, thus well-protected, thus well-guarded, thus difficult to overcome by adversaries and enemies. By this reason, great king, by this cause, by this method, by this inference, it should be known: 'There is that Blessed One.'

"By such a hundred reasons, great king, by a thousand reasons, by a hundred causes, by a thousand causes, by a hundred methods, by a thousand methods, by a hundred similes, by a thousand similes, it is possible to show the Buddha's power. Just as, great king, a skilled garland-maker, from a heap of various flowers, by the teacher's instruction, by his own personal effort, might make a variegated heap of garland strings, just so indeed, great king, that Blessed One is like a variegated heap of flowers, of infinite virtues, of immeasurable virtues. I now, like a garland-maker in the Conqueror's Dispensation, a flower-binder, by the path of the former teachers and also by my own power of higher intelligence and also by incalculable reasons, by inference, will illuminate the Buddha's power; and you, arouse desire here for hearing."

"It is difficult, Venerable Nāgasena, for others to show the Buddha's power by such a reason, by inference. I am satisfied, Venerable Nāgasena, by your supremely variegated answering of questions."

The question on inference is the first.

2.

The Question on Ascetic Practices

Then King Milinda approached the Venerable Nāgasena; having approached, having paid respect to the Venerable Nāgasena, he sat down to one side. Seated to one side, King Milinda said this to the Venerable Nāgasena: "Venerable Nāgasena, is there any householder, a layman, enjoying sensual pleasures, dwelling in the confinement of wife and children, enjoying Kāsi sandalwood, wearing garlands, scents, and cosmetics, accepting gold and silver, bound with a topknot decorated with jewels, pearls, and gold, by whom the peaceful, ultimate reality, Nibbāna, has been realized?"

"Not just one hundred, great king, nor two hundred, nor three, four, five hundred, nor a thousand, nor a hundred thousand, nor a hundred crores, nor a thousand crores, nor a hundred thousand crores. Let alone, great king, the full realization of ten, twenty, a hundred, a thousand - by which method shall I give you the pursuit?"

"You yourself tell me that." "If so, great king, I will tell you by a hundred or by a thousand or by a hundred thousand or by a crore or by a hundred crores or by a thousand crores or by a hundred thousand crores - whatever discussions there are in the ninefold word of the Buddha, based on the virtues of austere conduct, practice, and excellent ascetic factors, all of them will come together here. Just as, great king, water rained down on low, high, even, uneven, dry land, and wet land regions, all that, having flowed from there, comes together into the great ocean, the sea, just so indeed, great king, when there is one who accomplishes, whatever discussions there are in the ninefold word of the Buddha, based on the virtues of austere conduct, practice, and ascetic factors, all of them will come together here.

"For me too here, great king, the illumination of reasons will come together through the experience of higher intelligence; thereby this meaning will be well-divided, variegated, complete, pure, and brought together. Just as, great king, a skilled writing teacher, having been instructed, presenting a document, completes the document by the illumination of reasons through his own experience of higher intelligence, thus that document will be complete, perfect, and not deficient. Just so for me too here, the illumination of reasons will come together through the experience of higher intelligence; thereby this meaning will be well-divided, variegated, complete, pure, and brought together.

"In the city of Sāvatthī, great king, about fifty million noble disciples, male and female lay followers of the Blessed One, fifty-seven thousand and three hundred thousand were established in the fruition of non-returning; all of them were indeed householders, not gone forth. Furthermore, right there at the foot of the Kaṇḍamba tree, at the Twin Miracle, twenty crores of living beings fully realized; furthermore, at the Exhortation to Rāhula the Lesser, at the Great Blessing Discourse, at the Exposition of Even-mindedness, at the Downfall Discourse, at the Before the Break-up Discourse, at the Quarrel and Dispute Discourse, at the Lesser Array Discourse, at the Greater Array Discourse, at the Quick Discourse, at the Sāriputta Discourse, there was the full realization of the Teaching by deities who had passed beyond the path of counting.

"In the city of Rājagaha there were fifty thousand and three hundred thousand noble disciples, male and female lay followers of the Blessed One; again right there at the taming of the noble elephant Dhanapāla, ninety koṭis of living beings; at the assembly at the Pārāyana at the Stone Shrine, fourteen koṭis of living beings; again in the Indasāla cave, eighty koṭis of deities; again at Bārāṇasī at Isipatana in the Deer Park at the first teaching of the Teaching, eighteen koṭis of Brahmās and immeasurable deities; again in the Tāvatiṃsa realm on the Paṇḍukambala stone at the teaching of the Higher Teaching, eighty koṭis of deities; at the descent of the god at the gate of the city of Saṅkassa at the wonder of the unveiling of the world, thirty koṭis of faithful humans and deities fully realised.

Again among the Sakyans at Kapilavatthu in the Nigrodha Monastery, at the teaching of the Chronicle of the Buddhas and at the teaching of the Great Assembly Discourse, there was the full realization of the teaching by deities who had passed beyond the path of counting. Again at the assembly of the garland-maker Sumana, at the assembly of Gahadinna, at the assembly of the millionaire Ānanda, at the assembly of the ājīvaka Jambuka, at the assembly of the young god Maṇḍuka, at the assembly of the young god Maṭṭhakuṇḍali, at the assembly of the city-belle Sulasā, at the assembly of the city-belle Sirimā, at the assembly of the weaver's daughter, at the assembly of Cūḷasubhaddā, at the assembly of the seeing of the cremation ground of the brahmin of Sāketa, at the assembly of Sūnāparantaka, at the assembly of Sakka's questions, at the assembly of the Outside the Walls, at the assembly of the Jewel Discourse, for each there was the full realization of the teaching by eighty-four thousand living beings. As long as, great king, the Blessed One stood in the world, so long in the three circles, in the sixteen great countries, wherever the Blessed One dwelt, there mostly two, three, four, five, a hundred, a thousand, a hundred thousand gods and humans realised the peaceful ultimate reality, Nibbāna. Those gods, great king, were householders indeed, they were not gone forth; these indeed, great king, and many other hundreds of thousands of koṭis of deities, householders, living in houses, enjoying sensual pleasures, realised the peaceful ultimate reality, Nibbāna."

"If, Venerable Nāgasena, householders living in houses, enjoying sensual pleasures, realise the peaceful ultimate reality, Nibbāna, then for what purpose do these ascetic practices accomplish, by that reason the ascetic practices do not accomplish their function. If, Venerable Nāgasena, diseases are appeased without spells and medicines, what is the use of weakening the body by vomiting, purging, and so on? If the suppression of enemies is accomplished with fists, what is the use of swords, spears, arrows, bows, crossbows, clubs, and hammers? If climbing a tree is accomplished by holding onto knotted, crooked, hollow, thorny creeper branches, what is the use of seeking a long, strong ladder? If balance of the bodily elements is accomplished by sleeping on the bare ground, what is the use of seeking a great, magnificent royal bed with pleasant touch? If one alone is capable of crossing a dangerous, frightening, uneven wilderness, what is the use of seeking a great, mighty, armed and equipped caravan? If one is capable of crossing a river lake with one's arms, what is the use of seeking a permanent bridge or boat? If one is able to provide food and clothing with one's own property, what is the use of serving others, pleasant conversation, running before and after? If one obtains water in an unexcavated lake, what is the use of digging wells, lakes, and lotus ponds? Just so indeed, Venerable Nāgasena, if householders living in houses, enjoying sensual pleasures, realise the peaceful ultimate reality, Nibbāna, what is the use of undertaking the excellent virtues of ascetic practice?"

"There are, great king, these twenty-eight virtues of the ascetic practices, virtues in accordance with truth, by which virtues the ascetic practices are desired and wished for by all Buddhas. Which twenty-eight? Here, great king, the ascetic practice is pure livelihood, has happiness as its fruit, is blameless, does not cause suffering to others, is fearless, is without oppression, is exclusively for growth, is not subject to decline, is without deceit, is protection, gives what is wished for, is the taming of all beings, is beneficial for restraint, is proper, is independent, is liberated, is the elimination of lust, is the elimination of hate, is the elimination of delusion, is the abandoning of conceit, is the cutting off of wrong thoughts, is the overcoming of uncertainty, is the destruction of idleness, is the abandoning of discontent, is patience, is incomparable, is immeasurable, is the going to the elimination of all suffering. These, great king, are the twenty-eight virtues of the ascetic practices, virtues in accordance with truth, by which virtues the ascetic practices are desired and wished for by all Buddhas.

"Those, great king, who rightly cultivate the virtues of ascetic practice, they become endowed with eighteen virtues. With which eighteen? Their conduct is well purified, their practice is well fulfilled, their bodily and verbal conduct is well guarded, their mental conduct is well purified, their energy is well aroused, fear is appeased, the view of self is departed, resentment is ceased, friendliness is established, food is fully understood, they are respected by all beings, they know moderation in food, they are devoted to wakefulness, they are without abode, wherever is comfortable there they dwell, they are ones who detest evil, they delight in seclusion, they are constantly diligent. Those, great king, who rightly cultivate the virtues of ascetic practice, they become endowed with these eighteen virtues.

"These are the ten persons worthy of the virtues of ascetic practice, great king. What are the ten? He has faith, has shame, has resolution, is without deceit, is master of the meaning, is not covetous, is eager to train, is firmly resolved, is abundant in non-fault-finding, and abides in friendliness - these, great king, are the ten persons worthy of the virtues of ascetic practice.

"Those householders living in houses, enjoying sensual pleasures, who realise the peaceful ultimate reality, Nibbāna, great king - all of them in previous births were skilled in archery and had done the groundwork in the thirteen virtues of ascetic practice; having purified their conduct and practice there, now today, while still being householders, they realise the peaceful ultimate reality, Nibbāna.

"Just as, great king, a skilled archer, having first trained his pupils in the training hall in the breaking of the bow, stringing the bow, grasping, pressing with the fist, bending the fingers, placing the feet, grasping the arrow, putting on armour, drawing back, holding steady, aiming at the target, and shooting, in piercing a straw figure, a heap of dung, a heap of straw and clay, and a wooden target, having accomplished the training in the presence of the king, obtains thoroughbred horses, chariots, elephants, horses, wealth, grain, gold, silver, female slaves, male slaves, a wife, and an excellent village - just so, great king, those householders living in houses, enjoying sensual pleasures, who realise the peaceful ultimate reality, Nibbāna - all of them in previous births were skilled in archery and had done the groundwork in the thirteen virtues of ascetic practice; having purified their conduct and practice right there, now today, while still being householders, they realise the peaceful ultimate reality, Nibbāna. Without previous practice in the virtues of ascetic practice, great king, there is no realisation of arahantship in just one birth; but with the highest energy, with the highest practice, with such a teacher, with a good friend, there is realisation of arahantship.

"Or else, great king, just as a physician, a surgeon, having pleased his teacher with wealth or with the practice of duties, having learned the procedures of grasping instruments, cutting, incising, piercing, extracting darts, washing wounds, drying, applying medicinal ointments, administering emetics, purgatives, and enemas, trained in the sciences, skilled in archery, practised in hand, approaches the sick for treatment, just so indeed, great king, those householders living in houses, enjoying sensual pleasures, who realise the peaceful ultimate reality, Nibbāna, all of them in former births have been trained and have done the groundwork in the thirteen virtues of ascetic practice; having purified their conduct and practice right there, now today, while still being householders, they realise the peaceful ultimate reality, Nibbāna. For those impure in the virtues of ascetic practice, great king, there is no full realization of the teaching.

"Just as, great king, without the watering of water there is no sprouting of seeds, just so indeed, great king, for those impure in the virtues of ascetic practice there is no full realization of the teaching.

"Or else, great king, just as for those who have not done what is wholesome, who have not done what is good, there is no going to a fortunate world, just so indeed, great king, for those impure in the virtues of ascetic practice there is no full realization of the teaching.

"Like the earth, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of being a support. Like water, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of washing away all the stains of mental defilements. Like fire, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of burning up the forest of all mental defilements. Like air, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of carrying away the dust and stains of all mental defilements. Like medicine, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of appeasing the disease of all mental defilements. Like the Deathless, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of destroying the poison of all mental defilements. Like a field, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of the growing of the crop of all the qualities of asceticism. Like a wish-fulfilling gem, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of giving the excellent boon of all wished-for and desired achievements. Like a boat, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of going to the far shore of the great ocean of the round of rebirths. Like a shelter for the fearful, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of giving comfort to those afraid of ageing and death. Like a mother, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of helping those oppressed by the suffering of mental defilements. Like a father, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, for those desiring the increase of what is wholesome, in the meaning of producing all the qualities of asceticism. Like a friend, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of not deceiving in the quest for all the qualities of asceticism. Like a lotus, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of being unstained by all the stains of mental defilements. Like the excellent fragrance of the four kinds, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of dispelling the bad odour of mental defilements. Like the excellent king of mountains, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of being unshakeable by the winds of the eight worldly conditions. Like space, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of being everywhere free from grasping, vast, extended, and great. Like a river, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of carrying away the stains of mental defilements. Like a good guide, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of crossing over the wilderness of birth and the thicket of the forest of mental defilements. Like a great caravan leader, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of leading to the city of Nibbāna, the excellent, noble, secure, fearless, empty of all fear. Like a well-polished spotless mirror, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of seeing the intrinsic nature of activities. Like a shield, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of warding off the cudgels, arrows, and spears of mental defilements. Like an umbrella, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of warding off the rain of mental defilements and the heat and burning of the three fires. Like the moon, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of being longed for and wished for. Like the sun, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of destroying the darkness and gloom of delusion. Like the ocean, great king, is the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification, in the meaning of being the source of the excellent jewels of the manifold qualities of asceticism, and in the meaning of being unlimited, incalculable, and immeasurable. Thus indeed, great king, the virtue of ascetic practice for those desiring purification is very helpful, dispelling all disturbance and fever, dispelling discontent, dispelling fear, dispelling becoming, dispelling barrenness, dispelling stain, dispelling sorrow, dispelling suffering, dispelling lust, dispelling hate, dispelling delusion, dispelling conceit, dispelling wrong view, dispelling all unwholesome mental states, bringing fame, bringing welfare, bringing happiness, making comfort, making joy, making freedom from bondage, blameless, having desirable and pleasant results, a heap of qualities, a mass of qualities, with unlimited, incalculable, immeasurable qualities, excellent, noble, supreme.

"Just as, great king, people use food for support, use medicine for welfare, use a friend for assistance, use a boat for crossing, use garlands and scents for fragrance, use a shelter for the fearful for safety, use the earth for foundation, use a teacher for craft, use a king for fame, use a jewel gem for granting desires, just so indeed, great king, the noble ones use the virtues of ascetic practice for bestowing all the qualities of asceticism.

"Or just as, great king, water is for the sprouting of seeds, fire is for burning, food is for bringing strength, a creeper is for binding, a knife is for cutting, drinking water is for removing thirst, a treasure is for giving comfort, a boat is for reaching the shore, medicine is for appeasing illness, a vehicle is for comfortable travel, a shelter for the fearful is for dispelling fear, a king is for the purpose of protection, a shield is for warding off sticks, clods, clubs, arrows and spears, a teacher is for instruction, a mother is for nurturing, a mirror is for looking, an ornament is for beautifying, cloth is for covering, a ladder is for ascending, a balance is for removing unevenness, a spell is for muttering, a weapon is for warding off threats, a lamp is for dispelling darkness, wind is for quenching fever, a craft is for producing livelihood, a drug is for protecting life, a mine is for producing jewels, a jewel is for adorning, a command is for not transgressing, sovereignty is for exercising control, just so indeed, great king, the virtues of ascetic practice are for the sprouting of the seed of asceticism, for burning the stain of defilements, for bringing the power of supernormal abilities, for binding the restraint of mindfulness, for eradicating doubt and uncertainty, for removing the thirst of craving, for giving comfort through full realisation, for crossing over the four floods, for appeasing the illness of defilements, for attaining the happiness of Nibbāna, for dispelling the fear of birth, ageing, illness, death, sorrow, lamentation, suffering, displeasure and anguish, for protecting the qualities of asceticism, for warding off discontent and evil thoughts, for instruction in the entire purpose of asceticism, for nurturing all the qualities of asceticism, for seeing serenity, insight, path, fruition and Nibbāna, for making greatly splendid what is praised and lauded by the entire world, for closing off all realms of misery, for ascending to the summit of the rock peak of the purpose of asceticism, for dispersing the crooked, bent and uneven mind, for making good recitation regarding what should and should not be practised, for threatening all defilements as enemies, for dispelling the darkness of ignorance, for quenching the heat and fever of the threefold fire, for producing smooth, subtle and peaceful attainments, for protecting all the qualities of asceticism, for producing the excellent jewel of the factors of enlightenment, for adorning practitioners, for not transgressing the blameless, subtle, refined, peaceful happiness, for exercising control over all the noble teachings of asceticism. Thus, great king, for the achievement of these qualities, that is to say, each and every virtue of ascetic practice, thus, great king, the virtues of ascetic practice are incomparable, immeasurable, matchless, without equal, without counterpart, without superior, higher, excellent, distinguished, exceeding, extended, broad, spread out, extensive, weighty, serious, great.

"Whatever person, great king, has evil desires, is overcome by desire, is deceitful, greedy, gluttonous, desirous of gain, desirous of fame, desirous of renown, inappropriate, unattained, unsuitable, unworthy, unfit, undertakes the ascetic practices, he incurs a twofold punishment, incurs the destruction of all qualities, obtains in the present life disdain, mockery, reproach, ridicule, rejection, non-eating, sending away, expulsion, banishment, exile; and in the future too, in the great Avīci hell measuring a hundred yojanas, encircled by garlands of hot, burning, scorching, blazing flames, for many hundreds of thousands of millions of years, throwing up foam, rolling about, going up, down and across, he is cooked; having been released from there, with thin, rough, black limbs and minor limbs, with swollen, bloated, hollow head, hungry, thirsty, with uneven, frightful form and appearance, with broken ears and hearing, with eyes opening and closing, with sore-covered, decaying body, with the whole body covered with worms, like a mass of fire burning in the wind, burning and blazing within, without shelter, without refuge, lamenting with weeping, crying, pitiful sounds, being one consumed by thirst, having become a great ghost of an ascetic, wandering about, he makes a cry of distress on the earth.

"Just as, great king, someone inappropriate, unattained, unsuitable, unworthy, unfit, low, of bad birth, consecrates himself with the warrior consecration, he obtains cutting off of the hand, cutting off of the foot, cutting off of hand and foot, cutting off of the ear, cutting off of the nose, cutting off of ear and nose, the gruel-pot torture, the shell-tonsure torture, the Rāhu's mouth torture, the fire-garland torture, the hand-torch torture, the grass-strip torture, the bark-dress torture, the antelope torture, the flesh-hook torture, the coin-cutting torture, the lye-pickling torture, the pivot-turning torture, the straw-chair torture, being sprinkled with boiling oil, being made to be eaten by dogs, impalement alive, beheading with a sword, and experiences various kinds of torture and punishment. Why? Inappropriate, unattained, unsuitable, unworthy, unfit, low, of bad birth, he placed himself in a position of great sovereignty, he transgressed the boundary; just so indeed, great king, whatever person has evil desires, etc. he makes a cry of distress on the earth.

"But, great king, whatever person is proper, fit, suitable, worthy, befitting, of few wishes, content, secluded, not in company, putting forth strenuous energy, resolute, honest, without deceit, not gluttonous, not desiring material gain, not desiring fame, not desiring renown, faithful, gone forth through faith, wishing to be released from ageing and death, undertakes the ascetic practices thinking 'I will uphold the Dispensation,' he deserves twofold veneration and is dear to the gods, agreeable, desired, wished for, like flowers of jasmine, Arabian jasmine and such to one who has bathed and anointed himself, like sumptuous food to one who is hungry, like cool, pure, fragrant drinking water to one who is thirsty, like excellent medicine to one afflicted by poison, like the finest excellent thoroughbred chariot to one wishing to travel swiftly, like a captivating gem jewel to one wishing for welfare, like a white, spotless, pure parasol to one wishing to be consecrated, like the unsurpassed achievement of the fruition of arahantship to one who loves the Teaching. For him the four establishments of mindfulness go to fulfilment through development, the four right strivings, the four bases for spiritual power, the five faculties, the five powers, the seven factors of enlightenment, the noble eightfold path go to fulfilment through development, serenity and insight meditation are attained, the practice of achievement matures, the four fruits of asceticism, the four analytical knowledges, the three true knowledges, the six higher knowledges, and the entire ascetic practice all become his domain, he is consecrated with the white, spotless, pure parasol of liberation.

"Just as, great king, when a king of the warrior caste, well-born of noble family, has been consecrated with the warrior consecration, soldiers and troops of his own country, market towns, and provinces attend upon him, and the thirty-eight royal retinues, dancers and actors, those who speak auspicious words at the face, those who speak blessings, groups of ascetics, brahmins, and all sectarians approach him, and whatever there is on earth - ports, jewel mines, cities, customs stations, foreign territories, punishments of cutting and breaking, and instruction of the people - everywhere he becomes the master, just so indeed, great king, whatever person is proper, fit, etc. he is consecrated with the white, spotless, pure parasol of liberation.

"There are these thirteen ascetic practices, great king, by which, having been purified, having entered the great ocean of Nibbāna, one sports in the manifold play of the Teaching, practises the eight attainments of the material and immaterial spheres, and attains the various kinds of supernormal power, the divine ear element, the knowledge of others' minds, the recollection of past lives, the divine eye, and the elimination of all mental corruptions. Which are the thirteen? The rag-robe wearer's practice, the three-robe wearer's practice, the almsfood eater's practice, the successive house-to-house alms goer's practice, the one-session eater's practice, the bowl-food eater's practice, the later-food-refuser's practice, the forest-dweller's practice, the tree-root dweller's practice, the open-air dweller's practice, the charnel-ground dweller's practice, the any-bed user's practice, the sitter's practice - by these thirteen virtues of ascetic practice, great king, previously cultivated, pursued, practised, thoroughly practised, followed, attended to, and fulfilled, one obtains the entire asceticism, and his domain are the entire peaceful and pleasant attainments.

"Just as, great king, a wealthy sailor, having properly paid the toll at the port, having entered the great ocean, goes to Vaṅga, Takkola, China, Sovīra, Suraṭṭha, Alasanda, Kolapaṭṭana, Suvaṇṇabhūmi, and to whatever other place boats travel, just so indeed, great king, by these thirteen virtues of ascetic practice previously cultivated, pursued, practised, thoroughly practised, followed, attended to, and fulfilled, one obtains the entire asceticism, and his domain are the entire peaceful and pleasant attainments.

"Just as, great king, a farmer, having first removed the field's defects - grass, sticks, and stones - having ploughed, having sown, having properly let in the water, having guarded, having protected, by reaping and threshing becomes one with abundant grain, and his domain are whatever poor, wretched, destitute, and unfortunate people there may be, just so indeed, great king, by these thirteen virtues of ascetic practice previously cultivated, etc. the entire peaceful and pleasant attainments.

"Or just as, great king, a warrior noble anointed on the head, of noble birth, is the lord in the instruction of people regarding cutting off and breaking, wielding power, the master, doing as he wishes, and the entire great earth is his domain, just so indeed, great king, by these thirteen virtues of ascetic practice previously cultivated, pursued, practised, thoroughly practised, followed, attended to, and fulfilled, one is the lord in the excellent Dispensation of the Conqueror, wielding power, the master, doing as he wishes, and the entire qualities of an ascetic are his domain.

"Is it not so, great king, that the Elder Upasena Vaṅgantaputta, not heeding the agreement of the monastic community at Sāvatthī because of his fulfilment of the virtues of ascetic practice of detachment, together with his following, having approached the charioteer of men to be tamed who had gone into seclusion, having paid homage with his head at the Blessed One's feet, sat down to one side, and the Blessed One, having looked at that well-disciplined assembly, joyful, satisfied, delighted, elated, having conversed in friendly talk with the assembly, with unbroken divine voice said this: 'This following of yours, Upasena, is pleasing. How did you, Upasena, train your following?' He too, when asked by the Omniscient One, the one of ten powers, the god above gods, by virtue of his true intrinsic qualities, said this to the Blessed One -

"Whoever, venerable sir, having approached me, requests the going forth or guidance, to him I say thus: 'I, friend, am a forest-dweller, an almsfood eater, a wearer of rag-robes, a three-robe wearer. If you too will be a forest-dweller, an almsfood eater, a wearer of rag-robes, a three-robe wearer, thus I will give you the going forth, I will give guidance.' If he, venerable sir, having promised me, rejoices and desists, thus I give him the going forth, I give guidance; if he does not rejoice, does not desist, I do not give him the going forth, I do not give guidance. Thus, venerable sir, I train my following." Thus indeed, great king, one who has undertaken the excellent virtues of ascetic practice is the lord in the excellent Dispensation of the Conqueror. Wielding power, the master, doing as he wishes, his domain are the entire peaceful and pleasant attainments.

"Just as, great king, a lotus, grown and pure, arising from the noble eastern origin, smooth, soft, desirable, fragrant, dear, wished for, praised, untainted by water and mud, adorned with fine petals, filaments and pericarp, frequented by swarms of bees, nourished by cool water, just so indeed, great king, by these thirteen virtues of ascetic practice previously cultivated, pursued, practised, thoroughly practised, followed, attended to, and fulfilled, a noble disciple is endowed with thirty excellent qualities.

"With which thirty excellent qualities? He is one with a smooth, soft, gentle, and friendly mind; he is one whose mental defilements are slain, killed, and destroyed; he is one whose conceit is slain and struck down, who is capable; he is one of unshakeable, firm, established, undoubting faith; he is one who obtains complete, satisfied, delighted, desirable, peaceful, pleasant attainments; he is one pervaded by the excellent, noble, incomparable, pure fragrance of morality; he is dear and agreeable to gods and humans; he is wished for by those who have eliminated the mental corruptions, by noble, excellent persons; he is saluted and venerated by gods and humans; he is praised, extolled, lauded, and commended by the wise, the learned, and the wise people; whether here or beyond, he is untainted by the world; he is one who sees danger even in the slightest fault; he is one who accomplishes the excellent purpose of path and fruition for those desiring abundant excellent achievements; he is one who partakes of requested, abundant, sublime requisites; he is one who sleeps without a home; he is one who dwells in the excellent abiding absorbed in meditative absorption; he is one whose basis of the net of mental defilements is unravelled; he is one whose hindrances to destinations are broken, shattered, shrivelled, and cut off; he is one of unshakeable nature; he is one whose dwelling is well-conducted; he is one who enjoys what is blameless; he is one liberated from destinations; he is one who has crossed over all doubt; he is one whose purpose is absorbed in liberation; he is one who has seen the Teaching; he is one who has reached the unshakeable, firm refuge for the fearful; he is one whose underlying tendencies are cut off; he has attained the elimination of all mental corruptions; he is one who dwells much in peaceful, pleasant attainment; he is endowed with all the qualities of an ascetic; he is endowed with these thirty excellent qualities.

"Is it not so, great king, that the Elder Sāriputta was the foremost person in the ten-thousand-fold world system, setting aside the one of ten powers, the teacher of the world? He too, having accumulated wholesome roots over immeasurable, incalculable aeons, of noble birth in a brahmin family, having abandoned agreeable sensual delight and wealth counted in many hundreds, having gone forth in the Conqueror's Dispensation, having tamed body, speech, and mind by these thirteen virtues of ascetic practice, has now today become one endowed with infinite qualities, one who keeps turning the wheel of the Teaching in the excellent Dispensation of the Blessed One Gotama. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One, the god above gods, in the excellent seal of the Ekuttara Collection:

"I do not, monks, perceive any other single person who thus rightly keeps turning the unsurpassed wheel of the Teaching that was set in motion by the Tathāgata as does, monks, Sāriputta. Sāriputta, monks, rightly keeps turning the unsurpassed wheel of the Teaching that was set in motion by the Tathāgata."

"Good, venerable Nāgasena, whatever ninefold word of the Buddha there is, whatever supramundane function there is, whatever abundant excellent achievements there are in the world, all that is contained in the thirteen virtues of ascetic practice."

The question on ascetic practices is the second.

The Chapter on Inference is the fourth.

6.

The Question About Similes

The Matrix

Venerable Nāgasena, possessed of how many factors does a monk realize arahantship?

Here, great king, by a monk wishing to realize arahantship –

One factor of the donkey should be adopted.

Five factors of the cock should be adopted.

One factor of the squirrel should be adopted.

One factor of the female panther should be adopted.

Two factors of the panther should be adopted.

Five factors of the tortoise should be adopted.

One factor of the bamboo should be adopted.

One factor of the bow should be adopted.

Two factors of the crow should be adopted.

Two factors of the monkey should be adopted.

The Donkey Chapter is the first.

One factor of the gourd creeper should be adopted.

Three factors of the lotus should be adopted.

Two factors of the seed should be adopted.

One factor of the sal tree should be adopted.

Three factors of the boat should be adopted.

Two factors of the anchor should be adopted.

One factor of the mast should be adopted.

Three factors of the helmsman should be adopted.

One factor of the labourer should be adopted.

Five factors of the ocean should be adopted.

The Ocean Chapter is the second.

Five factors of the earth should be adopted.

Five factors of water should be adopted.

Five factors of fire should be adopted.

Five factors of wind should be adopted.

Five factors of the mountain should be adopted.

Five factors of space should be adopted.

Five factors of the moon should be adopted.

Seven factors of the sun should be adopted.

Three factors of Sakka should be adopted.

Four factors of a wheel-turning monarch should be adopted.

The Earth Chapter is the third.

One factor of a termite should be adopted.

Two factors of a cat should be adopted.

One factor of a rat should be adopted.

One factor of a scorpion should be adopted.

One factor of a mongoose should be adopted.

Two factors of an old jackal should be adopted.

Three factors of a deer should be adopted.

Four factors of a bull should be adopted.

Two factors of a boar should be adopted.

Five factors of an elephant should be adopted.

The Termite Chapter is the fourth.

Seven factors of a lion should be adopted.

Three factors of a ruddy goose should be adopted.

Two factors of a heron should be adopted.

One factor of a house pigeon should be adopted.

Two factors of an owl should be adopted.

One factor of a woodpecker should be adopted.

Two factors of a bat should be adopted.

One factor of a leech should be adopted.

Three factors of a snake should be adopted.

One factor of a boa constrictor should be adopted.

The Lion Chapter is the fifth.

One factor of a road spider should be adopted.

One factor of a child attached to the breast should be adopted.

One factor of a painted-shell tortoise should be adopted.

Five factors of the wind should be adopted.

Three factors of a tree should be adopted.

Five factors of a cloud should be adopted.

Three factors of a jewel gem should be adopted.

Four factors of a hunter should be adopted.

Two factors of a fisherman should be adopted.

Two factors of a carpenter should be adopted.

The Monkey Chapter is the sixth.

One factor of a water-pot should be adopted.

Two factors of iron should be adopted.

Three factors of an umbrella should be adopted.

Three factors of a field should be adopted.

Two factors of medicine should be adopted.

Three factors of food should be adopted.

Four factors of an archer should be adopted.

The Water-pot Chapter is the seventh.

Four factors of a king should be adopted.

Two factors of a doorkeeper should be adopted.

One factor of a grindstone should be adopted.

Two factors of a lamp should be adopted.

Two factors of a peacock should be adopted.

Two factors of a horse should be adopted.

Two factors of a distiller should be adopted.

Two factors of a gate post should be adopted.

One factor of a scale should be adopted.

Two factors of a sword should be adopted.

Two factors of a fish should be adopted.

One factor of a debtor should be adopted.

Two factors of a sick person should be adopted.

Two factors of a dead person should be adopted.

Two factors of a river should be adopted.

One factor of a leading bull should be adopted.

Two factors of a path should be adopted.

One factor of a toll collector should be adopted.

Three factors of a thief should be adopted.

One factor of a hawk should be adopted.

One factor of a dog should be adopted.

Three factors of a physician should be adopted.

Two factors of a pregnant woman should be adopted.

One factor of a yak should be adopted.

Two factors of a blue jay should be adopted.

Three factors of a female dove should be adopted.

Two factors of a one-eyed person should be adopted.

Three factors of a farmer should be adopted.

One factor of a female jackal should be adopted.

Two factors of a sieve should be adopted.

One factor of a ladle should be adopted.

Three factors of a debt collector should be adopted.

One factor of an investigator should be adopted.

Two factors of a charioteer should be adopted.

Two factors of a revenue collector should be adopted.

One factor of a tailor should be adopted.

One factor of a sailor should be adopted.

Two factors of a wasp should be adopted.

The Matrix is concluded.

1.

The Chapter on the Donkey

1.

The Question on the Donkey's Quality

1. "Venerable Nāgasena, as for what you say 'one factor of the donkey should be adopted', which is that one factor to be adopted?" "Just as, great king, a donkey lies down wherever anywhere - on a rubbish heap, at a crossroads, at a junction, at a village gate, on a heap of chaff - and is not given to much sleeping, just so indeed, great king, by one who practises meditation, by one devoted to meditation, having spread out a piece of leather wherever anywhere - on a grass mat, on a leaf mat, on a wooden bed, on the ground - one should lie down wherever anywhere, and one should not be given to much sleeping. This, great king, is the one factor of the donkey to be adopted. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One, the god above gods: 'Using wooden pillows, monks, at present my disciples dwell diligent, ardent in striving.' This too was spoken, great king, by the elder Sāriputta, the General of the Teaching -

The Question on the Donkey's Quality is the first.

2.

The Question on the Cock's Quality

2. "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'five factors of the cock should be adopted.' What are those five factors to be adopted?" "Just as, great king, a cock goes into seclusion at the proper time, even so, great king, by one who practises meditation, by one devoted to meditation, at the proper time, having swept the shrine courtyard, having set out drinking water and water for washing, having looked after the body, having bathed, having paid homage to the shrine, having gone to see the senior monks, at the proper time one should enter an empty house. This, great king, is the first factor of the cock to be adopted.

"Furthermore, great king, a cock rises at the proper time. Even so, great king, by one who practises meditation, by one devoted to meditation, having risen at the proper time, having swept the shrine courtyard, having set out drinking water and water for washing, having looked after the body, having paid homage to the shrine, one should enter an empty house again. This, great king, is the second factor of the cock to be adopted.

"Furthermore, great king, a cock, having scratched and scratched the earth, swallows food. Even so, great king, by one who practises meditation, by one devoted to meditation, having reviewed again and again, food should be swallowed: 'Not for amusement, not for intoxication, not for adornment, not for beautification, only for the presence and sustenance of this body, for the cessation of harm, for the support of the holy life, thus: "I shall ward off the old feeling and shall not give rise to a new feeling, and there will be for me progress, blamelessness, and comfortable dwelling."' This, great king, is the third factor of the cock to be adopted. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One, the god above gods -

"Furthermore, great king, a cock, though having eyes, is blind at night. Even so, great king, by one who practises meditation, by one devoted to meditation, though not blind, one should be as if blind; even in the forest, even in the village as food resort, even while walking for almsfood, regarding enticing forms, sounds, odours, flavours, tangible objects and mental phenomena, one should be as if blind, deaf, and mute; one should not grasp at signs, one should not grasp at features. This, great king, is the fourth factor of the cock to be adopted. This too was spoken, great king, by the elder Mahākaccāyana -

"Furthermore, great king, a cock, even when being struck with clods, sticks, clubs and mallets, does not abandon its own home. Even so, great king, by one who practises meditation, by one devoted to meditation, even while doing robe-making work, even while doing new construction work, even while performing duties and counter-duties, even while reciting, even while making others recite, wise attention should not be abandoned; for this, great king, is the practitioner's own home, that is to say, wise attention. This, great king, is the fifth factor of the cock to be adopted. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One, the god above gods: 'And what, monks, is a monk's own resort, his own paternal domain? That is to say, the four establishments of mindfulness.' This too was spoken, great king, by the elder Sāriputta, the General of the Teaching -

The Question on the Cock's Quality is the second.

3.

The Question on the Squirrel's Quality

3. "Venerable Nāgasena, as for what you say 'one factor of the squirrel should be adopted', which is that one factor to be adopted?" "Just as, great king, a squirrel, when an enemy attacks, having spread out its tail and made it large, wards off the enemy with that very tail-cudgel, even so, great king, by one who practises meditation, by one devoted to meditation, when the enemy of defilements attacks, having spread out the cudgel of the establishment of mindfulness and made it large, all defilements should be warded off with that very cudgel of the establishment of mindfulness. This, great king, is the one factor of the squirrel to be adopted. This too was spoken, great king, by the elder Cūḷapanthaka -

The Question on the Squirrel's Quality is the third.

4.

The Question on the Female Panther's Quality

4. "Venerable Nāgasena, as for what you say 'one factor of the female panther should be adopted', which is that one factor to be adopted?" "Just as, great king, a female panther conceives an embryo only once, and does not go to a male again and again, even so, great king, by one who practises meditation, by one devoted to meditation, having seen in the future conception, rebirth, lying in a womb, death, dissolution, destruction, ruin, the fear of wandering in the round of rebirths, unfortunate realms, unevenness, and oppression, wise attention should be made thus: 'I shall not take conception again in renewed existence.' This, great king, is the one factor of the female panther to be adopted. This too was spoken, great king, by the Blessed One, the god above gods, in the Dhaniya the Cowherd Discourse in the Suttanipāta:

The Question on the Female Panther's Quality is the fourth.

5.

The Question on the Panther's Quality

5. "Venerable Nāgasena, you say 'two factors of the panther should be adopted.' What are those two factors to be adopted?" "Just as, great king, a panther, having hidden in a thicket of grass or a jungle thicket or a mountain thicket in the forest, catches deer, just so indeed, great king, by one who practises meditation, by one devoted to meditation, seclusion should be cultivated - a forest, the root of a tree, a mountain, a grotto, a mountain cave, a cemetery, a deep forest, an open space, a heap of straw - with little noise, with little disturbance, with an atmosphere of solitude, remote from people, suitable for seclusion. For cultivating seclusion, great king, one who practises meditation, one devoted to meditation, before long attains mastery in the six higher knowledges. This, great king, is the first factor of the panther to be adopted. This too was spoken, great king, by the elder monks who compiled the scriptures -